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Up to 45 Electric Buses

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17 minutes ago, Nova's at 103rd said:

Will there be a charging station at 63rd and Stony Island because if so will the YMCA allow this on the outside of it's property, or is it city property.

Also the Proterra's are on back order due to not being able to manufactured right now.

Plus if 74th will get Proterra's then maybe 54B should be sent to 74th so 63rd and South Cicero can be at one garage and not have a bus bay at Midway for 2 buses who serve the same station but different garages.

Shouldn't 79th be discussed as one going electric or is it just to busy during times.

Chicago won a grant this year to purchase 30 electric buses from Proterra, which is headquartered in Silicon Valley but has manufacturing plants in L.A. and South Carolina. Proterra has been rapidly expanding. It has reportedly been overwhelmed with orders.From https://usa.streetsblog.org/2018/12/07/why-are-we-still-waiting-for-electric-buses/

It is strange that 54B runs out of Chicago as opposed to Kedzie or 74th

Did I miss something? When was the 79 under consideration for electrification?

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5 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

It is strange that 54B runs out of Chicago as opposed to Kedzie or 74th

Did I miss something? When was the 79 under consideration for electrification?

I was just stating since the 66 was going electric shouldn't 79 at least be considered

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So Proterra got the contract in June, 2018 and all has gone quiet... when should we be seeing a prototype and delivery of these buses?

 

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3 hours ago, sw4400 said:

So Proterra got the contract in June, 2018 and all has gone quiet... when should we be seeing a prototype and delivery of these buses?

 

@Nova's at 103rd mentioned this in his last post, Proterra is backed up with orders, a bus might not arrive until late 2019. They have two manufacturing plants, but I also believe the buses are delivered by truck, which increases delivery time

https://www.masstransitmag.com/home/press-release/12393848/eb-start-consulting-electric-bus-sales-to-public-transit-agencies-nearly-doubles-in-2017

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4 hours ago, Nova's at 103rd said:

I was just stating since the 66 was going electric shouldn't 79 at least be considered

I'd call the 66 and the 63 too heavy for electrification myself, but I don't work at CTA and I'm not in the field either, so they clearly know more than me. From my outside perspective, the Proterra's would've gone to a garage with a multitude of small buses routes in which many of them share a common terminal. 74th, North Park & arguably 103rd fit this. However, based on what we know, chargers will be at 74th & Chicago and I don't see them moving the 79 to 74th just for electrics.

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1 hour ago, sw4400 said:

I really don't know about these Proterras which we have yet to see, honestly. This article was from January, 2019...

https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2019/01/electric-bus-battery-recharge-new-flyer-byd-proterra-beb/577954/

I mean, I don't think Proterra has had a major issue yet. And the ABQ incidient is the only one I can think of for BYD in America. Indianapolis & Antelope Valley seem just fine with their BYD artics

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50 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

I mean, I don't think Proterra has had a major issue yet. And the ABQ incidient is the only one I can think of for BYD in America. Indianapolis & Antelope Valley seem just fine with their BYD artics

LA Metro.....

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On 3/17/2019 at 2:55 PM, NewFlyerMCI said:

Didn't even realize they had any. I guess only 5 months will do that. Article for those who want to read more:

https://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-electric-buses-20180520-story.html

Yeah I wouldnt buy from  byd. They have had issues in the past. The proterras have issues too. I think it's the tech. It still has kinks. Better to buy hybrid buses at least they are proven tech. If they want to go zero emissions they need to look at alternative fuels like cng. Pace seems to be doing ok. Cta wont go there though after its history of fires in the garage. 

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15 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah I wouldnt buy from  byd. They have had issues in the past. The proterras have issues too. I think it's the tech. It still has kinks. Better to buy hybrid buses at least they are proven tech. If they want to go zero emissions they need to look at alternative fuels like cng. Pace seems to be doing ok. Cta wont go there though after its history of fires in the garage. 

Yeah, all-electrics still need lots of refinement to be used for everyday, long run use. Issues found out include stalling on hills, problems in extreme cold and heat(both common in Chicago), problems with long routes(Ashland and Irving Park, among others would be difficult for them) and charge time causes delays.

I think for the forseeable future, CTA should just consider going with Clean Diesel and Diesel-Electric Hybrids. Proven units that will work the routes. Continue to get small amounts of All-Electric to test and refine, but when it comes time for the New Flyers to begin phaseout, I think unless All-Electric is really refined for long routing and extreme heat and cold, CTA should just stick with what works.

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1 hour ago, sw4400 said:

Yeah, all-electrics still need lots of refinement to be used for everyday, long run use. Issues found out include stalling on hills, problems in extreme cold and heat(both common in Chicago), problems with long routes(Ashland and Irving Park, among others would be difficult for them) and charge time causes delays.

I think for the forseeable future, CTA should just consider going with Clean Diesel and Diesel-Electric Hybrids. Proven units that will work the routes. Continue to get small amounts of All-Electric to test and refine, but when it comes time for the New Flyers to begin phaseout, I think unless All-Electric is really refined for long routing and extreme heat and cold, CTA should just stick with what works.

Yeah it's really an out there statement to say cta will go all electric by 2040. That's putting the cart before the horse. If the nfs are having issues and they make tons of buses then how does a smaller company succeed? The problem with proterra and byd is that that is mostly all they make so if it screws up your company could be in jeopardy. Not good to put all your eggs in one basket. Now places like proterra have to produce they have alot of orders. Now its tempting to cut corners but they have to be careful and build the buses right do there research and buy quality parts or it could bankrupt them. Remember nabi? 

Alot of the problems are electric cars are not running 24/7 doing massive miles maybe as much as 100k a year if running 24/7. But electric cars have problems in the cold. Batteries discharge under extreme cold or they could explode under extreme heat. Even though you may get x amount of miles as charged you dont because of this. Batteries are expensive 8 to 12k in a car. I dont want to know what a bus battery costs. But if you charge and charge and charge the battery will wear out faster. If allowed to fully discharge you could cause the battery cells to start failing. 

Probably what they really need fo do is start slow. Get an eldorko type electric  bus and use it on the lighter stuff routes that run maybe 10 hrs a day. Some cta routes are grueling like the 77 or 79. How do they expect an electric bus to run that. 

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55 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Probably what they really need fo do is start slow. Get an eldorko type electric  bus and use it on the lighter stuff routes that run maybe 10 hrs a day. Some cta routes are grueling like the 77 or 79. How do they expect an electric bus to run that. 

That's why all the conflicting statements about where chargers and stuff was going to go was confused. Put it at Navy Pier and you can really only run the 124, maybe the 2. Same thing with the 63. When I first heard about Proterras with chargers, my thought was 95th, especially b/c of the new terminal or Midway, where you have plenty of short-haul routes that the buses can be used on interchangeably. 

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10 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

That's why all the conflicting statements about where chargers and stuff was going to go was confused. Put it at Navy Pier and you can really only run the 124, maybe the 2. Same thing with the 63. When I first heard about Proterras with chargers, my thought was 95th, especially b/c of the new terminal or Midway, where you have plenty of short-haul routes that the buses can be used on interchangeably. 

Yeah but that was never cta's intention. They intend to run them hard on busy routes. It's ok if they work. Navy pier could have had the 29 124 2 65 66 so they could have spread buses around the city with the emphasis on downtown. Running them in one part of the city and not running them in a central district doesnt really show them off. How can they gauge any kind of input public or technical running them in a isolated environment? 

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20 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

That's why all the conflicting statements about where chargers and stuff was going to go was confused. Put it at Navy Pier and you can really only run the 124, maybe the 2. Same thing with the 63. When I first heard about Proterras with chargers, my thought was 95th, especially b/c of the new terminal or Midway, where you have plenty of short-haul routes that the buses can be used on interchangeably. 

If they want to go all-electric by 2040, best thing to do is put a few electric buses on long routes like Ashland, Irving Park or Belmont to really test the reliability of them on longer routes. Navy Pier is nice, but we need a long-route test to see how the bus really performs.

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22 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah but that was never cta's intention. They intend to run them hard on busy routes. It's ok if they work. Navy pier could have had the 29 124 2 65 66 so they could have spread buses around the city with the emphasis on downtown. Running them in one part of the city and not running them in a central district doesnt really show them off. How can they gauge any kind of input public or technical running them in a isolated environment? 

That's fair, I didn't think of that

21 minutes ago, sw4400 said:

If they want to go all-electric by 2040, best thing to do is put a few electric buses on long routes like Ashland, Irving Park or Belmont to really test the reliability of them on longer routes. Navy Pier is nice, but we need a long-route test to see how the bus really performs.

I mean, the 29, 65 & 66 is no slouch. The 2 runs on the expressway, and state/lafayette south of 69th has terrible road conditions unless it's been repaved since I've last been over there, so that would be a good test of wear & tear

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Rumblings are anyway these are a year behind so maybe coming in 2020. I just hope they dont end up like the 7800s.

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6 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah I wouldnt buy from  byd. They have had issues in the past. The proterras have issues too. I think it's the tech. It still has kinks. Better to buy hybrid buses at least they are proven tech. If they want to go zero emissions they need to look at alternative fuels like cng. Pace seems to be doing ok. Cta wont go there though after its history of fires in the garage. 

How did the Proterra buses being operated by Aon weather the cold snap we had. Heard nothing about their status.

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2 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

That's fair, I didn't think of that

I mean, the 29, 65 & 66 is no slouch. The 2 runs on the expressway, and state/lafayette south of 69th has terrible road conditions unless it's been repaved since I've last been over there, so that would be a good test of wear & tear

I wouldn't be suprised if some electrics ran on late night 26's it will test them on long distance and going fast and they can pop right into the garage if they are low on charge.

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3 hours ago, mel bernero said:

How did the Proterra buses being operated by Aon weather the cold snap we had. Heard nothing about their status.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://energynews.us/2018/07/27/midwest/qa-lessons-from-the-u-s-s-first-commercial-electric-shuttle-bus-fleet/&ved=2ahUKEwi13L6g8Y_hAhWa94MKHVyoDVQQFjADegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw2vyWro-BdsvGXJHa_md_SN

Here's a interesting link that talks about the aon proterras. Some interesting facts like where the buses are charged are in the story. Most likely all CTA personnel operating these buses will need training.

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On 4/21/2019 at 11:51 AM, Aiden Tabucic said:

Possible 700–701 sighting at Kedzie garage I’ll check later and let y’all know 

Did you ever find anything?

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1 hour ago, WCR said:

Did you ever find anything?

No. That wasn't 700 or 701 at all - but one of the CTA's newest Novas, 8342. See pics in either the 7900-series or the 8325-series thread.

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