#9800's & #1600's Lifetime Assignment list, bus retirements and other info

[BusHunter]

Here's a lifetime assignment/retirement list for the #9800's and #1600's.

[BusHunter]

Here's a few shots of the flyers on Austin and Addison.

and

a few interior shots as well.

[cta5658]

Here's a few shots of the flyers on Austin and Addison.

and

a few interior shots as well.

Nice Photos, can you try to do a post for the 5300's, 4400's and 6000's liftime assignment lists, bus retirements and other info with photos as well?

[Guest]

Here's a lifetime assignment list for the #9800's and #1600's.

and

early retirement info from the '97 -'98 cuts.

Flyer #9844, my favorite Flyer bus! I recall was transferred from Beverly to Forest Glen around 1986, following the closing of North Ave Garage. I remember seeing the bus all over the northwest side. I also remember seeing and riding it on the #76 Diversey. What struck me back then was not only the engine sound but also the garage decal on the windshield had "F" and "B". Back then I never knew Beverly garage existed. It was equipped with a different diesel engine , not a Detroit. It had a deeper sound, possibly a Cummins. I would compare it to the Milwaukee #3700 Orions. A few years later #9844 was transferred to Kedzie. By this time in 1997, I was on the job, I drove #9844 on Kimball, by then it was re-equipped with the standard Detroit that powered the rest of the fleet. Its service life ended badly with a collision on the west side with a cement truck. I also recall Flyer #9822, with the larger destination sign operated on the nw side for a while.

[Guest]

Here's a few shots of the flyers on Austin and Addison.

and

a few interior shots as well.

Wow, I forgot that CTA had installed video surveillance even on the Flyers.

[Busjack]

Both sets of interior pictures indicate that these and the 4000s had the same seats as the New Looks, and here, more than the 4000s, having the pads replaced with the black wooden inserts.

5750 mentioning North Ave. being closed, reminded me....

Near the end (i.e. around 2001), weren't some 9800s at Chicago Garage, out of the "last reported at 77th" group? I remember some on 65 Grand.

[BusHunter]

Both sets of interior pictures indicate that these and the 4000s had the same seats as the New Looks, and here, more than the 4000s, having the pads replaced with the black wooden inserts.

5750 mentioning North Ave. being closed, reminded me....

Near the end (i.e. around 2001), weren't some 9800s at Chicago Garage, out of the "last reported at 77th" group? I remember some on 65 Grand.

Actually there was one #4000 that tested with the seat inserts that debuted on the #5300's. That was #4286. As far as the color of the inserts on #9891 and the #9900 example they also came in orange, tan and a few other colors. It was completely random. A bus of one color inserts in that era was rare. A good question I was wondering was when the buses were delivered, did they have the foam padding or did that stop with the #9600's. As far as Chicago garage is concerned I don't believe there ever was a flyer there in 2001. Most of the higher #9900's went to Fg actually right before retirement and ran a few months there and then Archer's #9800's came to the glen one by one running a day or two or weeks depending on if it was better than the other flyers at the time. Maybe in a future edit to what i've made I'll document what buses exactly came to the glen. I have that info, it's just a matter of putting it together.

[BusHunter]

Nice Photos, can you try to do a post for the 5300's, 4400's and 6000's liftime assignment lists, bus retirements and other info with photos as well?

I have info for all assignments from the #100's to the present. Some are more complete than others. Like I don't have retirement info before the #9000's. Some stuff is still a work in progress. I just got done last week putting together the #5300's so that's ready to go. For the #4400's I have a completed retirement list, but for the assignments I'm to the point where all the buses scatter in 2002 and it's going to be a real chore to do that. In time I'll complete it. But I can release the #4400's as a work in progress. I have completed the #6000 assignments, but need to do the retirements still. All the current in service buses need assignment data updated from late 2008 or later to the present. So that's where I stand.

[qwantae]

Wow, I forgot that CTA had installed video surveillance even on the Flyers.

Yes, I remember riding alot of remaining Flyers between Around late 90's with video surveillance on them on Archer and Forest Glen routes. But I couldn't remember this: Did any of remaining Americanas had theirs? I remember rode several very last of them around 2003-2004 with no Cameras.

[qwantae]

Both sets of interior pictures indicate that these and the 4000s had the same seats as the New Looks, and here, more than the 4000s, having the pads replaced with the black wooden inserts.

5750 mentioning North Ave. being closed, reminded me....

Near the end (i.e. around 2001), weren't some 9800s at Chicago Garage, out of the "last reported at 77th" group? I remember some on 65 Grand.

I remember around late 90s when 9800s were at 77th group, Routes 24-Wentworth and 71-71st were mostly Flyers. And I did spot some of them 9800s working 79-79th route on 79th eastbound passed Kedzie during afternoon rush period, even though it has been an accessible route since 1991 when 4400s/ 5300s came in service.

[Guest]

Yes, I remember riding alot of remaining Flyers between Around late 90's with video surveillance on them on Archer and Forest Glen routes. But I couldn't remember this: Did any of remaining Americanas had theirs? I remember rode several very last of them around 2003-2004 with no Cameras.

I drove the MAN Americanas out of all three garages I worked at K, NP and FG. I dont recall the MANs ever having cameras. I guess since they were so close to retirement.

I do recall seeing MANs stray away from their non lift routes while at FG. I have seen them on Irving Pk, Belmont.

[Busjack]

Actually there was one #4000 that tested with the seat inserts that debuted on the #5300's. That was #4286. As far as the color of the inserts on #9891 and the #9900 example they also came in orange, tan and a few other colors. It was completely random. A bus of one color inserts in that era was rare.

I wasn't around when those were delivered, but in the case of the New Looks, they originally had padded orange and tan padded seat inserts, but as those got slashed, were replaced with the wooden ones. I remember the black wooden ones, but somehow color ones seem to ring a bell.

As far as the current style you said was tested on one bus, supposedly they are of "slashproof fabric."

As far as Chicago garage is concerned I don't believe there ever was a flyer there in 2001. Most of the higher #9900's went to Fg actually right before retirement and ran a few months there and then Archer's #9800's came to the glen one by one running a day or two or weeks depending on if it was better than the other flyers at the time. ...

I can only tell you what I saw on the street. Also, IIRC, I previously saw the particular bus on Wentworth downtown, then a few days later on Grand.

The only thing easy to document is that according to this Press Release, Laramie and Grand were the last routes out of Chicago that became accessible, which was in 2001 after A and C got Novas. Obviously, some garage was running some nonaccessible bus (either a Flyer or 4000, since that was all that was left) on those routes before then.

[busfan2847]

The only thing easy to document is that according to this Press Release, Laramie and Grand were the last routes out of Chicago that became accessible, which was in 2001 after A and C got Novas. Obviously, some garage was running some nonaccessible bus (either a Flyer or 4000, since that was all that was left) on those routes before then.

They were using the 4900 narrow RTS, which were not lift fitted, on Grand & Laramie before they transferred to 103rd in 2000/1 for the University of Chicago routes (170-173).

[Wolfman]

I dont recall the MANs ever having cameras.

Back in the very early '90s, the 4260 series (4260 - 4264) were the first buses retrofitted with cameras and recorders. They were at North Park, and toured the system. I remember them at 103d when I was in supervision.

There was actually a rumor that not all five buses had "real" cameras. Leave it to CTA to install fakes and leave people to THINK they were under surveillance!

[BusHunter]

Both sets of interior pictures indicate that these and the 4000s had the same seats as the New Looks, and here, more than the 4000s, having the pads replaced with the black wooden inserts.

5750 mentioning North Ave. being closed, reminded me....

Near the end (i.e. around 2001), weren't some 9800s at Chicago Garage, out of the "last reported at 77th" group? I remember some on 65 Grand.

After checking my notes, I see that you were correct about flyers at Chicago in 2001. These were buses previously from 77th, Fg and Archer that Fg sent to Chicago as they no longer needed them around June 2001. If you wanted to know what was transferred I have a list of buses.

Transferring to FG from 77th began 1/2001 starting out with #9957, #9958, #9960 - #9962, #9964 , #9966 and #9972. Later on in Feb and March, a few more from 77th showed up including #9949, #9970 and #9974. In late march and early April the archer buses started showing up at FG. on 3/28 I have #9800 from 77th, #9813, #9828, #9830 from 77th, #9835, #9843 from 77th. On 4/10 #9816, on 4/18 #9818, 4/19 #9851 all from archer. By the end of April Fg had #9800, #9802, #9810, #9813, #9814, #9816, #9818, #9819, #9828, #9829, #9830, #9832, #9833, #9835, #9839, #9838, #9851, #9853, #9948, #9957-58, #9960-62, #9964, #9967, #9969, #9971, #9972 along with what was left of what they had. Fg only needed around 43 buses at that time. Then in June 2001 Chicago received #9856, #9865, #9867, #9850, #9925 and #9828 - #9831. Most of those retired there. on 6/18 #9830, #9850 came back to Fg. In June 2001, Fg had #9800, #9832, #9839, #9837, #9851, #9890, #9891, #9895, #9896, #9907, #9908, #9914, #9921, #9940, #9961, #9970, #1606, #1610, #1611, #1613, #1604, #1621, #1620. Then most of those retired by Aug leaving about 12 left. Last buses included #1606 0n 8/10, #9832 on 8/27, and #1620 on 9/11.

[Busjack]

I had previously posted that I had forgotten the 4900s, and the 9800 must have been a loaner, but given BusHunter's subsequent post, I deleted that.

His last post is still swimming in my head, but there was some substance to my observation.

[BusHunter]

I had previously posted that I had forgotten the 4900s, and the 9800 must have been a loaner, but given BusHunter's subsequent post, I deleted that.

His last post is still swimming in my head, but there was some substance to my observation.

Yes, I probably should have been more thorough with the original list. The way it currently is, it makes it appear the late #9900's retired at 77th. I'll try to update it on here in time. The trouble with being too thorough is you end up with a big long list. You'll see what I mean with the #5300's. I have 9 pages of assignments. 3 or 4 of retirements. But at least every change is documented, so it's more precise.

[qwantae]

I drove the MAN Americanas out of all three garages I worked at K, NP and FG. I dont recall the MANs ever having cameras. I guess since they were so close to retirement.

I do recall seeing MANs stray away from their non lift routes while at FG. I have seen them on Irving Pk, Belmont.

FG wasn't the only one: While 103rd had their Americanas, I always caught few of them working #28-Stony Island/ #34-South Michigan. And only couple months before their final retirement in 2004, I caught North Park Americana working #147-Outer Drive Exp.

[BusHunter]

I updated the 2001 assignments to the first post in this thread, so it is more detailed.

[Guest]

After checking my notes, I see that you were correct about flyers at Chicago in 2001. These were buses previously from 77th, Fg and Archer that Fg sent to Chicago as they no longer needed them around June 2001. If you wanted to know what was transferred I have a list of buses.

Transferring to FG from 77th began 1/2001 starting out with #9957, #9958, #9960 - #9962, #9964 , #9966 and #9972. Later on in Feb and March, a few more from 77th showed up including #9949, #9970 and #9974. In late march and early April the archer buses started showing up at FG. on 3/28 I have #9800 from 77th, #9813, #9828, #9830 from 77th, #9835, #9843 from 77th. On 4/10 #9816, on 4/18 #9818, 4/19 #9851 all from archer. By the end of April Fg had #9800, #9802, #9810, #9813, #9814, #9816, #9818, #9819, #9828, #9829, #9830, #9832, #9833, #9835, #9839, #9838, #9851, #9853, #9948, #9957-58, #9960-62, #9964, #9967, #9969, #9971, #9972 along with what was left of what they had. Fg only needed around 43 buses at that time. Then in June 2001 Chicago received #9856, #9865, #9867, #9850, #9925 and #9828 - #9831. Most of those retired there. on 6/18 #9830, #9850 came back to Fg. In June 2001, Fg had #9800, #9832, #9839, #9837, #9851, #9890, #9891, #9895, #9896, #9907, #9908, #9914, #9921, #9940, #9961, #9970, #1606, #1610, #1611, #1613, #1604, #1621, #1620. Then most of those retired by Aug leaving about 12 left. Last buses included #1606 0n 8/10, #9832 on 8/27, and #1620 on 9/11.

I remember a Flyer bus transfer I took part in in 1997. We took five lower 9800s from Kedzie to 103. I do have record of this transfer since I would always record my daily activities, Run, Bus Number, Route, etc... while at CTA. I would have to look it up.

[BusHunter]

I remember a Flyer bus transfer I took part in in 1997. We took five lower 9800s from Kedzie to 103. I do have record of this transfer since I would always record my daily activities, Run, Bus Number, Route, etc... while at CTA. I would have to look it up.

Are you speaking of the #9880 - #9844 bunch? 103rd must not have kept the buses, because I don't have them in service anywhere around 103rd, but your info sounds interesting nonetheless.

[Busjack]

I remember a Flyer bus transfer I took part in in 1997. We took five lower 9800s from Kedzie to 103. I do have record of this transfer since I would always record my daily activities, Run, Bus Number, Route, etc... while at CTA. I would have to look it up.

I'm certainly not going to question your personal experience, but by then Kedzie and 103 were predominantly MAN, as far as old buses went, and as indicated in the Garage Assignments posted at the top of the thread.

The other thing that hit me as strange was that, while visiting, I would occasionally see a MAN on like 87th, but according to this, and also what Bill V. says, when 103rd opened, 77th got Beverly's Flyers and 103 got 77th's MANs. In around 1995 (before it was classified as accessible, when the 6000s were delivered), I couldn't figure out how there could be enough Flyers to run 4 Cottage Grove, which was predominantly that.

BTW: A hint for those of you who find the images too small to read: The popups when clicking on an image are useless, but if you right click on the image, and select "Open Link in New Tab" or Window, a spyglass cursor appears, and the image is then large enough to read.

[Guest]

Are you speaking of the #9880 - #9844 bunch? 103rd must not have kept the buses, because I don't have them in service anywhere around 103rd, but your info sounds interesting nonetheless.

I remember the buses being in the 9830-9840 range. I remember back then, if memory serves me, we did have most of #9840 Flyers #9840,9842,9843,9844,9846,9847,9848,9849,9850. 9845???

[Guest]

I'm certainly not going to question your personal experience, but by then Kedzie and 103 were predominantly MAN, as far as old buses went, and as indicated in the Garage Assignments posted at the top of the thread.

The other thing that hit me as strange was that, while visiting, I would occasionally see a MAN on like 87th, but according to this, and also what Bill V. says, when 103rd opened, 77th got Beverly's Flyers and 103 got 77th's MANs. In around 1995 (before it was classified as accessible, when the 6000s were delivered), I couldn't figure out how there could be enough Flyers to run 4 Cottage Grove, which was predominantly that.

BTW: A hint for those of you who find the images too small to read: The popups when clicking on an image are useless, but if you right click on the image, and select "Open Link in New Tab" or Window, a spyglass cursor appears, and the image is then large enough to read.

When I reported to Kedzie Garage in 1997, at the time we did have small fleet of Flyer D901s, they werent there for long. The garage was mostly MAN #4000 series Americanas and #6100/6200 series Flxibles. In 1998 Kedzie got some familiar buses back, If I remember correctly, to replace the Flyers, we began recieving high #4400, low 4500 series TMC RTS buses. This was about the time Kedzie was adding more lift routes. I will look up what I have on record. Ill dig out my old CTA library. I kept record of my time at Kedzie, my short time at North Park and my time at Forest Glen. Ill see what I can share. Personally, when left Kedzie in 1999, I knew I was going to miss the #6000s, I really enjoyed driving those buses because they were still new then. I missed driving the Flyers a lot when we shipped them out. I would have Flyers on Kimball school trips, on saturdays and when I would drive #156 Lasalle. The lower Wacker Express routes I would get mostly Flx 6000s. I did get to drive Flyer #9844 once on a saturday run on Kimball. But as I stated earlier, by then it was re-equpipped with a regular Detroit Diesel and subsequently wrecked in an accident on Warren Blvd. I enjoyed the Flyers, it was an easy bus to drive, but in the summer they were brutal to be in because of the lack of a/c.

[Wolfman]

I thought you'd like to get a snapshot of one of these Flyers when they were brand new!

9902 on a long forgotten OSA Fantrip on the far South Side (I'm thinking Hehewisch).

9902 was assigned to North Avenue, but I worked out of Forest Glen then.

Yes, that's yours truly at the wheel...with my 1984 Bus Roadeo cap.

I'll post a couple more...