CTA Bus And Rail Ridership

[Busjack]

..and are essentially guaranteed of hitting the Glen after leaving time, so now you are guaranteed a 10-minute delay next trip. It all becomes cumulative. ...Weekdays and Saturdays are a lot better as for realistic running time, but Sundays are a real bear in this city.

It wouldn't make that much difference if buses were running every 10 minutes, but the Sunday schedule is 18. Thus, instead of some bus (even if 2 trips late) showing up at :10, it could show up at :18 (as scheduled) :28 or whatever.

I would also be pretty sure that riders on Central north of Fullerton are discretionary, so that hits the passenger count pretty immediately.

I had difficulty comprehending why Pace waits at all time points, but this explains it.

[andrethebusman]

I had difficulty comprehending why Pace waits at all time points, but this explains it.

PACE timepoints are leaving times. CTA timepoints (except on FG routes) are arrival times. Most transit systems use leaving times. CTA is considering changing, but so far only FG has been changed.

[Busjack]

I had difficulty comprehending why Pace waits at all time points, but this explains it.

PACE timepoints are leaving times. CTA timepoints (except on FG routes) are arrival times. Most transit systems use leaving times. CTA is considering changing, but so far only FG has been changed.

The only point was my observation that a bus could be 4 minutes late based on a prior time point in the printed schedule, but still sitting at the next time point because it was 3 minutes ahead there, apparently due to recovery time. For instance, 423 is supposed to be at Patriot-Navy Dr. at 5:11 and Chestnut-Lehigh at 5:14, but shows up at Patriot-Chestnut at 5:17, but still sits at Glenview Metra until 5:23.

The weirdest example I saw of something like this was a 422 parked in the center lane of Shermer Road, because it was early for the Metra station timepoint there, not that it was going to pick up any passengers.

Your comment only explains why there aren't "Ar. Metra" and a "Lv. Metra" columns, and maybe the nonsensical entries on the 221 schedule that some buses depart Cumberland Metra but not arrive there, even though the bus had to get there somehow from Oakton and Wolf. But that must just be a screw up, because some of the departing buses do not go northbound, and what is listed as the northbound departure time is also listed as the southbound departure time. Others (mostly in the afternoon) do continue north.

[MRM]

I am looking for a sources on CTA ridership history. RTAMS has 1980 and onward. I found the CATS has from 1901 to 1959, but could use more detail. Can anyone point me to 1960 to 1980?? Also looking for commuter rail and suburban bus prior to 1980. Also, just found this from Northwestern. 

Thanks. 

[sw4400]

I know this has been explained, but super-crowded buses are a big turn-off.

• 77 Belmont: Route gets crowded when it picks up passengers at the Kimball Blue Line Station. A typical 40' bus gets passengers with all seats filled, all standing room taken and people standing up to both the front and rear doors. Remedy: More 40' buses with frequent service(8-10 minute headways) or a few 60' buses during peak ridership points when a lot of people wait for the Belmont bus at the Kimball Blue Line Station.
• 152 Addison: Rout gets crowded from September-June between 3p and 4p as Lane Tech lets out. Kids start piling on the buses WB at Oakley, Western and Campbell. When you're trying to get off the bus, you usually have to either politely ask the kids to let you by, or yell if they are ignoring you because they're talking about their day in school and what they're doing later or on the weekend. Sometimes you have to be the Bus Operator and tell those who are congregated up front to move to the rear when you see daylight and they seem to not. I don't work for the CTA! Remedy: A lot more 40' buses with 8-10 minutes between. Maybe a Cumberland, Harlem and Central run. And get a few more North Park Artic runs. 60' buses will make for faster, less crowded service during the peak times. We know how crowded Addison gets during Cubs games and other events and Wrigley Field, but that is usually taken care of by proper bus allocation on the route starting about 2 hours before game/event time.

If a bus pulled up to you at your stop and there was just enough room to be a front door sandwich, would you squeeze on, or would you wait 22 minutes for the next bus, which may get just as crowded with the next group of kids ready to board about 3-5 stops before you?

[Busjack]

23 minutes ago, sw4400 said:

or a few 60' buses during peak ridership points when a lot of people wait for the Belmont bus at the Kimball Blue Line Station.

Unless these are a few specials starting out at the Blue Line, the problems encountered with 66 would appear.

Which raises the question: Is the prepaid boarding area still working?

[BusHunter]

10 hours ago, Busjack said:

Unless these are a few specials starting out at the Blue Line, the problems encountered with 66 would appear.

Which raises the question: Is the prepaid boarding area still working?

Yeah the prepaid boarding is still there. 

@sw4400: Doesn't lane tech still use artics for school extras? So there shouldnt be too much issues with that. Where you can still get hit is at schurz  which only has one extra bus. I believe the same exists at foreman on the #77 cause there might only be the one bus there too. Its really hit and miss. I tell you one thing on the #152 Mark your calender, st pats day falls on a Friday so I know from experience the #152 will be hit unusually hard because everyone heads to the Wrigley bars. You do have the more frequent weekday service, so that might help, if it were saturday you would be talking full loads from the blue line east.

[sw4400]

9 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah the prepaid boarding is still there. 

@sw4400: Doesn't lane tech still use artics for school extras? So there shouldnt be too much issues with that. Where you can still get hit is at schurz  which only has one extra bus. I believe the same exists at foreman on the #77 cause there might only be the one bus there too. Its really hit and miss. I tell you one thing on the #152 Mark your calender, st pats day falls on a Friday so I know from experience the #152 will be hit unusually hard because everyone heads to the Wrigley bars. You do have the more frequent weekday service, so that might help, if it were saturday you would be talking full loads from the blue line east.

Problem is placement @BusHunter. I catch a bus about 3:15p-3:20p WB for work during the school week most days. Every bus I catch is a 40' bus. The 60' buses don't start on Addison until Addison and Campbell, where they stop and load up students there(sometimes there are no artics there and the 40' bus I'm on has to try to cram even more kids on there). The crowding of Lane Tech kids begins at Oakley and Western WB, when we get two large groups of kids boarding a 40' bus. Rough estimate about 18-25 kids at each stop. All the kids from Oakley will board my bus and 75-80% of the kids at Western will board, resulting in kids up against the doors in the front and even in the back. I've had the Operator telling them to stop leaning on the doors as they break the sensor, which prohibits the bus from moving as the door is slightly ajar.

Addison should have artics mixed in beginning at Lake Shore heading WB about 2:45p so the groups at Oakley, Western and Campbell get picked up by a bus more capable of the crowds. FG and NP Supervisors should be able to get together and plan this out accordingly. The majority of the kids will probably get off well before Central, so run the artics to Central and turn them back EB to Lake Shore, where they can then go back to a NP route that needs them. One partial run WB and EB on Addison, then back to a NP route.

[Busjack]

It hits me that we're discussing two streets with high demand that are too narrow to put more buses on them without super bunching. It isn't like Western where there are 3 lanes each way and there can be some semblance of express service (or at least one bus passing another).

[BusHunter]

No fg addison runs should be picking up at Campbell if they have np artics loading there. That is what they are for. Now if there are no artics, that's a different story. Nothing can be done with riders at Oakley but I don't see why cta couldn't make western wb a far side stop at addison. Then the artics could stop there. Belmont doesn't do that bad from the east plus it has high frequency. I rode that during my early lane tech days and it picks up a handful at Rockwell but basically it just leaves the bus at a full seated load so that may be the better choice if you don't like the crowds.

[renardo870]

On Friday, February 24, 2017 at 9:47 PM, sw4400 said:

I know this has been explained, but super-crowded buses are a big turn-off.

• 77 Belmont: Route gets crowded when it picks up passengers at the Kimball Blue Line Station. A typical 40' bus gets passengers with all seats filled, all standing room taken and people standing up to both the front and rear doors. Remedy: More 40' buses with frequent service(8-10 minute headways) or a few 60' buses during peak ridership points when a lot of people wait for the Belmont bus at the Kimball Blue Line Station.
• 152 Addison: Rout gets crowded from September-June between 3p and 4p as Lane Tech lets out. Kids start piling on the buses WB at Oakley, Western and Campbell. When you're trying to get off the bus, you usually have to either politely ask the kids to let you by, or yell if they are ignoring you because they're talking about their day in school and what they're doing later or on the weekend. Sometimes you have to be the Bus Operator and tell those who are congregated up front to move to the rear when you see daylight and they seem to not. I don't work for the CTA! Remedy: A lot more 40' buses with 8-10 minutes between. Maybe a Cumberland, Harlem and Central run. And get a few more North Park Artic runs. 60' buses will make for faster, less crowded service during the peak times. We know how crowded Addison gets during Cubs games and other events and Wrigley Field, but that is usually taken care of by proper bus allocation on the route starting about 2 hours before game/event time.

If a bus pulled up to you at your stop and there was just enough room to be a front door sandwich, would you squeeze on, or would you wait 22 minutes for the next bus, which may get just as crowded with the next group of kids ready to board about 3-5 stops before you?

Is the ridership on the 77 heavy going EB from Kimball to Lake Shore or heavy WB from the Blue Line to Cumberland and is that AM or PM?

Maybe buses from Kedzie 134/143/151/156 could assist with maybe 1 or 2 trips in the AM to Halsted or Sheridan and serve its regular trip and From Sheridan/Belmont in the PM going as far as Blue Line or Central and DH back to Kedzie? That will be your standard/artic mix. 

For 152 PM trips EB trips from Kimball could be assisted by Kedzie trips goimg to Lake Shore and DH to the Loop and resume their regularly routes and WB from Addison/Red Line or Western to Central and make 1 full trip EB to help with the crowds. I think the AM service levels are decent as they are now.

[jajuan]

18 hours ago, renardo870 said:

Is the ridership on the 77 heavy going EB from Kimball to Lake Shore or heavy WB from the Blue Line to Cumberland and is that AM or PM?

Maybe buses from Kedzie 134/143/151/156 could assist with maybe 1 or 2 trips in the AM to Halsted or Sheridan and serve its regular trip and From Sheridan/Belmont in the PM going as far as Blue Line or Central and DH back to Kedzie? That will be your standard/artic mix. 

For 152 PM trips EB trips from Kimball could be assisted by Kedzie trips goimg to Lake Shore and DH to the Loop and resume their regularly routes and WB from Addison/Red Line or Western to Central and make 1 full trip EB to help with the crowds. I think the AM service levels are decent as they are now.

Kedzie was already doing that along Belmont in the AM rush for a few EB trips along Belmont between Kimball and Halsted as interlined trips with 151 and 156 in recent years. I'm not sure if those trips still exist though in the current pick. The schedule currently has a notation of "every 3 to 9 minutes from Cumberland and every 2 to 5 mins from Octavia" for AM rush EB trips. Plus FG has its own short trips WB in the AM that end at Kimball before deadheading along Kimball and Elston back to the garage.