Pace equipment

[Busjack]

If Pace wouldn't come up with an order of Orion V or VII Generation as I would like to see, Then I really hope that in the future that they'll order Gillig Advantage/ Gillig BRT Hybrid like Minneapolis, or Van Hool A330s like Oakland AC Transit.

I forgot the Orion V is still being made. I wouldn't mind if Metro Transit got some of them or more Gillig Phantoms for their next fleet replacement after this one with the Gillig BRT's. Most likely though they will keep getting low floors of some sort. (I hope they don't go with NABI based on what I have heard about them now.) The Gillig BRT I have been on was real nice and it seemed to have good shocks and it didn't jerk when braking. I'm still waiting to ride a BRT on MT's 84 from 46th St. LRT station. If it can get through that mess of potholes, chuck holes, frost heaves and abandoned rail track crossing then it's a good bus. The Phantoms rattle and shake on that part but they still preform well.

You know what, I really do have a feeling that if the next new bus orders for Pace comes in, then Northwest and Southwest probably be those first two division for next new equipment and transfer most of Southwest Novas to Academy for #600, 606, 616, and 715. And for replacement of Orion 1 at Northwest. I really hoping that It will be a comeback for Nova Classics, they are my favorite Canadian Style buses. I miss my hometown's 1990 MCI Classics in Grand Rapids, MI, now they're at Quebec RTC. Minneapolis would've been a great fit for Nova Classics and New Flyers, But I love their 1998 New Flyer D60HF.

First, I moved this subtopic since it had nothing to do with Academy.

Second, if you want new equipment, write your state legislator in Springfield, and tell them you want a capital bill, along with the casino gambling to fund it.

Third, Pace has a history of taking the low bid. The only reason there are Orion VIs is that each was $10,000 less than a NABI at that time. Pace loves the ElDorados because they cost about $280,000, and it budgeted $330,000 each per bus (at least in 2006). It apparently also gets CMAQ grants for substituting small buses for big ones.

Finally, a fantasy that Pace should order anything except a NABI isn't going to happen under this scenario. They take bids, and do not order buses from the Sharper Image catalog (except perhaps for the MCIs). I wish that it could get a new version of the RTA pumpkin New Look buses on the street, but it ain't gonna happen. Neither they nor the Nova Classics are coming back.

[MVTArider]

You know what, I really do have a feeling that if the next new bus orders for Pace comes in, then Northwest and Southwest probably be those first two division for next new equipment and transfer most of Southwest Novas to Academy for #600, 606, 616, and 715. And for replacement of Orion 1 at Northwest. I really hoping that It will be a comeback for Nova Classics, they are my favorite Canadian Style buses. I miss my hometown's 1990 MCI Classics in Grand Rapids, MI, now they're at Quebec RTC. Minneapolis would've been a great fit for Nova Classics and New Flyers, But I love their 1998 New Flyer D60HF.

Now the next new order for Pace would be ElDorado since Pace still has options for them correct? Based on what I have read here I would assume orders after that will be whatever is cheap.

I rode on a NF D60HF yesterday for the first time since the Light Rail opened. It seemed kind of strange because since 05 I have been riding on NF D40LF's or D60LF's only. I like the high floor better for long rides. I wish NF still made them. In my opinion the D60LF's Metro Transit has look like New Flyer designed the low floor articulated bus and got all the details worked out, then stood back and said "Shoot we forgot to put the seats in. Well we'll just put some here and a few there that will work."

First, I moved this subtopic since it had nothing to do with Academy.

Second, if you want new equipment, write your state legislator in Springfield, and tell them you want a capital bill, along with the casino gambling to fund it.

Third, Pace has a history of taking the low bid. The only reason there are Orion VIs is that each was $10,000 less than a NABI at that time. Pace loves the ElDorados because they cost about $280,000, and it budgeted $330,000 each per bus (at least in 2006). It apparently also gets CMAQ grants for substituting small buses for big ones.

Finally, a fantasy that Pace should order anything except a NABI isn't going to happen under this scenario. They take bids, and do not order buses from the Sharper Image catalog (except perhaps for the MCIs). I wish that it could get a new version of the RTA pumpkin New Look buses on the street, but it ain't gonna happen. Neither they nor the Nova Classics are coming back.

Thanks Busjack for moving this subtopic. I will try to avoid deviating from topics in the future. Do you have a picture you could post of a RTA pumpkin New Look Bus? I think I know what you mean but am not sure exactly. If I was in charge of equipment purchase I would order samples and do some research instead of just going with a low bid. After all I bet if someone at Pace were to get his/her house reroofed I bet they would want to look at the contractors record and find out what kind of a job the contractor does. It really seems stupid to just go with a low bid instead of looking at quality. Pick out the manufactuers who make decent buses, then get a low bid from them.

By the way, I missed the bus page in the Sharper Image catalog How would that work anyway? Providers just look and say "Ooh, that would look good with our livery."

[Tcmetro]

Seems like if you go for the low bid you get junk (like NABI's). From other forums I have read, NJT fans like the new NABI 416's they got.

Anyways it would be cool if Pace got some Nova LFS or Gillig's.

[Busjack]

Do you have a picture you could post of a RTA pumpkin New Look Bus? I think I know what you mean but am not sure exactly.

There were a couple on the Chicagoland Historical Bus Museum site, but they don't appear to be there now (the Collection portion doesn't have a link, and the site is "under construction'). The third bus from the front of the group portrait is one, however. Also one in Krambles' book, CTA at 45.

Basically, it had RTA colors (still used by Metra) in that it had a burnt orange front and roof, a brown belt that became a V at the wedge window, and slate around the windows, with the brown and slate bands continuing up the roof. Most were subsequently repainted in the Pace white with yellow stripe format, that was used through the 2003 deliveries.

See also the discussion in the prior topic. However, the link in that message is no longer there either.

The Sharper Image catalog was used a bit sarcastically, but the point was as you stated. And I believe that is how one member of the forum would have transit authorities pick buses, rather than the competitive bidding process.

[ibebobo]

There were a couple on the Chicagoland Historical Bus Museum site, but they don't appear to be there now (the Collection portion doesn't have a link, and the site is "under construction'). The third bus from the front of the group portrait is one, however. Also one in Krambles' book, CTA at 45.

Basically, it had RTA colors (still used by Metra) in that it had a burnt orange front and roof, a brown belt that became a V at the wedge window, and slate around the windows, with the brown and slate bands continuing up the roof. Most were subsequently repainted in the Pace white with yellow stripe format, that was used through the 2003 deliveries.

See also the discussion in the prior topic. However, the link in that message is no longer there either.

The Sharper Image catalog was used a bit sarcastically, but the point was as you stated. And I believe that is how one member of the forum would have transit authorities pick buses, rather than the competitive bidding process.

Here is a link that will show you one.....

http://hometown.aol.com/ctapacefan/rosppic4.html

[geneking7320]

Seems like if you go for the low bid you get junk (like NABI's). From other forums I have read, NJT fans like the new NABI 416's they got.

Anyways it would be cool if Pace got some Nova LFS or Gillig's.

I seem to recall reading that Gillig does not like to bid on orders from large systems like CTA.

I don't know if that is true and if so that mindset would carry against Pace also.I have wondered aloud who were the bidders on the last 40 foot buses for CTA and Pace.

Gene

[Busjack]

I was just referencing to the point that it's a 666 bus.

For that matter, which Pace being so superstitious, not having buses with fleet numbers ending in 13, I'm surprised they have 2666 and 6666. Supposedly, route 666 was renumbered for similar reasons.

[Guest]

There were a couple on the Chicagoland Historical Bus Museum site, but they don't appear to be there now (the Collection portion doesn't have a link, and the site is "under construction'). The third bus from the front of the group portrait is one, however. Also one in Krambles' book, CTA at 45.

Basically, it had RTA colors (still used by Metra) in that it had a burnt orange front and roof, a brown belt that became a V at the wedge window, and slate around the windows, with the brown and slate bands continuing up the roof. Most were subsequently repainted in the Pace white with yellow stripe format, that was used through the 2003 deliveries.

See also the discussion in the prior topic. However, the link in that message is no longer there either.

The Sharper Image catalog was used a bit sarcastically, but the point was as you stated. And I believe that is how one member of the forum would have transit authorities pick buses, rather than the competitive bidding process.

The RTA pumpkin bus #8006 is still active in the CHBM fleet.

[TMC-RTS-08]

Seems like if you go for the low bid you get junk (like NABI's). From other forums I have read, NJT fans like the new NABI 416's they got.

Anyways it would be cool if Pace got some Nova LFS or Gillig's.

I'd rather see Pace get Novas over the Gilligs. IMO the Gillig BRT is a rip off of the LFS, and the BRT. adds those odd humps on the roof of the bus.

We'll see in a couple years when Pace will start retiring some of the older Orions. Nova's new New York plant should be up and running sometime next year.

[Guest]

Seems like if you go for the low bid you get junk (like NABI's). From other forums I have read, NJT fans like the new NABI 416's they got.

Anyways it would be cool if Pace got some Nova LFS or Gillig's.

Pace had a fleet of Gillig Phantoms 35 footers back from 1986 they spent their entire careers working out of Pace North Division until about 2000 when they were replaced by the 35ft Nabis. Thanks Trainman, my mistake I sometimes get North and North Shore confused. :)

[trainman8119]

Pace had a fleet of Gillig Phantoms 35 footers back from 1986 they spent their entire careers working out of Pace North Shore Division until about 2000 when they were replaced by the 35ft Nabis.

Actually, the Gilligs spent almost their entire careers at North Division in Waukegan. Upon being replaced by Orions, some found their way into Ravinia service in Highland Park before being totally retired.

[Busjack]

Actually, the Gilligs spent almost their entire careers at North Division in Waukegan. Upon being replaced by Orions, some found their way into Ravinia service in Highland Park before being totally retired.

Also, there were only 20, compared to a Pace fleet of about 600 then.

I forgot Pace still ran the Nova Classics. Do they still have the Orions too? In the west burbs of Aurora and Batavia I see Pace buses, but there those NABIs or those Eldorado EZ Rider IIs.

The Orions Is are (in any numbers) with North, North Shore, Northwest, and contractors (Academy in the Rosemont area and First with some DuPage County feeders). About 95 or so of the ones in the 2272-2378 range remain of the original 106.

The Orion VIs are at Northwest, Southwest and West.

As you noted, Elgin and Aurora are now mostly ElDorados.

[Busjack]

I wonder if Pace buying all the shorter buses is going to come back to haunt them in the future if more people start riding because of gas prices and traffic?

The only one who can answer that is the person at Pace that gets the IBS (Intelligent Bus System) counts.

The only two real heavy divisions are South and West, and some routes at Northwest that connect with CTA.

One might wonder about Pace partially replacing West 40 ft Ikarus with 35 foot NABIs, but apparently Academy's needs preempted some of that.

However, it appears that places that are receiving the ElDorados (such as Aurora, Elgin, Highland Park, and now the Wheaton area) never had enough ridership to even justify a 35 foot bus. Also, as frequently noted, an ElDorado has the same seating as a 6600 series NABI--27.

In the short term, there may be a need for a smattering of more 40 foot buses in S, W, and maybe NW, a few North Shore routes, and a few contractor routes, even if the Orion Is are close to their end, but there are plenty of routes in NS and NW that could get by with ElDorados. I base that on (1) what I have seen and (2) what routes Pace threatens to cut any time there is a budget crisis or a restructuring initiative.

The tour of the NABI 42BRT also went through Pace territory, and if Pace gets serious about BRT, it might be a choice for such routes as 322 or 352 (as Cermak and the Harvey area have and are supposed to get traffic signal preemption).

[Busjack]

Here is a link that will show you one.....

A link to a pumpkin bus in better condition (and authentic, except for the Pace logo). The CHBM bus at IRM.

[MVTArider]

A link to a pumpkin bus in better condition (and authentic, except for the Pace logo). The CHBM bus at IRM.

Thanks BusJack and ibebobo I thought that would be what they looked like but I wasn't sure.

BTW it will be interesting to see what the next group of Pace buses is, assuming they get them through competitive bidding I wonder if 40ft El Dorados could come in in the future... At least Pace has a variety of equipment, especially if CTA is going New Flyer on us. At least its a good brand!

[Busjack]

Thinking that the Ikarus buses might be gone (due to the Joliet restructuring and termination of about 5 school bus tripper routes) I looked during the rush hour throughout the West Division on WebWatch and saw none.

While this is not necessarily conclusive, has anyone seen one on the street lately, or any semblance of an official roster to confirm one way or the other?