MRChiCity Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 A door incident happened on Metra, could someone please shed some light on this. Is this a simple incident of a laps of personal responsibility, or metra's fault? To read go to http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/local&id=7181651 and tell me what you think thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 A door incident happened on Metra, could someone please shed some light on this. Is this a simple incident of a laps of personal responsibility, or metra's fault? To read go to http://abclocal.go.c...ocal&id=7181651 and tell me what you think thank you. Obviously similar to the Rachel Barton* incident, and the one on the CTA where the mother claimed that the door closed on the stroller with her baby in it. Someone like trainman would have to comment on the allegation (also made by Judy Pardonnet, the Metra spokesperson**) that the rules were broken. However, my first sentence indicates that too much of that has been going on. As far as it being "Metra's fault," Metra (as any employer) is responsible for the negligence of its employees, unless you are asking whether there is also a system problem with Metra equipment, that wasn't fixed after the Barton incident. ________________ *Explanation of the "violinist" reference in the text version of the story retrieved by your link. ** Her face didn't look to good on HD on Channel 7.1. BTW, the background of the news conference indicated that the mother did what the Sun-Times said she would do, which was first find an attorney, not that I blame her, although the text of the story says Clifford isn't suing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ibebobo Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 I can't beleive with today's technology that there aren't sensors installed. A garage door won't close if the lazers are blocked. This is easy stuff to install. Oh well, I guess it's not an issue until it becomes an issue....and then maybe it has to become two, three, four issues???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainman8119 Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 Metra rules state that prior to moving, the trainman in charge of the doors must take a second look to ensure that the coast is clear and all doors are closed. At that time, he will signal the engineer to proceed by signal, a buzzer from the train to the engine or cab. The engineer will not proceed until he/she has received the buzzer and also has a door light illuminated in the cab indicating that all the doors are closed. If the engineer does not receive both, he is not suppose to move. Two very interesting things here. First, Metra pulled 2 out of service (presumably the conductor and engineer) with pay. If there was a true violation here and these guys were sent up for investigation, no doubt they would be out of service with no pay. Secondly, Clifford Law is a pretty reputable P/I law firm. If there was money to be made here, no doubt Clifford would be suing for the world. So, I am wondering what exactly is going on here. Finally, contraer to what Ms. Pardonnet is claiming, there are not sensors on the doors of coaches. The only cars that have sensors that will keep the doors from closing if there is an obstruction would be the old cars on the Electric District. I wish these people would get their facts straight before professing to know. (I am also looking for CTA cars that have doors that have sensors...I still have not seen one) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 Finally, contraer to what Ms. Pardonnet is claiming, there are not sensors on the doors of coaches. The only cars that have sensors that will keep the doors from closing if there is an obstruction would be the old cars on the Electric District. I wish these people would get their facts straight before professing to know. (I am also looking for CTA cars that have doors that have sensors...I still have not seen one) If that's the case, I'm surprised they didn't do anything, mechanically, after the Barton incident. What CTA was saying, and I thought Metra also had, was that there was some sort of pressure sensitive switch, but supposedly the stroller handle was too small to activate it. It wouldn't be an electric eye like on new garage doors, but still would be like the thing on a garage door that would send it back up if it hit something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainman8119 Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 If that's the case, I'm surprised they didn't do anything, mechanically, after the Barton incident. What CTA was saying, and I thought Metra also had, was that there was some sort of pressure sensitive switch, but supposedly the stroller handle was too small to activate it. It wouldn't be an electric eye like on new garage doors, but still would be like the thing on a garage door that would send it back up if it hit something. No, no sensors on Metra coaches....never !!!! One of these days, I intend on spending a couple of bucks and seeing just how many CTA doors actually bounce open when my foot gets in the way. No delay intended, just enough to see if they snap back. I would bet they don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 No, no sensors on Metra coaches....never !!!! One of these days, I intend on spending a couple of bucks and seeing just how many CTA doors actually bounce open when my foot gets in the way. No delay intended, just enough to see if they snap back. I would bet they don't. Since you announced your intent, I hope you aren't planning to donate your foot to the experiment, if it goes as you expect. I'm not so sure that Robert Clifford would hold a press conference in that situation. At least have a confederate on the inside to pull the cherry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 Obviously similar to the Rachel Barton* incident, and the one on the CTA where the mother claimed that the door closed on the stroller with her baby in it. Someone like trainman would have to comment on the allegation (also made by Judy Pardonnet, the Metra spokesperson**) that the rules were broken. However, my first sentence indicates that too much of that has been going on. As far as it being "Metra's fault," Metra (as any employer) is responsible for the negligence of its employees, unless you are asking whether there is also a system problem with Metra equipment, that wasn't fixed after the Barton incident. ________________ *Explanation of the "violinist" reference in the text version of the story retrieved by your link. ** Her face didn't look to good on HD on Channel 7.1. BTW, the background of the news conference indicated that the mother did what the Sun-Times said she would do, which was first find an attorney, not that I blame her, although the text of the story says Clifford isn't suing. The Barton incident still upsets me to this day. I blame her completely because she was not tied into the violin strap and pinned to the door, if that were the case then I would feel sympatheic towards her, but she chose to jeopardize her own personal safety by fighting to undo a stupid violin strap. If she had just let go, she never wouldve fallen under the train and what upsets me about this incident is that on account of her lapse in judgement she still has the nerve to sue Metra and blame them for negligence. Nowadays people will sue transit systems for any little thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 The Barton incident still upsets me to this day. I blame her completely because she was not tied into the violin strap and pinned to the door, if that were the case then I would feel sympatheic towards her, but she chose to jeopardize her own personal safety by fighting to undo a stupid violin strap. If she had just let go, she never wouldve fallen under the train and what upsets me about this incident is that on account of her lapse in judgement she still has the nerve to sue Metra and blame them for negligence. Nowadays people will sue transit systems for any little thing. I don't believe that enough comparative negligence on Barton's part was found to mitigate Metra's and the UP's liability. In fact, UP was found responsible for punitive damages, which would indicate that its personnel were at least reckless or acting in disregard of the safety of others. Of course, a common carrier has a heightened duty of care with regard its passengers' safety. There was a later Tribune story about how that violin was an especially valuable one, involved in all sorts of intrigue during the Nazi era. I doubt that it was more valuable than her leg, but in any event, the case has already been litigated and resolved. In this case, apparently the baby's little foot wasn't injured, but at least the people in the Sun-Times forum already say that it is the mother's fault. I'm not sure about Pardonnet's quick admission of error, but it seems that Metra does recognize that it has some responsibility with regard to passenger safety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 I don't believe that enough comparative negligence on Barton's part was found to mitigate Metra's and the UP's liability. In fact, UP was found responsible for punitive damages, which would indicate that its personnel were at least reckless or acting in disregard of the safety of others. Of course, a common carrier has a heightened duty of care with regard its passengers' safety. There was a later Tribune story about how that violin was an especially valuable one, involved in all sorts of intrigue during the Nazi era. I doubt that it was more valuable than her leg, but in any event, the case has already been litigated and resolved. In this case, apparently the baby's little foot wasn't injured, but at least the people in the Sun-Times forum already say that it is the mother's fault. I'm not sure about Pardonnet's quick admission of error, but it seems that Metra does recognize that it has some responsibility with regard to passenger safety. Her and her attorney admitted that she was trying to free her strap!, not her violin! not her arm! not her leg! but her violin strap. They also claimed that she was not pinned to the car, that she was trying to free the case strap. Which means her arms and legs were free to move, she couldve let go anytime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
west towns Posted December 23, 2009 Report Share Posted December 23, 2009 Something doesn't add up with the woman's story. She said her and her daughter got off first then looked around for the kid. Now where is the personal responsiblity for this kid to be left alone or left to walk down stairs alone. She should have been holding hands with the kid. For incidents to occur usually involves more than one separate issue with cause and effect. Did the family get up from their seats after the train stopped in the station? did the kid dilly dally playing with the sliding door in the lobby? was the kid playing around with something inside the coach? why was the kid unaccompanied? Cameras in the lobby would provide back up proof for metra as to what happened the seconds before such incidents. Also liability claims for slips, falls, getting caught in doors, broken heals on stairs etc will get reduced. Pace and CTA and other transit agencies have cameras on buses and I'm sure it's helped them with claims. Why hasn't Metra installed cameras on trains, use Homeland security as a reason to get the money, feds will pay for this kind of stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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