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600-series Proterra BE40 - Deliveries & Assignments


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Better pictures I just taken ūüĎćūüŹĺ

Testing @ Navy Pier

I work there bud and I've been told that no one is allowed to be in that area other than supervision with there certified cars and buses pulling in from runs. You were well passed the entrance based o

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10 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

We got a first this morning. Three #600's are currently on the #66. Yesterday I didnt see a #600 on run #816. Maybe they are making up for yesterday.

Today they got 816 with 805 so now they got 808 as well coolūü§©

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On 4/9/2021 at 1:00 PM, jajuan said:

 

Given how hard it is to get transit capital projects funded even when local, state and the federal governments can get past partisan arguments long enough to get things done, I still say that personally I think the 2030 goal (LA County Metro), 2035 goal (MUNI and some other transit operators). and even the 2040 goal of our own CTA and some others are still somewhat overly optimistic. For one thing, the bus purchases have to be funded. CTA hasn't always been financially stable on that front, which is why it's used purchase piggybacks on existing contracts from other operators to obtain NF artics 4150-4207 and the NF hybrid and diesel LFR models that make up the 4300s. It's also why CTA started the policy of running bus models through rehabilitation programs to extend their useful lives beyond the FTA standard of 12 years. Even when CTA does get newer buses, it takes a heck of a long time for it completely retire older bus series. In fact, the rehabbing of buses and the slow rate at which CTA puts out its own contract awards for new buses worked together to allow CTA to fall back into habit of holding on to bus models for 20 years or more when at the time it retired off the Americanas and soon after it acquired the ill fated 7500s and after that the 1000s, its stated goal and policy was not to do that anymore and keep average bus age from getting as high as it was during the Americanas' retirement. Now we have the 6400s still around after just under 20 years when the base order of 7900s and the 4300s together should have knocked them off a few years ago. The NF 1000s are on average range 12 to 15 years in age, and the 4000s among the artics are already easing into that 12 year range. All that doesn't get into the fact that the CTA needs to have charging stations installed not only all its garages but also every bus terminal and layover point across the city. And as CTA5750 and others have mentioned, the technology of the buses themselves are still pretty much prototype status and not yet a full proven technology. Pace has at least taken a more realistic path of moving over to CNG buses, which have been a proven bus technology for decades.

 

Los Angeles Metro and San Diego MTS have a completely equipped 100 percent alternative fuel fleet. San Diego just retired its last diesel bus only recently. I think CNG, as what Pace is doing would have been a better alternative. This electric vehicle technology is taking way too long to implement. Politics no doubt has a heavy hand in it! Depending on the party, will only complicate things more!  

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30 minutes ago, CTA5750 said:

Los Angeles Metro and San Diego MTS have a completely equipped 100 percent alternative fuel fleet. San Diego just retired its last diesel bus only recently. I think CNG, as what Pace is doing would have been a better alternative. This electric vehicle technology is taking way too long to implement. Politics no doubt has a heavy hand in it! Depending on the party, will only complicate things more!  

Politically electric vehicles have a chance as that's what Biden wants to happen. There is going to be a ripple effect as less oil is needed. What do you tell all the oil riggers in the gulf, sorry we no longer need you. That's alot of jobs especially for the gulf states. That is most likely the leading industry down there (unless its driving). I can't help but think how that will devastate their economy but it will just be a regional problem. When automation comes to the driving industry, a leading jobs producer in over half of all us states then what do you do? Was at my local Walmart the other day, they seem to have barely any cashiers. What do kids do nowadays for a summer job? 

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2 hours ago, CTA5750 said:

Los Angeles Metro and San Diego MTS have a completely equipped 100 percent alternative fuel fleet. San Diego just retired its last diesel bus only recently. I think CNG, as what Pace is doing would have been a better alternative. This electric vehicle technology is taking way too long to implement. Politics no doubt has a heavy hand in it! Depending on the party, will only complicate things more!  

Well, it also helps that they're located in California, where 2 of the 4 north american bus manufacturers have factories and had a head-start on converting to an all CNG fleet. I do agree CTA should've been looking into CNG a while ago (probably around when they opened 74th)

Somewhat related, even with the hassle of implementing all electric fleets (and I think the current expected timelines are too ambitious) 1 diesel bus is still better however many cars it's equivalent too. Some of the people advocating for all electric fleets don't realize non-wired buses really didn't get jumping until about 6-8 years ago. Electric buses were still mostly a concept and very untested back in 2013. And some people think we should be making changes overnight. Agencies aren't really going to start heading towards these 2040 deadlines until about 2028-2030.

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28 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Well, it also helps that they're located in California, where 2 of the 4 north american bus manufacturers have factories and had a head-start on converting to an all CNG fleet. I do agree CTA should've been looking into CNG a while ago (probably around when they opened 74th)

Somewhat related, even with the hassle of implementing all electric fleets (and I think the current expected timelines are too ambitious) 1 diesel bus is still better however many cars it's equivalent too. Some of the people advocating for all electric fleets don't realize non-wired buses really didn't get jumping until about 6-8 years ago. Electric buses were still mostly a concept and very untested back in 2013. And some people think we should be making changes overnight. Agencies aren't really going to start heading towards these 2040 deadlines until about 2028-2030.

Is a sad reality! With computers taking over!!!  Were going to see a devastating change in the economy and jobs in a few years! I like Biden, but I dont like it that he is pursuing alternatives to diesel and gas. I am not a fan of self driving cars or trucks!!! I think thats one area that shouldnt be tampered with. It seems with every improvement that supposedly makes our lives easier..... also puts more people out of work! Look at how online shopping has obliterated stores and changed the way we shop! In a few years shopping malls and other places we still need, will one day be a part of history!!! Shopping malls are dying!!! I blame online shopping! Transit and transportation as a whole will be changed the same way! Thats  Not good!!! I dont like how computers are taking over our everyday lives!  This "Elon Musk"  mentality is slowly killing working class people!   

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49 minutes ago, CTA5750 said:

Is a sad reality! With computers taking over!!!  Were going to see a devastating change in the economy and jobs in a few years! I like Biden, but I dont like it that he is pursuing alternatives to diesel and gas. I am not a fan of self driving cars or trucks!!! I think thats one area that shouldnt be tampered with. It seems with every improvement that supposedly makes our lives easier..... also puts more people out of work! Look at how online shopping has obliterated stores and changed the way we shop! In a few years shopping malls and other places we still need, will one day be a part of history!!! Shopping malls are dying!!! I blame online shopping! Transit and transportation as a whole will be changed the same way! Thats  Not good!!! I dont like how computers are taking over our everyday lives!  This "Elon Musk"  mentality is slowly killing working class people!   

Exactly. You can’t hack a human driver. Humans don’t have a centralized server that can crash or glitch up

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1 hour ago, CTA5750 said:

Is a sad reality! With computers taking over!!!  Were going to see a devastating change in the economy and jobs in a few years! I like Biden, but I dont like it that he is pursuing alternatives to diesel and gas. I am not a fan of self driving cars or trucks!!! I think thats one area that shouldnt be tampered with. It seems with every improvement that supposedly makes our lives easier..... also puts more people out of work! Look at how online shopping has obliterated stores and changed the way we shop! In a few years shopping malls and other places we still need, will one day be a part of history!!! Shopping malls are dying!!! I blame online shopping! Transit and transportation as a whole will be changed the same way! Thats  Not good!!! I dont like how computers are taking over our everyday lives!  This "Elon Musk"  mentality is slowly killing working class people!   

People and businesses share one thing in common.  They all want to spend as little as possible and save as much money as possible.   Online shopping satisfies all.  Companies can lower overhead and labor costs. Which means they can offer lower prices to consumers.  Consumers don't have to pay for that overhead and can also save money by not driving.   

Online shopping gas spawned New industries like Uber, Doordarshan, Amazon, Alternative fuels gained traction when gasoline prices soared above $4 a gallon during the Obama administration.   Combine that with more stringent EPA guidelines  which also increases the cost of all transportation modes 

I don't want to see self driving cars, buses, trucks, or planes.  We already have automated trains (people movers).  The only real danger left is robots, and McDonald's is experimenting  with those 

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1 hour ago, CTA5750 said:

Is a sad reality! With computers taking over!!!  Were going to see a devastating change in the economy and jobs in a few years! I like Biden, but I dont like it that he is pursuing alternatives to diesel and gas. I am not a fan of self driving cars or trucks!!! I think thats one area that shouldnt be tampered with. It seems with every improvement that supposedly makes our lives easier..... also puts more people out of work! Look at how online shopping has obliterated stores and changed the way we shop! In a few years shopping malls and other places we still need, will one day be a part of history!!! Shopping malls are dying!!! I blame online shopping! Transit and transportation as a whole will be changed the same way! Thats  Not good!!! I dont like how computers are taking over our everyday lives!  This "Elon Musk"  mentality is slowly killing working class people!   

I'll say that there do need to be alternatives to diesel and gas, and our reliance on them needs to be cut gradually, but drastically. It's killing the planet, and the less usage of them, the better.

21 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

People and businesses share one thing in common.  They all want to spend as little as possible and save as much money as possible.   Online shopping satisfies all.  Companies can lower overhead and labor costs. Which means they can offer lower prices to consumers.  Consumers don't have to pay for that overhead and can also save money by not driving.   

Online shopping gas spawned New industries like Uber, Doordarshan, Amazon, Alternative fuels gained traction when gasoline prices soared above $4 a gallon during the Obama administration.   Combine that with more stringent EPA guidelines  which also increases the cost of all transportation modes 

I don't want to see self driving cars, buses, trucks, or planes.  We already have automated trains (people movers).  The only real danger left is robots, and McDonald's is experimenting  with those 

Well, 80% of plane operations are autopilot, so maybe a bit too late on that one. And there's definitely going to be more of a bus for ATC on trains (heck, WMATA was doing just fine with it for years). I agree that fully self-driving cars, buses and trucks shouldn't be the end goal, or widely spread. For however fictional it was, F8 of the Furious showed us the potential dangers of such widespread use of that technology.

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52 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

People and businesses share one thing in common.  They all want to spend as little as possible and save as much money as possible.   Online shopping satisfies all.  Companies can lower overhead and labor costs. Which means they can offer lower prices to consumers.  Consumers don't have to pay for that overhead and can also save money by not driving.   

Online shopping gas spawned New industries like Uber, Doordarshan, Amazon, Alternative fuels gained traction when gasoline prices soared above $4 a gallon during the Obama administration.   Combine that with more stringent EPA guidelines  which also increases the cost of all transportation modes 

I don't want to see self driving cars, buses, trucks, or planes.  We already have automated trains (people movers).  The only real danger left is robots, and McDonald's is experimenting  with those 

All I can say is "God Help Us"!  Seriously! Maybe Im a dinosaur about these things  But its what I believe! I know gas prices suck! I understand labor costs and companies bottom line. I get all that.... But at the same time its a job killer! More people will be out of work or working for chump change!  Im fine with the airport automated trains. But I wish they would leave it at that. I hate to see mainline trains begin this world of driverless operation. I know BART in SF does that. But they still keep an operator in the cab. 

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1 hour ago, Sam92 said:

Exactly. You can’t hack a human driver. Humans don’t have a centralized server that can crash or glitch up

And with this whole new world of computer hacking.  It will only lead to more problems than any top nuclear physicist or computer genius would be able to solve! 

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31 minutes ago, CTA5750 said:

And with this whole new world of computer hacking.  It will only lead to more problems than any top nuclear physicist or computer genius would be able to solve! 

What's scary is the weaponization of computers. If that gets in the wrong hands, its goodbye george!! I was watching a documentary where one of the middle east country's were able to land an american drone fully in tact. Now they can study it and have their own drones to do whatever. You dont need a suicide bomber if there is no human. 

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48 minutes ago, CTA5750 said:

All I can say is "God Help Us"!  Seriously! Maybe Im a dinosaur about these things  But its what I believe! I know gas prices suck! I understand labor costs and companies bottom line. I get all that.... But at the same time its a job killer! More people will be out of work or working for chump change!  Im fine with the airport automated trains. But I wish they would leave it at that. I hate to see mainline trains begin this world of driverless operation. I know BART in SF does that. But they still keep an operator in the cab. 

To be fair, not sure about BART, but I thought they've been doing that for a while, and WMATA did the same thing for a number of years. Somewhere in Canada, a new light rail project (can't remember where) will have the same type of set-up for the underground portion of the route.

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