Trains taking the wrong lineup

[See Tea Eh]

I stand by what I said since it should be obvious I was not saying anyone under CTA employment is actually purposely posing a danger.

Then what's the point in responding to a claim that you already know isn't the case?

[Busjack]

Then what's the point in responding to a claim that you already know isn't the case?

Then what do you have to say about this post? According to him, sometimes it is the case.

[T8H5307A]

In the older days, a new qualifier for motor would get a "call-on" aspect somewhere on his first trip. I'm unable to determine if that is still the case. A "call-on" means something is wrong with the interlocking plant and a correct signal/lineup can't be given. The operator sees a red over red over yellow. It means stop! Inspect the routing and tracks ahead. If clear, operate track trip manual release. Proceed, operate at restricted speed and "on sight." Of course, the operator must first call control and notify control of the conditions. Note that during this test, no erroneous route would be set up.

Actually a "call-on" is a Red over Red over Lunar White. It can be issued if there is a train ahead, or a track circuit failure, or you're approaching the end of track.

[chicagopcclcar]

Actually a "call-on" is a Red over Red over Lunar White. It can be issued if there is a train ahead, or a track circuit failure, or you're approaching the end of track.

True...today!!! But "in the older days" as I said, it was red over red over yellow. Plus the motorman didn't have to call 'cause we didn't have radios. I don't think we called in even with trainphones. And back then it was yellow over yellow over yellow SB at Roosevelt if you were going into the stub track and it was yellow over lunar coming down the inclines. Older still, it was yellow over red if you were going round the Loop. And still older, it was yellow over lunar going downgrade under the River NB from Washington & State. That last one got removed pretty quick. The "good ole days."

And we won't mention top board over bottom board, LOL.

I think you would love riding in the cab of a mainline railroad that requires everyone to call out signals out loud, including guests!! My friend who works in California but did an observation trip in some states down south and east had everyone laughing when he repeated that they just didn't say "green" but it was "green on a pole."

David H.

[See Tea Eh]

Then what do you have to say about this post? According to him, sometimes it is the case.

The issue is whether anybody "purposely endager hundreds of passengers," not whether they'll throw a wrong lineup at somebody as a test.

If the signals are working properly, merely taking the wrong lineup doesn't endanger anybody.

I already said in a previous post that testing operators/crews is standard throughout railroading, and isn't by any means something unique to CTA.

[Busjack]

...

If the signals are working properly, merely taking the wrong lineup doesn't endanger anybody.

...

Now you are engaging in Bill Clinton parsing. The signals were working properly in 1977 but the Lake and Wabash crash happened nonetheless. Presumably the signals were working properly when someone overrode them and bumped the leader train at Oak Street. It hasn't been demonstrated that the signals worked improperly in the derailment at 58th.

And the issue wasn't taking the wrong lineup, but art's allegation, which T8H seemed to back up to a certain extent, that CTA tests rookie operators by setting the signals red, to see if they overrun them.

[jajuan]

Then what's the point in responding to a claim that you already know isn't the case?

What are you? The Opinion Police? Given I do remember stating quite clearly more than once IF that were the situation, that is my opinion on the penalties. And I do not have to justify what is my OPINION to you.

[See Tea Eh]

Now you are engaging in Bill Clinton parsing. The signals were working properly in 1977 but the Lake and Wabash crash happened nonetheless. Presumably the signals were working properly when someone overrode them and bumped the leader train at Oak Street. It hasn't been demonstrated that the signals worked improperly in the derailment at 58th.

And the issue wasn't taking the wrong lineup, but art's allegation, which T8H seemed to back up to a certain extent, that CTA tests rookie operators by setting the signals red, to see if they overrun them.

I think you are the king of weasel-wording. Nonetheless, since I highly doubt you've ever worked in transit, railroading or anything else of the sort (based on all the posts of yours that I've read over the years, which show a distinct lack of knowledge of how any of this stuff works on any level, be it from an operations perspective, a management perspective, or a planning perspective), I'm done debating you on this topic until you can actually show that you know what you're talking about.

[Busjack]

Nonetheless, since I highly doubt you've ever worked in transit, railroading or anything else of the sort (based on all the posts of yours that I've read over the years, which show a distinct lack of knowledge of how any of this stuff works on any level, be it from an operations perspective, a management perspective, or a planning perspective), I'm done debating you on this topic until you can actually show that you know what you're talking about.

Tell that to Forrest Claypool, or even Ron Huberman.

Or the three operators who caused those wrecks (including 11 deaths).

BTW, you haven't stated your credentials. Give us enough so that we can track you on the published CTA salary spreadsheet.