What do you think will be the first fleet to retire?

[BusHunter]

With all the retirements going on, these last few days I've been wondering what bus fleet will retire first in totality. Will it be the #5300's, which are down to the mid 90's. The #4400's which are at 240, but are being retired at a much faster rate ( at least five times as fast) Or will it be a surprise the #5800's which there are only 60? What do you think?

[Kevin]

5300s are scheduled to go first, followed by the 4400s and 5800s.

[jajuan]

Even though the 5300s are scheduled to be gone first per information given by CTA management, I've still wondered about this same question as well. The question that comes to mind in this regard is are the remaining mid-90 something 5300s currently assigned to garages (Chicago and 103rd) where they can be retired out quickly. As mentioned by a couple of members in another thread, 103rd seems to be retiring its 4400s and sending them to the scrapyard faster than they are their remaining 5300s which doesn't make much sense if the 5300s are supposed to be retired and scrapped first.

[Busjack]

There probably will be a few stragglers left, so anyone betting on the last one in a series may be surprised. For instance, Pace still has some 8900s around, even though it says it has a completely accessible fleet.

Even though the 5300s are scheduled to be gone first per information given by CTA management ...

Don't forget all the press releases that the 5300s would be gone by the end of option 2 at the latest. Hasn't happened yet.

Also, don't forget the "worst of the worst" announcement

[jajuan]

There probably will be a few stragglers left, so anyone betting on the last one in a series may be surprised. For instance, Pace still has some 8900s around, even though it says it has a completely accessible fleet.Don't forget all the press releases that the 5300s would be gone by the end of option 2 at the latest. Hasn't happened yet.

Also, don't forget the "worst of the worst" announcement

Yes, I do remember both of those issues on the CTA's part regarding the 5300s Busjack. (Which reminds me a lot of the TMCs Kedzie got from NP during implementation of the spring pick changes are junk compared to those Kedzie already had). I also remember CTA's past experience with retiring the Americanas. The announcements of the completion of their retirements at first said they would be gone by 2003 without being specific about when in 2003. Then as 2002 progressed and 2003 drew closer, the announcements stated by yearend 2003 they would be gone. Then of course yearend 2003 came and went and approximately 50 Americanas still remained. Their final retirement finally came in April 2004 about two weeks after the 148 came into service. So I'm not surprised that there are still 5300s around even though they actually should have been gone by now, be it if it happened last year as it was supposed to originally been the case or at the end of Option 2 of the New Flyer 1000s. I am surprised that five months after they were originally supposed to be gone (May is just two days away), there are still close to 100 of the darn things left. And I definitely won't be surprised if there are stragglers of any of the other two models (4400s and 5800s) set for complete retirement by Thanksgiving of this year once Thanksgiving does get here and pass.

[BusHunter]

Looks to me like the last #4400's will be retired along side it's #5300 counterparts. Someone seems to be keeping these #5300's around for nostalgia. I don't blame them. I hate to see them go too. The way the NF's are coming in this month about 27 or 28, I wonder if we will still see a few of the 1991 buses after Thanksgiving. At this rate we'll be at 210 more 40 footer NF's by then. Also according to the press release on 60 foot NF's they will receive about 10 a month. That's about 40 buses translating to about 60 retired. 60 plus 210 equals 270. Well we have about 330 1991 buses left. If they do retire those buses by thanksgiving things are going to have to step up. Also what about the #5800's. By the end of the year retired? I don't know about that. Maybe by Feb or March 2009 I think. BTW, this might be totally crazy on my part, but could it be possible that not all of 1991 buses would retire totally right away. These buses are lift equipped, they could operate within the system normally. Could a couple be kept around similar to what happened with bus #301 or #7143 and #7167 for a limited amount of time. That would be kind of nice. We wouldn't have to say goodbye to these buses so soon.

[jajuan]

I rode 5511 on the X28 on a quick trip from Union Station to Harold Washington Library. I must say it was still in fairly good condition. It was definitely in a lot better condition than the junk 4400s that NP transferred to Kedzie last month. I think I can see why 103rd transferred out so many of its remaining TMCs during recent months and kept its 5300s if 5511 is any indication of the condition of what's left of the 5300s there.

[qwantae]

I rode 5511 on the X28 on a quick trip from Union Station to Harold Washington Library. I must say it was still in fairly good condition. It was definitely in a lot better condition than the junk 4400s that NP transferred to Kedzie last month. I think I can see why 103rd transferred out so many of its remaining TMCs during recent months and kept its 5300s if 5511 is any indication of the condition of what's left of the 5300s there.

I would say that 103rds (4800s) that were formerly 74th's and 77th's (Late 4700s) are much better shape than 4400s NP transferred to Kedzies. But the Remaining ones (4500s) currently at NP are pretty fair condition too.

[jajuan]

I would say that 103rds (4800s) that were formerly 74th's and 77th's (Late 4700s) are much better shape than 4400s NP transferred to Kedzies. But the Remaining ones (4500s) currently at NP are pretty fair condition too.

Yes, that's for sure. They send Kedzie their junk and keep the well conditioned models.

[Busjack]

Yes, that's for sure. They send Kedzie their junk and keep the well conditioned models.

But given that "And the next garage to get New Flyers" is Kedzie, might that actually make sense?

[jajuan]

But given that "And the next garage to get New Flyers" is Kedzie, might that actually make sense?

Yes. I'm not saying that it doesn't make sense. I actually thought about that when giving my posts. I just don't like the whole business of switching one garage's worst junk to another, especially given the history of this being done to 74th and up till recently 103rd without replacing it for years.

[Busjack]

Yes. I'm not saying that it doesn't make sense. I actually thought about that when giving my posts. I just don't like the whole business of switching one garage's worst junk to another, especially given the history of this being done to 74th and up till recently 103rd without replacing it for years.

I agree in that I have been challenging those who said to "replace in place" when the rules were consistently changing so that some garages got the short end.

However, since it now appears that the 1991 vintage vehicles are going, going, gone, may as well do it in such a manner that it isn't that Kedzie gets a New Flyer so that it can send a TMC back to NP. Indications from the 4400s topic are that fewer than 50 TMCs remain at Kedzie, which would take no more than a couple of months to replace.

Getting back to the topic of this thread, one could make an argument that the 5300s might be later to go, because they probably will stick around Chicago Garage until the sooner of either 3 track being done or all 1991s being off the roster (although the latter is scheduled to happen first).

[qwantae]

But given that "And the next garage to get New Flyers" is Kedzie, might that actually make sense?

Yes it does