Pulse (Milwaukee Avenue Route)

[west towns]

A few things I thought the Harvey tsp is wireless not the type fire dept use. Second what if the reporter mistaken control center for control box which is how the fire dept systems work. The control box changes the signals not a control center

[Busjack]

A few things I thought the Harvey tsp is wireless not the type fire dept use. Second what if the reporter mistaken control center for control box which is how the fire dept systems work. The control box changes the signals not a control center

That could be, and I assumed too much. I did know that they didn't use the fire department ones.

[Busjack]

Also: new Jeff Park bus bay assignments: http://www.pacebus.com/sub/schedules/route_notice_detail.asp?Notice_ID=4757

Looks like they are starting the set up per the ART plan. This map obviates the objection if one is choosing between 85N/85A and 225/226, but it also looks like 92 will be displaced by ART in the conceivable future.

I guess this also makes sense because there is no longer a choice between 270 and 56A. It also looks like at least 68 gets shifted to the south terminal.

[west towns]

Wow this is getting serious

[Busjack]

Wow ridership is going to plummet on that day as everyone's going to wonder where the buses are. Talk about a confusing jumble. At least the #85A and #226 are on the same side but they should have kept them together. I wonder where does the #92 go when ART starts?

• I'm sure there will be signs, and if one is getting off the train at Jefferson Park, you have to get out of there somehow.
• My guess is that if the plan is to limit 270 to Glenbrook Hospital trips, 225 and 226 can also go into that slot. leaving the 225/226 slot for 92.

BTW, the map in the CMAQ application (page 15) cited in the other topic indicates that incorporating 272 into the ART is eventually contemplated. Maybe after getting the $2.3 billion first, though.

[Busjack]

The Firefox is on a PC, but it's probably not a big deal, just needs updating or something. I tend to shy away from updating unless I have to after I lost my paste function on a computer for months only to mysteriously get it back.

Why wouldn't they have CNG buses? The startup is in 2017 and the NW garage is in a build stage and it's slated to become CNG. Notice most future routes with maybe the exception of harlem will be coming out of that garage at least initially. Does the south CNG order have options or can they alter existing options to change the spec? It would seem to me that if they wanted to add USB's and digital map signs on the bus they may have to order NW a few buses or they could taylor the last 15 buses from south's order to be those buses. They will need additional buses anyway so they might as well be new ones!! That would compliment a new service.

One final thought. If they want to have USB's, wouldn't they then have to have upscale seating like the #6378's because if that was per person wouldn't they need like a console to plug this up. like the light switches they had on the Novas. I don't see how else it could be done.

I saw this one kind of late.

• On Firefox on a PC, I usually find that the better policy is to upgrade, and as I mentioned, I'm running Waterfox (64 bit). Occasionally there is a problem, such as one version of Flash had problems working within Firefox, but that got worked out quickly. If you upgrade and hit a snag, you can always reinstall the old one, but the newer ones usually run better.
• The bill authorizing the bond issue says a new NW garage, but doesn't say anything that it would be CNG.
• I mentioned that on the CNGs, the contract was a base order of 91 for South, and options for up to a total of 250 over the four subsequent years. While 159 might be about enough to stock the new NW garage, I also noted that there was no indication if and for what the options would be used.

[BusHunter]

• I'm sure there will be signs, and if one is getting off the train at Jefferson Park, you have to get out of there somehow.
• My guess is that if the plan is to limit 270 to Glenbrook Hospital trips, 225 and 226 can also go into that slot. leaving the 225/226 slot for 92.

BTW, the map in the CMAQ application (page 15) cited in the other topic indicates that incorporating 272 into the ART is eventually contemplated. Maybe after getting the $2.3 billion first, though.

Looks like they wanted all the high traffic stuff close to the terminal. Does anyone think that they are going to have problems exiting the north terminal? They have alot of higher ridership stuff over there now compared with before, (now the #270, #270 ART, #85n and s, #92, #226 and #225, #85A will all be on the same side. The south terminal seems a bit quieter #81W, #68, #88 all with 20 minute frequencies, mostly just the #91 which doesn't run as good as the #85, #56 and #81.

Now if they were smart they would find a way with this jeff pk terminal rehab to extend the Gale street intersection to make the north terminal a part of that intersection with it's own light. The #85's would be a confusing mess unless you ran a three way light system, but there's also the south terminal they could use. The #88's already going to be over there now.

One other thing, with these #270 linked #272 trips, sometimes a NW operator will layover on the entrance apron because that's a two hour ride, where will they layover now?

[Busjack]

Looks like they wanted all the high traffic stuff close to the terminal. Does anyone think that they are going to have problems exiting the north terminal? They have alot of higher ridership stuff over there now compared with before, (now the #270, #270 ART, #85n and s, #92, #226 and #225, #85A will all be on the same side. The south terminal seems a bit quieter #81W, #68, #88 all with 20 minute frequencies, mostly just the #91 which doesn't run as good as the #85, #56 and #81.

Now if they were smart they would find a way with this jeff pk terminal rehab to extend the Gale street intersection to make the north terminal a part of that intersection with it's own light. The #85's would be a confusing mess unless you ran a three way light system, but there's also the south terminal they could use. The #88's already going to be over there now.

One other thing, with these #270 linked #272 trips, sometimes a NW operator will layover on the entrance apron because that's a two hour ride, where will they layover now?

I don't know how big an issue is that northbound buses will be in the south terminal and vice versa, but there was already a bit of inconsistency with regard to 270 and 85S.

However, IIRC, CTA buses used to pull into the slot, and then layover against the Milwaukee Ave. sidewalk. Either that, or buses coming from Forest Glen sat there before going into their slots. Probably a similar situation to buses in the Rosemont terminal pulling into their slots, unloading, circling back to parallel to River Road to wait for their time, and then going back into their slots.

[Busjack]

A little more detail in this article.

[jajuan]

A little more detail in this article.

Sounds similar to how CTA handled many of its locals against service on its former X routes.

[Busjack]

Sounds similar to how CTA handled many of its locals against service on its former X routes.

To some extent similar, about when CTA first said that they were cutting back local service to about 12 to 15 minutes.

I said before that Pace retaining 270 didn't seem to make sense, since various community transit options, such as the Niles Free Bus, were originally part of Vision 2020, but I guess they went in a different direction, in that 270 would be saved as a local and for Glenbrook Hospital trips. I still don't think that someone will wait a half hour to get two blocks closer to a bus stop on a side street.

[jajuan]

To some extent similar, about when CTA first said that they were cutting back local service to about 12 to 15 minutes.

I said before that Pace retaining 270 didn't seem to make sense, since various community transit options, such as the Niles Free Bus, were originally part of Vision 2020, but I guess they went in a different direction, in that 270 would be saved as a local and for Glenbrook Hospital trips. I still don't think that someone will wait a half hour to get two blocks closer to a bus stop on a side street.

True I noticed I forgot to put eventually handled for CTA. Though I was essentially correct on the rest though as far as mentioning that they did this at for many no all of the X routes since the X20 for example was always on 30 min headways and eventually not so express, making it more a supplement to the locals instead of the other way around. Plus we all pretty much knew or suspected X20 was more a resurrection of the old 131 than it was probably meant to be an express version of the 20 anyway.

[BusHunter]

To some extent similar, about when CTA first said that they were cutting back local service to about 12 to 15 minutes.

I said before that Pace retaining 270 didn't seem to make sense, since various community transit options, such as the Niles Free Bus, were originally part of Vision 2020, but I guess they went in a different direction, in that 270 would be saved as a local and for Glenbrook Hospital trips. I still don't think that someone will wait a half hour to get two blocks closer to a bus stop on a side street.

So does that mean that only the Glenbrook hospital trips will be local? Because that service only runs once an hour in the non rush period and every half hour during it. Usually it's every third bus that goes to the hospital. Isn't that kind of few and far in between, not to mention there is no sunday service north of Golf Mill, so something would have to be local on sunday. I think Pulse should be restricted to weekdays only. I think there are going to be alot of critics especially on the chicago side of Devon. With no #56A, how are they going to break it to the riders, " your bus only runs every hour "?

[jajuan]

So does that mean that only the Glenbrook hospital trips will be local? Because that service only runs once an hour in the non rush period and every half hour during it. Usually it's every third bus that goes to the hospital. Isn't that kind of few and far in between, not to mention there is no sunday service north of Golf Mill, so something would have to be local on sunday. I think Pulse should be restricted to weekdays only. I think there are going to be alot of critics especially on the chicago side of Devon. With no #56A, how are they going to break it to the riders, " your bus only runs every hour "?

Well I have to agree with Busjack that it's pretty doubtful that anyone's going to stand at a local stop for 30 to 60 minutes when they can walk the two blocks to the closest express stop if in a big hurry.

[Busjack]

So does that mean that only the Glenbrook hospital trips will be local? Because that service only runs once an hour in the non rush period and every half hour during it. Usually it's every third bus that goes to the hospital. Isn't that kind of few and far in between, not to mention there is no sunday service north of Golf Mill, so something would have to be local on sunday. I think Pulse should be restricted to weekdays only. I think there are going to be alot of critics especially on the chicago side of Devon. With no #56A, how are they going to break it to the riders, " your bus only runs every hour "?

I don't know if Pace went into enough detail on Sunday, but is seems like Monday-Saturday that whatever local service there is is on the Glenbrook Hospital route.

Setting aside my lack of predictive progress on this route, it still seems like the Pulse would be 7 days a week, since traffic is always bad on Milwaukee Ave. and the shopping demand (Golf Mill, Jerry's, primarily) is always there. That leaves up in the air whether there would be a once an hour 270 local to Golf Mill Sunday. I guess we won't find out until 2017, and the article indicates public hearings (and Pace has always been responsive).

[MetroShadow]

I don't know if Pace went into enough detail on Sunday, but is seems like Monday-Saturday that whatever local service there is is on the Glenbrook Hospital route.

Setting aside my lack of predictive progress on this route, it still seems like the Pulse would be 7 days a week, since traffic is always bad on Milwaukee Ave. and the shopping demand (Golf Mill, Jerry's, primarily) is always there. That leaves up in the air whether there would be a once an hour 270 local to Golf Mill Sunday. I guess we won't find out until 2017, and the article indicates public hearings (and Pace has always been responsive).

Honestly, that sounds about right. The question is how to integrate the 270 Local with the 272, especially for service North of Golf Mill.

[Busjack]

Honestly, that sounds about right. The question is how to integrate the 270 Local with the 272, especially for service North of Golf Mill.

Weekday, they have pretty much severed that, since there is only one J trip. However, Saturday they have not. But I figure that since they didn't have much problem with regard to weekday with the North Division restructuring, they could figure something out. Maybe, though, that's how they get the local to every 30 minutes on Saturday, but that would still require some rescheduling.

[BusHunter]

Well I have to agree with Busjack that it's pretty doubtful that anyone's going to stand at a local stop for 30 to 60 minutes when they can walk the two blocks to the closest express stop if in a big hurry.

Well some gaps could be as big as 4-5 blocks walking distance on an angle street. That might be Ok for an able bodied person, but when we get the big snows in the suburbs it may not be possible to walk that distance. I think the Niles Free bus might actually get more ridership because of this. If a rider were savvy they would realize that bus goes to Milwaukee/Imlay and maybe they could possibly ride that to get to the local stops but they would still have to walk the block to get to it if the express bus stops at Devon

[Busjack]

Well some gaps could be as big as 4-5 blocks walking distance on an angle street. That might be Ok for an able bodied person, but when we get the big snows in the suburbs it may not be possible to walk that distance. I think the Niles Free bus might actually get more ridership because of this. If a rider were savvy they would realize that bus goes to Milwaukee/Imlay and maybe they could possibly ride that to get to the local stops but they would still have to walk the block to get to it if the express bus stops at Devon

The original theory was that the Niles Free Bus was supposed to take care of the local duties, and its restructuring was supposed to be part of the ART. But that restructuring, on which Pace has sat for about a year, was supposed to send both the new 411 and 413 to Village Crossing and neither line south of Touhy (prior reference and map).

[Busjack]

Pace just posted that there will be a public meeting at Oasis Park (next to Jerry's) on April 22 at 5:30-7:30. Probably worth attending.

[west towns]

Wow that's next week already. I wonder what if anything will be presented that is different from the website

[Busjack]

Wow that's next week already. I wonder what if anything will be presented that is different from the website

The display boards probably will be similar. However, since Pace (unlike CTA) does listen to comment at these sessions and sometimes acts on it, maybe we'll get some answers or input.

[BusHunter]

Pace just posted that there will be a public meeting at Oasis Park (next to Jerry's) on April 22 at 5:30-7:30. Probably worth attending.

What happens if it rains??

[Busjack]

What happens if it rains??

The description says it has a meeting area.

Also, since it also is a water park, don't you want to get wet?

[Busjack]

I just got back from the meeting. First, this wasn't the usual Pace hearing with everyone sitting down and addressing staff at the podium, but a walk through, with first a video, and then into the next room where staff was standing in front of the display boards.

Anyway, it took a bit for the staff member to understand my point of view, but he did. As you can read above, my questions were essentially on why they expect that someone would wait a half hour for a local bus to get two blocks closer, and why a community transit approach was not considered for the "last mile."

The answer essentially was that Pace wanted to see how the Pulse worked before changing other modes, and it would take a public hearing to cancel 270, although that could happen if things worked out as I thought. I asked how many passengers use the Glenbrook Hospital part of 270, and the answer was "not many."

My next question was what this meant about the Niles Free Bus "ART" restructuring, on which a hearing was held last year, to which the response was "that's on hold until Pulse is implemented."

At that point, the methodology was to fill out a comment card (or the comment card on the Pulse website), so I did it the old fashioned way, and stuck it in the ballot box. I hope they can read my writing. The other thing I mentioned was the proximity of the Dempster stop on the Milwaukee Pulse to the Milwaukee stop on the Dempster Pulse.

What happens if it rains??

What happens if it snows (which it appeared to do)? But the meeting was in a building.