Feasible ?

[trainman8119]

Riding out to Rosemont from the Loop this morning, I was thinking about the Rhamfather's desire to reduce time to the airport and spend loads of money to do it.

Now, IIRC, when the line opened to O'Hare the time from Lake Transfer to O'Hare was advertised as a 35 minute trip. Of course there were conductors and skip stops. Currently the trip is 40-45 minutes. Put back the conductors and skip stops, won't have to spend anything on adding tracks or trying to figure how to get around locals. Of course, creating jobs in a bad economy in which government has to spend, well of course not, nowadays that is Unamerican. Politicians cry about it, but they never do anything about it, cry that they are broke and expect private enterprise to do it...like they have any more money ??

Anyway, in my travels this morning, I began to wonder. What if you made the Blue and Red Lines "left handed" ? What this would do would allow the operator to remain put more often than not instead of having to walk to the opposite side of the car. If you take an extra 20 seconds a stop to accomplish this that would amount to almost 15 minutes of time saving per trip, based on 30 stops, which is what both the Red and the Blue have. Currently, the only stations that allow the operator to remain put are California, Western and Damen on the Blue and Belmont, Fullerton, Chicago and Grand on the Red.

Obviously, there would be some kind of cost relating to redoing the signals, and I am not sure with the system in place if it would be that cost prohibitive or not. Also, it could effect the connections between Brown and Red at Belmont and Fullerton, but other than that I don't really see much of a down side.

Probably a wild idea, but what the heck. Always looking for feedback !! Comments ???

[Busjack]

Since all cab signals after the ones installed on the Blue Line extension in about 1984 are bidirectional, including on the recent Blue Line Signals Project, that isn't the problem. I don't know if the ones at crossovers have to be changed.

The connections issue is basically whether you are going to redo the entire system, or be like Metra, with only the UP on the wrong side. In the early 1900s, half the L lines ran left handed.

Basically, though, the question requires a time and motion study on how much time is spent on the operator crossing the cab, as opposed to the time spent having to open the doors and inspect the side. The latter is aided by some cameras and TV monitors on the platforms, which would have to be moved under your proposal.

And there is the issue of slow zones on the elevated portion, which supposedly is being addressed

Anyway, with his obsession over the Red Line, I don't recall the Rahmfather suggesting, for instance, that any of the consultant's reports for an Airport Express or da farmer Mare's wish for a Chinese maglev be revived.

[trainman8119]

Anyway, with his obsession over the Red Line, I don't recall the Rahmfather suggesting, for instance, that any of the consultant's reports for an Airport Express or da farmer Mare's wish for a Chinese maglev be revived.

Here is a link from February

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/02/08/mayor-emanuel-time-to-speed-up-trains-to-ohare-midway/

[See Tea Eh]

Blue Line could run left-handed with minimal issue. Red Line would be more difficult, given the fact that it operates alongside Brown, Purple and Yellow.

That said, an idea that would be good, the next order of cars should have a couple hundred cars with cab controls on the left side. Assign those cars to the Blue and Red Lines and you get all the benefits you note above, without any operational or signal changes.

[Busjack]

Here is a link from February

http://chicago.cbslo...o-ohare-midway/

Thanks for the much more detailed analysis, but it does seem to support my conclusion that Rahm isn't Daley II.

That said, an idea that would be good, the next order of cars should have a couple hundred cars with cab controls on the left side. Assign those cars to the Blue and Red Lines and you get all the benefits you note above, without any operational or signal changes.

I had come to a similar thought about a half hour after posting yesterday. Of course, the CTA had not thought that far ahead in that the Red Line is going to get what the 5000s now have, and the Blue Line isn't slated to get anything. So, maybe you are talking 2019 on a practical level.

The other thought would be more of a WMATA type operation, i.e. driving is automated, but the operator runs the doors. However, given that DC had a bad accident recently, one could just imagine what would happen if CTA adopted that.

[geneking7320]

I posed a similar question about the Orange Line in the Yahoo! Chicago Transit group.

My thought was that since Orange Line stations between Midway and Roosevelt were islands why not run left handed and all platforms would be to the operator's right.

Gene King

[Busjack]

I posed a similar question about the Orange Line in the Yahoo! Chicago Transit group.

My thought was that since Orange Line stations between Midway and Roosevelt were islands why not run left handed and all platforms would be to the operator's right.

Gene King

Now, when you put it that way, it got all new cars, so, I guess left hand controls should have been suggested in 1989.

Of course, you have the complication of Loop operation, where all platforms are on the right, and I presume that if you meant left handed operation with right side controls, there would have to be a crossover from left to right around the merge with the SSM.

[geneking7320]

Now, when you put it that way, it got all new cars, so, I guess left hand controls should have been suggested in 1989.

Of course, you have the complication of Loop operation, where all platforms are on the right, and I presume that if you meant left handed operation with right side controls, there would have to be a crossovier from left to right around the merge with the SSM.

Busjack;

My idea was to put a crossover west of the junction with the Ryan line so the same cars could be used all over the system.

[Busjack]

Busjack;

My idea was to put a crossover west of the junction with the Ryan line so the same cars could be used all over the system.

Could be, but then an enforced red over red signal would probably cost more time than what would be saved. I was thinking more changing the flyover.

Hence, I only see left handed operation working on a line that is otherwise operationally isolated from the system, which would mean only the Blue Line.

[chicagopcclcar]

Could be, but then an enforced red over red signal would probably cost more time than what would be saved. I was thinking more changing the flyover.

Hence, I only see left handed operation working on a line that is otherwise operationally isolated from the system, which would mean only the Blue Line.

There are two ideas that constantly appear and reappear....left hand running on the CTA 'L' and longer and sometimes wider cars on the CTA 'L'. And every time the ideas are studied by CTA management, they fail each time to meet the test of feasibility. Whatever the advantage...time and time again the studied concept fails to proove its worth versus the costs that would be incurred, versus the difficulties implementing, or a plain old, "it's just not worth it."

The original poster is certainly mistaken when he says it costs ten seconds at every stop for the operator to cross from their operating position to the window on the opposite side. Ten seconds is the time a basketball team has to advance the ball from the put in play pass to the mid-court line. An 'L' car is 8 ft 8in total floor width. End line to mid-court line on a basketball court is 50 ft.

However....as it pertains to the Orange/Midway line...a high ranking manager did suggest left hand operation before the line opened. The Midway line was to be the city's first OPTO of main line trains. The crossover interlocking at Lowe Ave. was suggested to be the point where operation would change "hand" and it could be automated. The idea didn't go any further.

How much time could have been gained. You could have lost that same amount of time at 17th St. interlocking if a NB Green line train was in the circuit first. Or the same amount of time could have been lost assisting a handicapped passenger. And a Midway train still has three more interlocking movements among other lines before it heads back to Midway.

David Harrison

[chicagopcclcar]

Additional info.....idea of running Midway line lefthanded was dismissed because the cab signal system would only allow trains to run 35 MPH in the reverse direction instead of normal 55 MPH.

David H.

[Busjack]

Additional info.....idea of running Midway line lefthanded was dismissed because the cab signal system would only allow trains to run 35 MPH in the reverse direction instead of normal 55 MPH.

David H.

That, though, could be reprogrammed. After all, they apparently can get the 55s down to 15. Just say east is now west.

[chicagopcclcar]

Evidently not. The discussions ended on that note. After the 35 MPH citation, there was no recourse evidently.

David H.