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Novabus LF and Gillig Low Floors


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Left rear? don't all of the 05's look the same?

What are you talking about? Gene was referring to the fact that the Novas (and Orion VIs, for that matter), because they were supposedly "true low floors" had the engine in a closet on the left side of the bus, instead of under the rear seats.
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  • 1 month later...

From Venom_20: 1993-94 flxible metro(last ones made in usa)

From sw4400: Those weren't the last ones made in the usa. the 6000-6329 series CTA Flxibles were(1995).

I hope that I don't come across like a bus snob but actually neither of you are correct. Trying to pin down the last Flxible bus is actually a pretty confusing task. The last Flxible buses officially delivered (all Metro models of course) were part of an order for 25 buses for Baltimore, MD however the factory closed in 1995 before they all could be built. Only 19 of the buses ever made it to Baltimore, they are serial #'s 106487 - 106505. I believe that these buses are still in operation today as Baltimore MTA's 9521-9539. I had read on an enthusiasts web site one time that it was rumored that 3 or 4 more buses of this order were partially completed in the Flxible factory but were never finished. I do not know for sure the final disposition of those buses or if they ever actually existed in the first place. In spite of the Baltimore order, the last buses to actually leave the factory were 8 units for Monterey, CA serial #'s 106158 - 106165. As if this wasn't confusing enough the highest actual serial number for an Flxible bus is 106591 that is the last bus in an order for COTA in Columbus, Ohio. So, depending on what criteria you use, the last bus could be any one of these buses.:cool:

Information sourced from: "Flxible: A History of the Bus and the Company" by Robert R. Ebert Ph.D. & "The Baltimore Transit Archives" http://www.btco.net/index2.html

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I just found out that Novabus finished Pat's order of Flx's. In other words, they built the rest of Pat's Flxibles #2450-2595 with gaps in the numbering. I don't know the serial#'s, but These were apparently built after the plant had closed by Novabus. So could we actually have the last ones made?

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in post 17:

1993-94 flxible metro(last ones made in usa)

immediately above:

I just found out that Novabus finished Pat's order of Flx's. In other words, they built the rest of Pat's Flxibles #2450-2595 with gaps in the numbering. I don't know the serial#'s, but These were apparently built after the plant had closed by Novabus. So could we actually have the last ones made?

If so, you would have to change your chronology, since CTA's were delivered in 1995 (see the roster page), also I remember the deliveries occuring at 74th (buses showing up at Midway) in about September 1995. I remember at the time that Nova assumed a Cleveland contract from Flxible, but that was to supply RTSs, in their 9700 series. Flxible's assets were liquidated, not assumed by Nova (see Bus Explorer). Also, I had previously provided a link to a presentation the president of Flxible made to the FTA in September 1995, so it wasn't out of business in 1994.
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Possible, but why would Flxible contract that part out, and then build about 400 subsequent buses?

I am not wrong that Flxible was liquidated, and did not sell out to Nova. In any event, that would have happened in 1995 or 1996, not 1994. (If you want to pursue it more, try Googling "General Automotive Corporation" + bankruptcy the results of which are consistent with what I remember).

In any event, there is the undeniable fact that there are 330 1995 Flxibles operating in Chicago.

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I totaly agree with you. I don't know why Novabus finished them.  I'm guessing it was because of Chicago and Baltimore's orders. Pgh wanted more Flxibles, but with the plant closing ended up going to Novabus the very next year for 95/96 order.

The last 140 flx's we have have the same seating arrangement, wiring, placement of the destination sign control panel, and driver's control as the Nova classics that we have.

I think that we have about 290 Flx's #'s 2300-2595 with Novabus finishing #'s 2450-2595. 2300-2449 Are Metro D's, And 2450-2595 are Metro E's

I'll post some pics with the differences between the E's/D's and the comparison to the Nova classics and the E series if  you want.

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If so, you would have to change your chronology...

According to Wikipedia's Port Authority of Allegheny County article (if it is accurate), maybe the problem is your chronology.

I don't know what Pittsburgh's fascination with having the last is; their Nova Classics are contemporaneous with those of Pace, Buffalo, and Rochester. Some roster sites say that Pace has the last or among the last Orion Is and VIs, but I don't see any one excited about that.

Anyway, according to Wikipedia's Flxible article, it doesn't appear that the reason Flxible went bankrupt was lack of orders.

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I'm not infactuated with us having the last ones anymore. That's been proven that we don't.

But, you are right about the chronology. The last flx's built for pgh were in 95. The Novas came in 96.

Here's a link to the all time bus roster for Pat. Pittsburgh's bus roster

Some of Wikipedia's roster is not accurate.

The Neoplan Low-floor transliners are 99's, not year 2000.

The Gillig advantages #5501-5592 aren't even here yet. Also, these buses will have CAT C-9 engines in them since the dd50 has been discontinued. The 5200's, 5300's, and 5400's have dd50's in them.

His roster says The 2005 Neoplan 60ft artics are #3101-3123, I just got off of #3125 on the 71d route.

And of course, we don't have the last Flx's.

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  • 1 year later...
  • 16 years later...
On 8/23/2016 at 4:37 PM, andrethebusman said:

Gilligs exist in more cities than any other make of bus. New Flyer tends to have the bigger orders, but Gillig has more customers.

...

 

Since the question came up what volume of business ENC had compared to NF, I came across this article that in 2017, "Gillig is the last bus company wholly owned and made in America, and produces 1,800 buses a year. " A more recent Livermore puff piece says "...Gillig, the largest manufacturer of heavy-duty transit buses in the U.S. ..."

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