Pace Electric Buses

[Busjack]

Getting back to this topic, pacebus.com had a link to the presentation to the RTA on electrification.

Somewhat notable:

• Pace will be starting out with analyzing schedule blocks (same as CTA) and will start with blocks that are within current battery range. Most  blocks at North fall within that range, but for the ones that don't (like the block that includes 272), they'll have to do something else (more likely break the block).
• The leased bus is to "play around with." While Pace is getting 20 buses, there was still a reference to 6 at North, so, undoubtedly the other 14 are to be tested elsewhere.
• There is a list of garage priorities. River is next (although I have a question about range on I-90 routes). Note that Plainfield garage is last, but there isn't any Heritage Joliet garage.

[BusHunter]

On 4/24/2022 at 10:49 AM, Busjack said:

Getting back to this topic, pacebus.com had a link to the presentation to the RTA on electrification.

Somewhat notable:

• Pace will be starting out with analyzing schedule blocks (same as CTA) and will start with blocks that are within current battery range. Most  blocks at North fall within that range, but for the ones that don't (like the block that includes 272), they'll have to do something else (more likely break the block).
• The leased bus is to "play around with." While Pace is getting 20 buses, there was still a reference to 6 at North, so, undoubtedly the other 14 are to be tested elsewhere.
• There is a list of garage priorities. River is next (although I have a question about range on I-90 routes). Note that Plainfield garage is last, but there isn't any Heritage Joliet garage.

River you would think would have alot smaller electric buses. Can the whole I-90 operation be moved to dundee or even more wild to wheeling? That would solve I-90 for now. Eventually they will have that problem. 

Funny Plainfield wasn't mentioned as they have the charger for the gillig bus. But it's more because electric mcis would really break the bank right now. 

[Busjack]

37 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

River you would think would have alot smaller electric buses. Can the whole I-90 operation be moved to dundee or even more wild to wheeling? That would solve I-90 for now. Eventually they will have that problem. 

Funny Plainfield wasn't mentioned as they have the charger for the gillig bus. But it's more because electric mcis would really break the bank right now. 

I don't know how many times it has been said that East Dundee is rented space, and one of the capital projects is to more than double the River Garage in S. Elgin. That's also mentioned about here in the RTA video. The whole I-90 operation is being moved to S. Elgin. Small buses might still be appropriate for local Elgin service, but not 606 and I-90 service.

And I don't see how you can say Plainfield was not mentioned. It is clearly at the bottom of the indicated slide. And, as mentioned earlier, the charger for there is from Proterra.

You have to get your brain into gear.

[Busjack]

33 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

But I dont recall you saying that River is doubling in space. When??? How??? Must be both projects will coordinate together. The electric and expansion.

Exactly what's happening, according to Metzger in the cited video. There had been previous indications at board meetings, including purchase of adjoining property, requests for engineering services (including that the River expansion should have enough capacity for 40 Elgin buses plus a number of paratransits, 27 East Dundee buses plus a number of paratransits, plus expansion), and a request to have the adjoining property annexed to Elgin.

39 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Also you have no idea what routes are going to Wheeling do you, so you cant say what is going where unless you are a subscriber to the psychic friends network.

I'm not psychic, but there are certain tea leaves, such as Wheeling having a stated capacity of 135, which doesn't seem enough for the 27 buses plus paratransits at East Dundee, the capital plans, which said what express and Pulse lines would be served by each garage project, and references to the Wheeling Northwest Division, as opposed to the Plainfield Heritage Division. There may be adjustments, such as 272 going back to NW, but NW is going to be NW.

[BusHunter]

We don't know what Wheelings getting for Dempster pulse. I haven't heard a bus procurement for that. Might be the 5 at south will be coming north with what they already have but they don't fit the cng demographic. Maybe most run out of north shore. They are mixed in all this too. 

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, BusHunter said:

We don't know what Wheelings getting for Dempster pulse. I haven't heard a bus procurement for that.

YOU don't know and YOU haven't heard, but the rest of us have.

The January 2022 minutes state:

SBD #22-07 – Ordinance authorizing the award of a contract to ElDorado National (California),
Inc. for compressed natural gas (CNG) fixed route buses, in an amount not to exceed
$75,896,625.00.

You can look in the Board Video and see that it includes 20 Pulse buses.

This was discussed in the proper forum, but somehow (I'm going to PM to further this--that was until you blocked PM).
 

 

[BusHunter]

On 4/21/2022 at 10:00 AM, BusHunter said:

Ok your right.? But guess what I'm right. ? Listen to the first link you put up about them receiving the gillig bus. They said the bus is coming on May 9th and the charger from them (gillig) is coming on May 3rd. But then in your latest link they say Proterra charger. Could be the Gillig is temporary while the Proterra charger is permanent.

Kind of surprised no news outlet mentioned this yesterday. Did the bus not show up? 

[artthouwill]

4 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Kind of surprised no news outlet mentioned this yesterday. Did the bus not show up? 

In guessing the Gillig bus is for Plainfield garage?  But Plainfield isn't open yet  so probably no need for it to show up there yet.  If Pace received the bus, it might be in South Holland.   Pace could have also delayed the arrival of the Gillug until the opening of the Plainfield garage 

[Busjack]

29 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

In guessing the Gillig bus is for Plainfield garage?  But Plainfield isn't open yet  so probably no need for it to show up there yet.  If Pace received the bus, it might be in South Holland.   Pace could have also delayed the arrival of the Gillug until the opening of the Plainfield garage 

Again if you go above and thr board meeting video, they said that the Gillig was to "play with." Nothing about Plainfield.

[BusHunter]

Again then they must not be at Pace at all because a news worthy event does not have to involve Plainfield. Stick to the facts.

[artthouwill]

According to the Pace board Meeting this morning,  the Gillig bus was delivered to the Pace Acceptance Facility in South Holland on May 9th.  The bus stayed there and Gillig provided 3 days of training. Today the bus is at Pace Headquarters for the board to see.  According to Melinda Metzger, at some point this bus will go back to Gillig so they can use it for some upcoming shows.  Sometime near the end of the year, Pace plans to purchase the bus from Gillig  and after Gillug wraps the bus and performs maintenance,  Gillig will return the bus to Pace. 

I would imagine during this stay, the bus is being kept at South Holland. 

[BusHunter]

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

According to the Pace board Meeting this morning,  the Gillig bus was delivered to the Pace Acceptance Facility in South Holland on May 9th.  The bus stayed there and Gillig provided 3 days of training. Today the bus is at Pace Headquarters for the board to see.  According to Melinda Metzger, at some point this bus will go back to Gillig so they can use it for some upcoming shows.  Sometime near the end of the year, Pace plans to purchase the bus from Gillig  and after Gillug wraps the bus and performs maintenance,  Gillig will return the bus to Pace. 

I would imagine during this stay, the bus is being kept at South Holland. 

https://chi.streetsblog.org/2022/05/15/pace-is-field-testing-a-lesed-electric-bus-will-probably-cancel-redundant-pace-metra-plusbus-pass/

A streets blog link gives some more info on the Gillig bus. Surprised they are gonna buy the bus. 

I smell a little surprise maybe. I wonder. Pace already bought 20 proterras, so that might be a done deal, but why not buy 25 -32 Gilligs??? CTA is doing that sort of testing electric Novas. Not good to put your eggs in one basket. 

[Busjack]

On 5/11/2022 at 6:31 AM, BusHunter said:

Again then they must not be at Pace at all because a news worthy event does not have to involve Plainfield. Stick to the facts.

 

4 hours ago, artthouwill said:

According to the Pace board Meeting this morning,  the Gillig bus was delivered to the Pace Acceptance Facility in South Holland on May 9th. 

 

So, sticking to the facts, the bus was there as previously represented.

3 hours ago, BusHunter said:

I smell a little surprise maybe. I wonder. Pace already bought 20 proterras, so that might be a done deal, but why not buy 25 -32 Gilligs???

To say for the 2,348th time, Pace is getting its hands on whatever production it can get. All CTA has received so far from Nova is one touring demonstrator, too.

[Busjack]

The Press Release announcing the Gillig bus.

BTW, this is how Pace has always done it: Metzger and the board members standing in front of the bus.

 

 

[NewFlyerMCI]

On 5/19/2022 at 8:13 PM, Busjack said:

The Press Release announcing the Gillig bus.

BTW, this is how Pace has always done it: Metzger and the board members standing in front of the bus.

 

 

Jeez, that wrap makes it look like COTA’s buses. 

It’ll be interesting to see if Pace eventually ends up buying these, especially now that ElDorado has a BEB bus in 32’, 35’ and 40’ configs. I also wonder if this is the same wrap/livery that they’ll use for the Georgia Proterras

[artthouwill]

13 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Jeez, that wrap makes it look like COTA’s buses. 

It’ll be interesting to see if Pace eventually ends up buying these, especially now that ElDorado has a BEB bus in 32’, 35’ and 40’ configs. I also wonder if this is the same wrap/livery that they’ll use for the Georgia Proterras

We know Pace is buying at least one Gillig electric which is the bus Pace currently has.  

[Busjack]

 

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Jeez, that wrap makes it look like COTA’s buses. 

...

I also wonder if this is the same wrap/livery that they’ll use for the Georgia Proterras

As was noted in the Board meeting video,* the eventual wrap will be the following:

________________________

*I cited, perhaps incorrectly, in the Ravinia topic, on the subject of misleading art work.

[NewFlyerMCI]

On 5/23/2022 at 2:33 PM, Busjack said:

 

As was noted in the Board meeting video,* the eventual wrap will be the following:

________________________

*I cited, perhaps incorrectly, in the Ravinia topic, on the subject of misleading art work.

Every alternative livery Pace has ever displayed, bar the stadium ones, has been disappointing, so I suppose this should come as no surprise

[Busjack]

10 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Every alternative livery Pace has ever displayed, bar the stadium ones, has been disappointing, so I suppose this should come as no surprise

I'm not sure what is the fixation with blue and green, but this at least boldly conveys that it is an electric bus.

[Busjack]

On 5/23/2022 at 12:09 PM, NewFlyerMCI said:

Jeez, that wrap makes it look like COTA’s buses.

The Gillig battery electric page (below) appears to show the same  or a similar wrap, except with "pace" instead of Gillig back of the back door.

 

[artthouwill]

On 5/24/2022 at 5:04 PM, Busjack said:

I'm not sure what is the fixation with blue and green, but this at least boldly conveys that it is an electric bus.

Maybe the Green is supposed to convey "Environmental Friendly. "

[NewFlyerMCI]

4 hours ago, Busjack said:

The Gillig battery electric page (below) appears to show the same  or a similar wrap, except with "pace" instead of Gillig back of the back door.

 

Gillig makes it clear that’s an American flag motif, not sure what Pace is doing with those colors other than ~wavy~

[Busjack]

Just now, NewFlyerMCI said:

Gillig makes it clear that’s an American flag motif, not sure what Pace is doing with those colors other than ~wavy~

The impression given from the meeting is that it wasn't what Pace wanted, because Metzger said they would rewrap it when they buy it.

[Busjack]

At about here in the Planning/Infrastructure meeting, Metzger discussed funding opportunities, and that River is supposed to get 5 electric paratransits.

The consultants discussed the various complexities in converting to electric buses, and said they did their modeling on the basis that Heritage would be in Plainfield, and that Wheeling would have the same blocks as Des Plaines has now, but with the deadhead from Wheeling.

[BusHunter]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbsnews.com/amp/chicago/news/pace-set-to-begin-rolling-out-electric-buses-this-fall/

Saw this story on CBS about the electric buses. In the video they state the gillig electric bus will be out on the streets in November and the Proterra buses starting in March 2023. They asked the Pace rep how long a full run can be in miles and she said 300. The bus had 100 and something. What will it have in the winter??? They will either need line chargers or they are gonna have to switch the bus out after a few trips. All indications are charging equipment will just be at the garage.

Wow she said the bus had 126 miles on it and that is 76 percent charged. Wow that doesn't sound like too much. The proterras are supposed to be 300. You have to account for a loss of miles in the winter as the batteries will discharge faster. I don't know about the gillig. Maybe for a small run only.