New Express Routes Coming Soon.

[Busjack]

Moving Forward, after the political osculating, said:

Other highways in the pipeline for program expansion include I-90 and the Elgin-O’Hare Expressway in partnership with the Illinois Tollway, and on the Edens, Bishop Ford and Eisenhower expressways and I-57 in collaboration with IDOT.

I guess Bishop Ford would still be of value to 353, but 352 and 355 were taken off the expressways. The question, of course, is whether the Eisenhower one is in coordination with the alternatives analysis, which didn't mention Pace.

[MetroShadow]

Moving Forward, after the political osculating, said:

Other highways in the pipeline for program expansion include I-90 and the Elgin-OHare Expressway in partnership with the Illinois Tollway, and on the Edens, Bishop Ford and Eisenhower expressways and I-57 in collaboration with IDOT.

I guess Bishop Ford would still be of value to 353, but 352 and 355 were taken off the expressways. The question, of course, is whether the Eisenhower one is in coordination with the alternatives analysis, which didn't mention Pace.

Never say never (at least with I-57)

[BusHunter]

Saw a bus tonight that said it was the #855, #853 and I believe #851 all in one bus. I think IIRC it was called the combo bus. (it said this on the destination sign) that was weird. This was about 7:15 - 7:30 around Congress Plaza. The bus was turning east on Balbo from Michigan Ave.

[Busjack]

Saw a bus tonight that said it was the #855, #853 and I believe #851 all in one bus. I think IIRC it was called the combo bus. (it said this on the destination sign) that was weird. This was about 7:15 - 7:30 around Congress Plaza. The bus was turning east on Balbo from Michigan Ave.

The schedule is up, and notes that the L trips noted in the preview are 850/851/855 combined trips, including one leaving Michigan Jackson at 7:25.

I previously said that some combo trips were likely.

Also 850 and 851 are not yet on WebWatch.

[jajuan]

Moving Forward, after the political osculating, said:

Other highways in the pipeline for program expansion include I-90 and the Elgin-O’Hare Expressway in partnership with the Illinois Tollway, and on the Edens, Bishop Ford and Eisenhower expressways and I-57 in collaboration with IDOT.

I guess Bishop Ford would still be of value to 353, but 352 and 355 were taken off the expressways. The question, of course, is whether the Eisenhower one is in coordination with the alternatives analysis, which didn't mention Pace.

Well I-57 is still in play when it comes to the 877. It uses I-57 after running along 127th Street (also called Burr Oak as we know) in Alsip, Blue Island and the edge of Calumet Park.

[west towns]

Wasn't there supposed to be an expansion of I-55 bus on shoulders east of kedzie?

[MetroShadow]

Wasn't there supposed to be an expansion of I-55 bus on shoulders east of kedzie?

Yes. The signs are up there. Whether or not the buses are actually authorized to start at Wentworth is another tale.

[west towns]

Any new update?

[Busjack]

Looks like Pace has three transit projects I-90 operations, Pulse Dempster and Edens BOS. Also on full list has vanpool and rideshare.

Since this is Pace

Pace has been more transparent. What seems new in the Edens BOS is that a new 618 from Union Station to start in 2015, and other new buses from Kimball and Jefferson Park.

I thought 618 sounded familiar, and found this, which said they were talking from the Western MIlw. station, although MetroShadow pointed out that it would be Western to Union to the Kennedy Expressway. That leg isn't on this map.

Having worked around Lake-Cook, I wonder if there is enough employment to support all this, plus people already coming in via the Milw N, and UPN-Braeside. Looks like the second map has some bad editing between routes 620 and 626.

[Busjack]

Three overnight thoughts:

• On the "bad editing" the proposal says that Route 626 will be split into a Lake Cook route and a Lincolnshire route. The Brown route must be the 626 Lake Cook variant even though the legend was pasted over "Dempster-Yellow Line." I wonder if the map indicates cutting Skokie Blvd. in Northbrook from 626.
• Maybe this is the explanation for the authorization of the bond issue to expand the North Shore garage.
• You have to wonder what restructuring is contemplated for 620 in the "Willow Road Corridor," as the only thing would be going into the Glen around the Northwestern Medical building or maybe a substitute for UPS service on 422 or Kraft on 423. Rest of Willow is either Mariano's, Jewel and Walgreens, or houses backing up to and fenced off from Willow.

[BusHunter]

Since this is Pace

Pace has been more transparent. What seems new in the Edens BOS is that a new 618 from Union Station to start in 2015, and other new buses from Kimball and Jefferson Park.

I thought 618 sounded familiar, and found this, which said they were talking from the Western MIlw. station, although MetroShadow pointed out that it would be Western to Union to the Kennedy Expressway. That leg isn't on this map.

Having worked around Lake-Cook, I wonder if there is enough employment to support all this, plus people already coming in via the Milw N, and UPN-Braeside. Looks like the second map has some bad editing between routes 620 and 626.

Actually with Metra increasing fares, this may prove to be a better alternative. If they are using the shoulder it might actually be faster than Metra. Calling it the Edens BOS, it sounds like it is only going to Lake Cook. If it did mirror the #626's route it has a good ridership base along Lake-Cook. But the point is to move commuters to their cars, at least that's how the I-55 plan works. I don't know if they would interested in something that goes as far as Gurnee Mills (I-55 goes pretty far) and I don't know how a toll road would work, but that area to me seems kind of cut off from the main system, it has alot of parking and alot of things to attract potential riders. It could even serve Great America in the summer if it has a ridership base. I would build a transit center somewhere near by and link up the Waukegan service that serves that mall. Something to mirror the NWTC.

[renardo870]

There is a transit transfer point at Gurnee Mills

[Busjack]

There is a transit transfer point at Gurnee Mills

Not really, as 565 goes through there and the transfer point is now College of Lake County.

However, you miss BusHunter's point that he thinks that there should be express service to Gurnee Mills from presumably Dempster-Yellow Line or Jefferson Park. The rest seems ancillary.

Actually with Metra increasing fares, this may prove to be a better alternative. If they are using the shoulder it might actually be faster than Metra. Calling it the Edens BOS, it sounds like it is only going to Lake Cook. If it did mirror the #626's route it has a good ridership base along Lake-Cook. But the point is to move commuters to their cars, at least that's how the I-55 plan works. I don't know if they would interested in something that goes as far as Gurnee Mills (I-55 goes pretty far) and I don't know how a toll road would work, but that area to me seems kind of cut off from the main system, it has alot of parking and alot of things to attract potential riders. It could even serve Great America in the summer if it has a ridership base. I would build a transit center somewhere near by and link up the Waukegan service that serves that mall. Something to mirror the NWTC.

In that a toll road would work is that the there is the I-90 project (Pace as the applicant with the Tollway Authority as the cooperating agency).

However, here, the applicant is IDOT. Nobody signed on for north of the Exit 29 split.

The justification for 626 and I assume the rest of this is that the application states that they have ridership information for the employers in the Lake Cook and Lincolnshire areas. I don't think there is that kind of employment center around Gurnee Mills.

There was an 894 bus from around Lakehurst to serve employment centers around Ill. 22 and the Tri State Tollway and Lake Cook, but it died. There also was 636 from Rosemont to Lake Cook that had a similar fate. I suppose the argument could have been made that 636 failed because the Tri State was so badly congested, and since it has been rebuilt, maybe it would work better now.

The "move commuters from their cars" is the same justification as for I-55: The Edens is impossible to drive in the reverse rush direction, with sometimes travel times Friday night of up to an hour, when the base time is 17 minutes. If the bus can get up to 35 mph, that would be a marked improvement.

[BusHunter]

Now, the I-90 BOS program I believe calls for 3 different routes, one a little bit longer than the others. I-55 is the same, I think. So why not do three routes here, one to Lake-Cook, one to maybe Northbrook, and one to Gurnee. Now this #626 like BOS bus is actually like a feeder to the yellow line. It doesn't really grasp the cars to bus theme that the BOS program speaks. Basically the #626 BOS like bus would be used as a reverse commuter coming into the city in the PM instead of leaving it. But I guess if that's how they want to use it, it could do double inbound and outbound service. I don't think I-55 does that. I don't really know where the choke point starts on the Edens, but I think it's south of Lake-Cook. I don't where they could send a bus to in Northbrook, but CTa once entertained sending the Yellow line there, so someone wants to ride something up there.

[Busjack]

Now, the I-90 BOS program I believe calls for 3 different routes, one a little bit longer than the others. I-55 is the same, I think. So why not do three routes here, one to Lake-Cook, one to maybe Northbrook, and one to Gurnee. Now this #626 like BOS bus is actually like a feeder to the yellow line. It doesn't really grasp the cars to bus theme that the BOS program speaks. Basically the #626 BOS like bus would be used as a reverse commuter coming into the city in the PM instead of leaving it. But I guess if that's how they want to use it, it could do double inbound and outbound service. I don't think I-55 does that. I don't really know where the choke point starts on the Edens, but I think it's south of Lake-Cook. I don't where they could send a bus to in Northbrook, but CTa once entertained sending the Yellow line there, so someone wants to ride something up there.

As we discussed a while back, 626 currently is twice the number of trips in the reverse direction (to Lincolnshire) than in the city rush direction (i.e.serving residents from Buffalo Grove to Dempster).

Northbrook, the question is whether the map implies that they are dropping 626 service on Skokie Blvd. near Dundee Road. Other than that (and my mention if UPS is contemplated on 620), there isn't any place to serve that isn't near Lake Cook.

It seems that this plan has as much branching as the I-55 one, at the city end at Dempster, Jefferson Park, or Kimball, and on the north end Lake Cook, Willow Road, and Lincolnshire.

The Yellow Line extension you mention is long dead. It was some sort of proposal to recreate the North Shore Line to Highland Park (under the Central Ave.-Deerfield Road overpass), but ran into the usual problem with regard to CTA extensions in the suburbs--Highland Park was apparently in favor of it, but Northbrook's then village president was not, and he was on the planning council that time. Then there was a proposal as Part 3 of the North Shore restructuring to put a BRT on the right of way, but that died by round 2 of the workshops. At that round, there was a proposal for a guaranteed ride home for 626 passengers if they got out of work early or late, but that died by the third round of workshops.

As far as the choke point, the main one southbound is that the Kennedy merge backs it up all the way to the Edens Spur merge.

[west towns]

Looking at the application write up and attachments it appears 626 remains intake up to lake cook road and the new route runs express to north the Deerfield Lincolnshire area.

[Busjack]

Looking at the application write up and attachments it appears 626 remains intake up to lake cook road and the new route runs express to north the Deerfield Lincolnshire area.

The blue dashed line isn't aligned on any street, but I guess we can assume it is Wilmot Road, then Deerfield Road (maybe Baxter, then nothing there except Riverwoods) and then into the Lincolnshire area, while the brown line is straight on Lake Cook to Milwaukee Ave. There, though, isn't any indication that the blue dash route doesn't make stops between Walgreens (Wilmot) and the Edens.

If it were express, it theoretically could take I-94 (Edens Spur) to Deerfield Road, like the rush direction 626 does.

Main thing that the map indicates is that the blue dashed line does not service Takeda, Discover, Wolters-Kluwer, or Allstate Riverwalk.

For that matter, the map isn't detailed enough to indicate whether either bus uses the "service road" around 1400-1700 Lake Cook, as the current 626 does.

[west towns]

You would not be able to run the route with the map it looks illustrative not for actual travel should be stamped on it

[Busjack]

You would not be able to run the route with the map it looks illustrative not for actual travel should be stamped on it

• You didn't explain how you got to that conclusion. Is it because there isn't a through street 1/2 block west of Wilmot Road?
• Anyway, it is obvious it is not for travel. It is for the purpose of an IDOT grant application. Someone here found it, but I bet the average person standing at Jefferson Park and wanting to know how to get to SSI Illinois is not going to look there. They might use the RTA Trip Planner, which itself should be stamped that it is not for use of anyone who wants to get anywhere.

Between this comment and the one you had in response to the CTA Bus Slow Zone one, apparently you don't understand what grant applications are.

[west towns]

Whatever the point was folks were getting hung up on very detailed routing which I pointed out the map in itself is not detailed

[jajuan]

Whatever the point was folks were getting hung up on very detailed routing which I pointed out the map in itself is not detailed

From what I've been reading of everyone's comments, they were merely talking through their thoughts of some possibilities of how any of these proposals might work as the relevant agencies flesh them out IF they were to get grant money. So how is that getting hung up on very detailed routing exactly?

[Busjack]

From what I've been reading of everyone's comments, they were merely talking through their thoughts of some possibilities of how any of these proposals might work as the relevant agencies flesh them out IF they were to get grant money. So how is that getting hung up on very detailed routing exactly?

Correct. I was essentially trying to figure out:

Looking at the application write up and attachments it appears 626 remains intake up to lake cook road and the new route runs express to north the Deerfield Lincolnshire area.

whatever it meant.

I certainly wasn't saying "On August 28, 2017, Route 626 will serve the Walgreen Lake Cook campus, and Route 624 will serve its Wilmot Road headquarters." Hence there was no way I could figure out what west towns meant by:

You would not be able to run the route with the map it looks illustrative not for actual travel should be stamped on it

and then be complaining that we were discussing the proposal in too much detail.Enough said.

[west towns]

Just to speculate is anyone's guess. I was pointing out simply the map is not routing specific details. We can all have an opinion doesn't mean its what will happen in reality. As for grant applications in reading up on the cmaq application booklet they do ask very specific details so I quests pace has figured this already out. If we really want the exact details to put this matter to bed maybe email pace

[Busjack]

On the Illinois Tollway site, there is a video of the Active Traffic Management system, stating off with showing Bus on Shoulder.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=9CLa0GppwAA

[west towns]

Now that is really neat