Orion VIII

Just an update to the thread...approximately 30 of the fishbowls remain active in the fleet and 8 at a time are being cycled out of service over the summer. Whether all of them will return to service remains to be seen, because this practice has occurred in years past and we've emerged from the summer with fewer GMs, so we'll wait and see what happens come September.

I figured it would be best to swing by this forum since most of you are closer to and probably travel to Michigan more than my local counterparts. In July I'm going to be travelling through the state from Port Huron to Sault Ste Marie with a group of other transit enthusiasts. I've planned stops in Port Huron, Flint, Saginaw and Bay City to visit those systems on our way through. We are interested in visiting any other systems that may exist along the way and it would be great if anyone could post information about buses that may be sitting on properties in mid-, eastern and northern Michigan. The reason for the trip is to take a roundabout way up to Sudbury, Ontario for a 1994 Orion V charter on Saturday, July 16 and North Bay, ON for Sunday, July 17 where we are running a back-to-back MCI Classic and Orion V charter. Everyone is welcome and I should add that if anyone is interested in visiting Toronto or Ontario in general, there are generally charters every third weekend or so (sometimes more frequent!) right through to October. If anyone is interested in more info on the charters (transit operators are allowed to charter buses in Canada) or can help me with systems or buses to visit, please let me know.

I know it seems like I only ever post here regarding Mississauga, however it's my best area of expertise. Destination signs here have been standard accross all buses and routes since electronic ones were introduced in 1988. I'm going to use Mississauga Transit route 19 Hurontario as an example. Shoppers World mall in Brampton is the northern terminus, and Port Credit GO Station is the southern terminus. Before 2005, buses would display: "19 HURONTARIO N. ~ 19 TO SHOPPERS WORLD ~ 19 VIA SQUARE ONE" "19 HURONTARIO S. ~ 19 TO PORT CREDIT GO ~ 19 VIA SQUARE ONE" The rear sign would simply display "19". In September 2005 all signs were updated so that that would be displayed like this (and 19A branch added) "19 N HURONTARIO ~ TO BRAMPTON ~ VIA SQUARE ONE" "19 S HURONTARIO ~ TO PORT CREDIT GO ~ VIA SQUARE ONE" "19A N HURONTARIO ~ TO BRITANNIA ~ VIA SQUARE ONE" "19A S HURONTARIO ~ TO PORT CREDIT GO ~ VIA SQUARE ONE" With the rear sign displaying "19N", "19AN" or "19S" "19AS" respectively. Then in late 2008, all signs were updated to this, with no change to the rear sign: "19 N HURONTARIO ~ 19 TO BRAMPTON ~ 19 VIA SQUARE ONE" "19 S HURONTARIO ~ 19 TO PORT CREDIT GO ~ 19 VIA SQUARE ONE" "19A N HURONTARIO ~ 19A TO BRITANNIA ~ 19A VIA SQUARE ONE" "19A S HURONTARIO ~ 19A TO PORT CREDIT GO ~ 19A VIA SQUARE ONE" The latest updates combine the best of everything we've ever had: route number on every exposure, along with name, direction, intermediate points as well as end points. I'll reply here to questions about short turns and other signs if anyone is interested. :)

Sure, I'm from Toronto, but the same things happen here. One poster asked what they should do when approached. The first thing I do is switch my camera into video mode, and hit the shutter. This records everything you and the approacher say, verbatim. It will be very helpful should you wish to complain, sue, etc. Maintain yourself, calm and collectively. Crying, yelling, swearing, stomping, etc will only show that you were caught off guard, and that you are weak. If you maintain yourself calmly, you are showing no violence, and the incident should not escalate. Know what you're talking about. I know my city's transit by-law, and it contains nothing regarding photography. Make sure you tell the approacher what you know. Also make sure you listen to what they say, and don't speak over them, remember your camera is recording the event, and you want to make sure it can understand what both of you are saying. You are under no obligation to delete your photos, or even show them to anyone. They are your property, as is your camera, and anything you have on you. Get employees' names and/or badge numbers, and ask for a phone number to speak to their supervisor. If you have a phone, take it out, and pretend (you actually could, if you wanted to) to call the transit authority's customer service, your lawyer and if you're a minor, your parents. With operators, it's easy to drop names to scare them off. For example, I was having a non-photgraphy related problem with a driver. He refused to set his transfer cutter to the correct time, and everyone getting on the bus was being ripped off, no pun intended. He ended up giving me some BS excuse as to why my transfer was reduced by 25% of the time I paid for, then I asked for his badge number. He gave me an "oh shit" look, then told me he wasn't allowed to. He said he was going to call control to have a supervisor attend. I replied by saying "I don't think you want to waste Ms. Baverstock's (Transit Controller) time, and I don't think Mr. Marinoff (Director of Transit) would appreciate having this busload of people held up." At that, he reset his transfer cutter and gave me a new transfer with the correct time. It's also very handy to get to know drivers, because they can provide info, give you free reign on photography, etc. They love tea, coffee and other beverages, especially cold water on a hot day. I've also taken prints (of their bus the day before) out to drivers, they have really liked that!

Kind of off-topic and rather late, but Cleveland DE60LFA 2900 was in the Toronto area in late June. Photos here, from Jan Boic.

Great, thanks for the update! It will be heading to MTB for maxi-brake relocation. So far all units up to 0820, as well as 0822 have been spotted there. I'd imagine 0821 and 23-25 are either there now or on their ways. I've also only ever seen New Flyers driven my sample covers OC Transpo Inveros and D60LFs, York Region Transit D40LFs, all Mississauga Transit New Flyers and Fairfax Connectors D40LFRs. As long as the same people are in maintenance, the 2001 VIIs will be the last Orions to ever come to Mississauga. In fact, I don't know why I call them 2001s, seeing as they weren't in service until June 2002! That's how bad they were, and still are today.

I received my copy in the mail today! Looks very good.

48, although no longer operating in Chicago, it's the one we have at the Halton County Radial Railway Museum in Milton, ON. I've ridden it several times too.

And Vs. Their fleet is quite interesting, also consisting of some school bus-like Blue Birds.

Definitely Mississauga. :D

That would have been one of our D60LFRs, 0851-0885. They have all arrived now, and the one spotted in that post was likely 0885, since it arrived considerable later than the rest of them. Here are a couple of my photos that I have uploaded.

It's from 2006. Our Orion IIs were retired in September 2007, replaced by ElDorado E-Z Rider II MAXs. The TTC in Toronto still has Orion IIs, as does the London Transit Commission. They are also quite plentiful in Michigan, notably Port Huron and Saginaw.

I did not have any trouble whatsoever when I was in Chicago (and Pace territory) last August. Mind you, I only took a few pictures, and a video on transit property. I got both blank stares and happy waves when I was shooting on the streets. Here, it's a different story. The city initiated the Transit Enforcement unit. It is a number of wannabe cops who wear police-like uniforms and drive police-like cars...however, they have very little authority, all they are allowed to enforce is Mississauga's Transit By-Law. There is no provision regarding photography in the by-law, however one of these 'officers' took it upon himself to claim there is. A transit supervisor got into it the one time, and when I informed him that "there is no provision regarding photography in by-law 0425-2003, therefore the basis of your request is unwarranted." He told me not to bring by-laws into it, to which I replied "then you have nothing to go on. Goodbye." I walked away and continued shooting. A few months later, I was approached by a Transit Enforcement 'Officer' who asked me for my permit. I said I did not need one, using the same spiel I previously gave the supervisor. The 'officer' did a double take, eyes popped open, then walked away. I have not had a problem since. I do, however, have a copy of 0425-2003 in my backpack with me. I'm waiting to be confronted again, this time I'll plop the by-law in his hand and ask him to "show me where it says that!"

I'd love it if you guys could attempt to track Mississauga Transit's order of 69 D40LFRs. They are supposed to begin arriving on Monday, according to driver newsletters. For those wondering, they are replacing our Orion Vs from 1991-93. Thanks, Orion VIII

They are Most definitely ElDorado E-Z Rider II MAXs. Poor passengers subjected to those VIs....I know how they feel, we have 42 of them here!