Smithsonian CTA 6719 & 1998 PCC Scrap Sale

[chicagopcclcar]

Since the subject has been brought up, I think it deserves its own title.


Posted 25 July 2013 - 12:06 PM

Busjack, on 25 Jul 2013 - 11:52, said:

Correction to my prior post. The article said that the Smithsonian wasn't willing to pay for 6720, not that CTA wouldn't sell.

I would have corrected you but you don't read my posts, right.

The Smithsonian was only interested in the 6719 because that car had the conductor position. The conductor is used in their animation projection. Plus they did not have room for a second car in their exhibit. 6720 was scrapped along with another 5-50. You can refer to ChicagoL.org to find out how I have this information.

"This post is hidden because Busjack has chosen to ignore posts by chicagopcclcar. View it anyway?"

Adt. Edit.....6201 through 6470 had conductor cabs at the car end opposite the motorman cab. 6471 through 6720 had a conductor position in the odd numbered car of the married pair. A drop window was on both sides, door controls were in the walls and a railing separated the conductor position from the passenger area. The conductor operated from the third or fourth car (except two car trains). This arrangement continued in all subsequent CTA car orders until the 3200 MK cars with the full width cab. When operated on the Ravenswood (Brown line) the conductors operated from the last cab in the sixth car.

Here is a photo I took at the Smithsonian a year or two ago. CTA 6719 is mounted on a hidden substructure. The trucks and all the underbody appliances were removed. The station platform is not as elaborate as the station in the South Side Car #1 exhibit at the Chicago History Museum. The Smithsonian curator simply loved the Madison-Wabash CTA station, but that of course, was unavailable as it is still in use. That is a full-sized mannequin on the platform about to board the train.


http://s155.photobucket.com/user/msibnsf/media/P1060434.jpg.html?sort=6&o=315


This photo shows the interior of the car looking back from the cab end. A holographic projection screen fills the entire conductors' end and we see passengers boarding and alighting and listen in on their conversations and exchanges while hearing the conductor's station announcements. The frosted windows on the left side of the car photo right) conceal lighting effects which give some feeling of movement as the train rounds the famed Chicago Loop 'L'.


http://s155.photobucket.com/user/msibnsf/media/P1060448.jpg.html?sort=6&o=313

The third photo is from the platform, but taken at the opposite end showing how the blinker doors were removed making for an ADA "accessible" entrance to the car. Around the corner from this end of the station is a make believe CTA bus from that time period on display. Only the bus front is shown. The bus is from Kansas City (Adt. Edit: Or maybe Omaha??), so that's why I say "make believe."

http://s155.photobucket.com/user/msibnsf/media/P1060439.jpg.html?sort=6&o=314

My very first vist to the Smithsonian came before this transit exhibit even opened. The curator was interested in an appliance in the motormans' cab and she seemed surprised that my MUDC key opened the cab door. I then explained to her the workings of the sleet scraper handle. On my latest visit, the same curator told me that the car was suffering a rodent infestation that they were trying to get a "handle" on, LOL.

Back in 1998, the CTA had advertised in the classified ads that they were having the sale of unneeded equipment and supply stores. Scrap metal prices were at the bottom of the barrel then. There were 47 cars available, mostly 5-50s and the 61-65 Skokie conversions, plus a couple of hulks from storage shops, the two married pairs and the two 2000s. Aside from complete running cars for museums, the most valuable thing were the PCC trucks. Fox, IRM, East Troy, St. Louis, Appleton-WS, and an Ontario-Canada museums, plus myself, all bid and won cars. The CTA shop forces had done something that no one could understand.....of the 47 cars, they had cut the brake actuators on 31 of the cars. To a museum, thats like buying gelded horses for breeding. The CTA agreed to swap trucks if needed on any museum purchased cars.

The company from Pennsylvania that owns the Norristown CTA cars won six in the sale and mainly they were wanting the trucks. There are CTA trucks presently under streetcars running today. William Lans of South Beloit won the rest of the cars for scrapping.

The most expensive car was #48 that went to the Ontario museum....$2,476.51. The Pennsylvania bids were $2,512 each. The Appleton car was $1,500 while the Fox Valley car was $763.63. IRM bid $700 each for the 2000s, but indicated they were only interested in the cars for parts and deferred their bid to the Pullman Historic group, if that group could build a historic park and display the two Pullman cars. We now know if would take all the way to 2013 to close that deal. I won 6719 and 6720 for $451 each. Eventually the CTA refunded my money and resold my cars, three to museums and two were scrapped. It was a bitter experience.

[Piesciuk]

The rollsign in the bus front you refer to was donated to the Smithsonian by IRM.

[Piesciuk]

Here's a view of the station area (in 2006).

[buslist]

The bus is from Omaha.

[Busjack]

The bus is from Omaha.

The license plate probably isn't authentic, either, since TA plates usually start with M (Municipal). Also, CTA run boxes were 3 roller until the 1972 New Looks.

[Busjack]

To update this, the Smithsonian's site says that it is an Omaha bus. They also have a photograph (not part of the collection) of CTA receiving delivery of the 5000s.

[ibebobo]

chicagopcclcar, I sent you a private message. Please check it out....

[DevalDragon]

M for city buses is only an IllinoiS thing. Every state does things differently.

In the 1950's, Nebraska did have black and gold "Bus" license plates and is probably authentic. Nowadays, they just get black and white Nebraska "City Gov't" plates.

A few other examples:
In Texas, city buses get Texas "Exempt" plates because they are owned by municipality.
In Ohio, they get red Ohio “Transit Bus” plates.

In Washington DC, they get standard DC plates with a "B" prefix.

In New York, they get "Official" plates.

License plates are a world all their own. Trust me.

The license plate probably isn't authentic, either, since TA plates usually start with M (Municipal). Also, CTA run boxes were 3 roller until the 1972 New Looks.

[Busjack]

M for city buses is only an IllinoiS thing. Every state does things differently.

...

I meant in Illinois.

In the picture above, it appears to be an Illinois plate, but for apportioned interstate trucks, not a bus.

One could question what is the point of the Smithsonian having a fake relic, but I suppose it doesn't have the original Ernie and Bert, either.

[chicagopcclcar]

I meant in Illinois.

In the picture above, it appears to be an Illinois plate, but for apportioned interstate trucks, not a bus.

One could question what is the point of the Smithsonian having a fake relic, but I suppose it doesn't have the original Ernie and Bert, either.

One would wonder how "He" got into this topic since supposedly "This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by chicagopcclcar. View it anyway?"

Does that mean he "views it anyway"?

[Chicago13]

I meant in Illinois.

In the picture above, it appears to be an Illinois plate, but for apportioned interstate trucks, not a bus.

One could question what is the point of the Smithsonian having a fake relic, but I suppose it doesn't have the original Ernie and Bert, either.

It is indeed an Illinois C class truck plate. From the looks of it, it's an authentic 1959 issue. Illinois eliminated the C class either in the late 60's or early 70's, I think around the time they reversed the format on truck plates and put the letter after the number rather at the beginning as on this plate.