Pace/CTA North Shore Coordination Plan

[Sam92]

26 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

Welcome back.   You have been sorely missed. 

Now to find jajuan 

[artthouwill]

1 minute ago, Sam92 said:

Now to find jajuan 

He has been around but doesn't post much.

[jajuan]

On 1/15/2022 at 9:50 PM, Sam92 said:

Now to find jajuan 

 

On 1/15/2022 at 9:52 PM, artthouwill said:

He has been around but doesn't post much.

I'm back. Work has really had me busy since shortly before the holidays. But it's starting to settle down some for me to have more time to post more.

[Busjack]

10 hours ago, strictures said:

Once a month I ride the 422 from Linden west to Ridge in Wilmette & the reverse.  There have never been more than four people aboard when I ride it in the morning, in reverse rush hours.

Here's the topic for that. As indicated above, 422 west of The Glen is unlikely to survive.

What's more interesting is that your observation is on the traditional segment of 422 in Wilmette, which was a Wilbus to Old Orchard. The existing plan is to retain it to Glenview, but 422 and the part of 423 north of Glenview are essentially school routes.

[jajuan]

Is there any indication of whether the service boards have gotten back on track with this plan? I know the pandemic put things on hold, but at that point they were already two years beyond the initial two years they were touting for just getting to to the recommendation stage before even getting to phase 1. Who'd have thought seven years later they'd still be paused at the first phase? And to think, some were saying two years was too long just to get recommendations for getting how to get this going. ?

[artthouwill]

40 minutes ago, jajuan said:

Is there any indication of whether the service boards have gotten back on track with this plan? I know the pandemic put things on hold, but at that point they were already two years beyond the initial two years they were touting for just getting to to the recommendation stage before even getting to phase 1. Who'd have thought seven years later they'd still be paused at the first phase? And to think, some were saying two years was too long just to get recommendations for getting how to get this going. ?

I'm pretty sure whatever plan they were drafting before the pandemic is out the window now.  A replacement garage for NW is in limbo for now.  I wonder if any any plans for restructuring might include the closure of NS, which would probably be somewhat dependent on a new NW garage.  I don't know if ridership justifies running the 423 and the 626.  I would think that NS could close of River and West could absorb some NW routes.  Right now both agencies are prioritizing electrification,  and it seems like the Halsted and 95th corridors will get attention before this coordination process gets going. 

[Busjack]

2 hours ago, jajuan said:

Is there any indication of whether the service boards have gotten back on track with this plan? I know the pandemic put things on hold, but at that point they were already two years beyond the initial two years they were touting for just getting to to the recommendation stage before even getting to phase 1. Who'd have thought seven years later they'd still be paused at the first phase? And to think, some were saying two years was too long just to get recommendations for getting how to get this going. ?

As noted several times before, this got subsumed in the Driving Innovation process (before COVID) , and is now also undoubtedly subject to the Network Revitalization process.

CTA got what it wanted out of Phase 1 (205 terminated). Going into Phase 2, Pace said it didn't have the resources to take over any more CTA routes (primarily 54A).

As @artthouwillindicated above, there's a lot in limbo or silently pushed under the carpet.

[jajuan]

3 hours ago, artthouwill said:

I'm pretty sure whatever plan they were drafting before the pandemic is out the window now.  A replacement garage for NW is in limbo for now.  I wonder if any any plans for restructuring might include the closure of NS, which would probably be somewhat dependent on a new NW garage.  I don't know if ridership justifies running the 423 and the 626.  I would think that NS could close of River and West could absorb some NW routes.  Right now both agencies are prioritizing electrification,  and it seems like the Halsted and 95th corridors will get attention before this coordination process gets going. 

I kind of figured other items were kicking a lot of things to the back burner.

1 hour ago, Busjack said:

As noted several times before, this got subsumed in the Driving Innovation process (before COVID) , and is now also undoubtedly subject to the Network Revitalization process.

CTA got what it wanted out of Phase 1 (205 terminated). Going into Phase 2, Pace said it didn't have the resources to take over any more CTA routes (primarily 54A).

As @artthouwillindicated above, there's a lot in limbo or silently pushed under the carpet.

Being a rider of CTA much more than I make any use of Pace and I don't always see any news regarding Pace. And like you, I've had a bit of a hiatus away from the forum in the last couple of years before getting a bit more active again earlier this year. So for those reasons I did not see those prior reports, and therefore the response could have been given with a bit less snarkiness. ? Either way thank you both for the responses. COVID has had TAs rethinking how they deliver service and in some cases sparking moves restructure bus route networks be they big city TAs or smaller town and suburban ones where distinct TAs exist separate from those serving their respective big cities. That made me curious about if any form of this plan or others still coming about at some point two big premises for it was better utilization of resources and more efficiently structuring service to demand as the pandemic has been forcing TAs to sooner and more quickly than originally planned if they had planned to do so at all before the pandemic hit. One thing I've noticed, as a quick aside, is other TAs' versions of X-routes taking hits by either being eliminated completely or becoming less express in structure, if they survive, by way of the TAs merging them with their adjacent local routes. 

[Busjack]

On 8/16/2024 at 11:08 AM, Tcmetro said:

This is what I inferred from the "Plus 10" scenario.

Seems like there's a few things going on here; 1 - a complete revision of the North Shore plan....

• 215: Looks to be kept in place instead of going to Jefferson Park and replacing the 54A.

...

• 422: Northbrook to Old Orchard.
• 423: This looks like it could be 30 min service on Harlem, branching hourly to Glenbrook Hospital and hourly to Willow Rd/Linden CTA.

While those inferences can be drawn. going up the thread (or me going through my memory)  indicates that the plan, as originally conceived, was already dead:

• Pace's statement that it didn't have the resources to implement the 215/225/226/641 piece (see here).
• The political uproar when, after originally planning that 422 would go up Patriot Blvd. to Glen Metra, and new 424 would be via existing 423 (Linden-Northfield) to Glen Metra  and then to Northbrook Court, Pace published a Phase 2 saying there would be no service to the Glen and Northbrook.
• Subsequent correspondence (noted here) that anything would be within the Driving Innovation framework and "continued assessment of the post-pandemic demand for bus service" (in short, ReVision).

[Busjack]

2 hours ago, TaylorTank1229 said:

Yeah. The 215 extension was for that CTA/Pace North Shore Coordination Plan, right? And it’s been years since the latest change took effect… which I think was the 215 (or partially took effect with buses going down Church Street instead of Golf Road). So I assume that project dead/abandoned at this point? 

 

1 hour ago, Sam92 said:

Maybe on hold since COVID hit before they could finalize the later phases. The biggest elephant in the room seemed to be getting rid of #205 which was inefficient compared to rerouting 208/213. Also pace made changes to 421-423 in response to the creation of 205 which added travel times so maybe since that route is gone other things might have taken priority with the pandemic limiting everything 🤷

Reply in the proper topic (has nothing to do with CTA 53).

Essentially, yes it was part of the North Shore Coordination Plan (see above).

Hung up because:

• Changes to 422/423 ran into severe political opposition because Plan 2 for Phase 2 would have cut service in Northbrook and Glenview without any workshops there (nearest one was in Lincolnwood, and when I went there and mentioned 422, Ms. CTA looked dumbfounded, and Mr Pace said to fill out a comment card).
• Having (1) implemented 213 to Howard, and 208 on Golf between Skokie Blvd. and McCormick, eliminating 205 , and (2) the only part of Phase 2--moving 215 to Church between Skokie Blvd. and Crawford, Pace said it ran out of resources and couldn't do the rest of Phase 2, including 215 and proposed 641 between Jefferson Park and Old Orchard.
• When COVID hit, Pace either suspended routes or kept the routes with reduced frequencies, so, 215, 422, and 423 remained as is.
• Anything post-Covid was stated to come under the Driving Innovation, ReVision, and Jarrett Walker framework.

Again, among my reasons for saying let NITA take care of it. At the last Pace board meeting, when more money was authorized for Walker, including to plan cuts, Dir. Smith said "delay has its costs," and these furtive planning costs are part of that.