No Purple Express During Brown Line Bridge Reroute

[Busjack]

You do it every time. There were three items in my post. Did you respond to all three..... NO!

Look who is talking. We'll take your admission that you can't read. Other than that, I'm not your employee and hence don't have to take your orders.

I do know that you responded to sw about knowing if the electronic L car signs can be reprogrammed as the bus signs can, and then admitting that you knew nothing about them.

I also know that I said when this began that whatever proportion of cars were going in the subway vs. the Merchandise Mart was going to be confusing, and sure enough it was.

And nobody from CTA explained why there are cars with Blue Line signs on the Brown Line, nor why car shuffles had to be done in the midst of this mess caused by the Wells St. Bridge being out, including your report of an emergency radio communication that 2600s had to go to the Orange.

In the meantime, despite your calling Scooter Libby a liar on the CTA Tattler, he is right that CTA hates the passengers. I'll go only to the extent that yesterday, your former colleagues again proved that they are incompetent.

[chicagopcclcar]

Which basically gets to my central point that "Oh just take some 5000 series cars and plug in some signs" for various short turns and reroutes isn't as simple as some are making it sound. For one thing isn't there the factor of certain destinations being switched over when a train trips a particular interlock position to factor in? I leave it to others to go down the "CTA screws up everything" train of thought when this was going to be a challenge either way to get passengers to endure by virtue of how busy the Red, Brown, Purple Express (more the Red and Brown Lines) combination is under normal circumstances.

Checking sources its more and more doubtful that the 5000 roll signs can be changed. Certainly operators can only choose from the menu they are given. So the question becomes can the menu of offerings be changed. Not likely, I have been told.

Short--shorts.....Well a Purple line express WAS run on Tuesday. SB an extra train ran on track one non-stop Howard to Belmont where it picked up passengers and ran to the Mart. The extra turned, ran in service back to Belmont and then ran express on track four back to Howard. It carried any passengers, "who wanted to go to Howard."

And this unofficial Purple Express was the very first 5000 series Purple train.

The 2800-2900 move WAS for "Roosevelt" signs. Unfortunately only 4 out of 16 cars still had the signs....back to the drawing board.

[Busjack]

...

Short--shorts.....Well a Purple line express WAS run on Tuesday. SB an extra train ran on track one non-stop Howard to Belmont where it picked up passengers and ran to the Mart. The extra turned, ran in service back to Belmont and then ran express on track four back to Howard. It carried any passengers, "who wanted to go to Howard."

And this unofficial Purple Express was the very first 5000 series Purple train.

...

So, more secret trains. From the perspective of prospective passengers planning a trip, how does this help them?

[sw4400]

Which basically gets to my central point that "Oh just take some 5000 series cars and plug in some signs" for various short turns and reroutes isn't as simple as some are making it sound. For one thing isn't there the factor of certain destinations being switched over when a train trips a particular interlock position to factor in? I leave it to others to go down the "CTA screws up everything" train of thought when this was going to be a challenge either way to get passengers to endure by virtue of how busy the Red, Brown, Purple Express (more the Red and Brown Lines) combination is under normal circumstances.

Ok, follow me on this...

-2 of 3 AM and PM rush hour trains run through the Subway. Why not have 2 operators from Howard Yard that are 5000-Series qualified then operate the trains from Kimball to Roosevelt and back to Kimball until the rush period is over then return them to Howard Yard or continue on the Red Line to 95th?

-5000's have computer operated LED's. Electronic Displays, whether on a bus or train are able to be programmed either automatically or manually on what the destination says.

This is something that can be done. All they have to do is assign two Howard Yard Operators to run those 5000's during the rush hour periods. Otherwise they could've spent the weeks leading up to the Wells St. Bridge closure training a handful of Kimball Yard operators on how to operate the 5000-Series cars.

Then you wouldn't have the 3200's with multiple confusing displays: Roosevelt, O-Hare, (Blank)

[BusHunter]

The 2800-2900 move WAS for "Roosevelt" signs. Unfortunately only 4 out of 16 cars still had the signs....back to the drawing board.

So you mean to tell me they were ordering the #2800's and #2900's out of 99th yard to Midway and they didn't know they didn't have the signs? What a joke!! Really I don't see why they went through all the trouble. Affected cars to me were under 10 percent so just send those somewhere else and find a small group of cars to replace them. Not a big deal.

[owine]

Has anyone noticed the new automated announcement? I had never heard this one before but I got "We are experiencing a delay and regret the inconvenience. We expect to be moving shortly" twice on two different Reds yesterday.

[sw4400]

Checking sources its more and more doubtful that the 5000 roll signs can be changed. Certainly operators can only choose from the menu they are given. So the question becomes can the menu of offerings be changed. Not likely, I have been told.

Short--shorts.....Well a Purple line express WAS run on Tuesday. SB an extra train ran on track one non-stop Howard to Belmont where it picked up passengers and ran to the Mart. The extra turned, ran in service back to Belmont and then ran express on track four back to Howard. It carried any passengers, "who wanted to go to Howard."

And this unofficial Purple Express was the very first 5000 series Purple train.

The 2800-2900 move WAS for "Roosevelt" signs. Unfortunately only 4 out of 16 cars still had the signs....back to the drawing board.

I disagree... that's why the Electronic Displays where created. It allows sudden changes to be made if a route needs to be modified for whatever the reason. And this Purple Line Express that was used that shouldn't have been since the Purple Line Express was not supposed to go south of Howard might've been a revenue test of the 5000's to see if they can be quickly adjusted for new sign displays. I wouldn't be surprised if this proved positive that on the next leg of Wells St. Bridgework, 5000's might find their way to the Brown Line temporarily(not a whole yardful, just 16-20). They only need to run 2 of the 3 rush hour trains through the Subway, the other runs to Merchandise Mart and can be ran with 3200's or whatever is assigned to the Brown Line otherwise.

And your mentioning of the 2800 and 2900-Series epic fails proves that they should've looked at the 5000's. Not even half of the displays had Roosevelt displays!!! All CTA has to do in input into whatever main computer for the 5000's "Roosevelt" and set it on a Red background. Instruct the Operators how to activate it(e.g: R785J). They input that for the destination code and suddenly, all cars have "Roosevelt" signs on red backgrounds!!! It doesn't take that long to input commands into a computer system, and I'm sure the CTA has plenty of computer techs that can do this. If they can make the buses say "All CTA Routes Now Accessible" and "Have A Safe And Happy Holiday", I think they can do this!!!

[Busjack]

Has anyone noticed the new automated announcement? I had never heard this one before but I got "We are experiencing a delay and regret the inconvenience. We expect to be moving shortly" twice on two different Reds yesterday.

Sounds like the "waiting for signals" announcement, but distinguishable from it.

I sort of remember something similar on a Purple stuck behind a Brown on the north main, but can't swear to it.

[jajuan]

Ok, follow me on this...

-2 of 3 AM and PM rush hour trains run through the Subway. Why not have 2 operators from Howard Yard that are 5000-Series qualified then operate the trains from Kimball to Roosevelt and back to Kimball until the rush period is over then return them to Howard Yard or continue on the Red Line to 95th?

-5000's have computer operated LED's. Electronic Displays, whether on a bus or train are able to be programmed either automatically or manually on what the destination says.

This is something that can be done. All they have to do is assign two Howard Yard Operators to run those 5000's during the rush hour periods. Otherwise they could've spent the weeks leading up to the Wells St. Bridge closure training a handful of Kimball Yard operators on how to operate the 5000-Series cars.

Then you wouldn't have the 3200's with multiple confusing displays: Roosevelt, O-Hare, (Blank)

Last time I checked I'm not two years old so do stop quoting my posts in a patronizing and sometimes condescending manner sir. Secondly the one flaw that jumps out at me with your idea, though it is an otherwise decent one is that the time it takes to cover going into downtown means two operators qualified to operate a 5000 series train won't be enough to cover the downtown trips to Roosevelt even with the reduced rush hour frequencies. You also would need to time those trains correctly so that you can get the 5000 consists under your scenario from Howard Yard and back after their time of usage on the Brown is over.

[chicagopcclcar]

I disagree... that's why the Electronic Displays where created. It allows sudden changes to be made if a route needs to be modified for whatever the reason. And this Purple Line Express that was used that shouldn't have been since the Purple Line Express was not supposed to go south of Howard might've been a revenue test of the 5000's to see if they can be quickly adjusted for new sign displays. I wouldn't be surprised if this proved positive that on the next leg of Wells St. Bridgework, 5000's might find their way to the Brown Line temporarily(not a whole yardful, just 16-20). They only need to run 2 of the 3 rush hour trains through the Subway, the other runs to Merchandise Mart and can be ran with 3200's or whatever is assigned to the Brown Line otherwise.

And your mentioning of the 2800 and 2900-Series epic fails proves that they should've looked at the 5000's. Not even half of the displays had Roosevelt displays!!! All CTA has to do in input into whatever main computer for the 5000's "Roosevelt" and set it on a Red background. Instruct the Operators how to activate it(e.g: R785J). They input that for the destination code and suddenly, all cars have "Roosevelt" signs on red backgrounds!!! It doesn't take that long to input commands into a computer system, and I'm sure the CTA has plenty of computer techs that can do this. If they can make the buses say "All CTA Routes Now Accessible" and "Have A Safe And Happy Holiday", I think they can do this!!!

Sorry you obviously missed the humor in my response. Maybe I should have used quotation marks around "purple express."

The train was an "extra", a "gap" train. Do you know the railroad meaning of such?

As for the capabilities and limits of the LED rollsigns on the 5000 series railcars, you have not shown me that you absolutely know those capabilities and limits. You implied what you expect their system to be able to do based upon other systems or just the definition of "Elecgronic Displays." Are you a CTA design engineer or program implementor? Do you have the manual for the Bombardier roll sign system?

DH

[chicagopcclcar]

So, more secret trains. From the perspective of prospective passengers planning a trip, how does this help them?

What the hell is a "secret train"?

DH

[chicagopcclcar]

Look who is talking. We'll take your admission that you can't read. Other than that, I'm not your employee and hence don't have to take your orders.

I do know that you responded to sw about knowing if the electronic L car signs can be reprogrammed as the bus signs can, and then admitting that you knew nothing about them.

I also know that I said when this began that whatever proportion of cars were going in the subway vs. the Merchandise Mart was going to be confusing, and sure enough it was.

And nobody from CTA explained why there are cars with Blue Line signs on the Brown Line, nor why car shuffles had to be done in the midst of this mess caused by the Wells St. Bridge being out, including your report of an emergency radio communication that 2600s had to go to the Orange.

In the meantime, despite your calling Scooter Libby a liar on the CTA Tattler, he is right that CTA hates the passengers. I'll go only to the extent that yesterday, your former colleagues again proved that they are incompetent.

Who the hell is "Scooter Libbby"?

DH

[chicagopcclcar]

Look who is talking. We'll take your admission that you can't read. Other than that, I'm not your employee and hence don't have to take your orders.

I do know that you responded to sw about knowing if the electronic L car signs can be reprogrammed as the bus signs can, and then admitting that you knew nothing about them.

I asked sw if he knew that electronic L car signs, as you call them, can be reprogrammed like bus signs evidently can and then I admitted I know nothing about either system. What's wrong with that. I admit when I don't know unlike you.

DH

[Guest ctafan630]

Brown Line cars have two sets of curtains- one that is Brown-Orange-Red-Yellow-Purple and the other is Brown-Orange-Red-Black-Green. The "Roosevelt" sign can only be found in the first set of signs. The second set will display the Midway, Downtown, and O'Hare (Black) signs. The other version of the current roller signs are Blue-Red-Pink-Green. There are two versions of this grouping- one with "58th" for the Green Line, but most have the version with "Jefferson Park" for the Blue Line. There are also about 10 cars on the Blue Line that have the latter with the "Jefferson Park" grouping, but the font is smaller very spacious. And there are two versions of the Brown-Orange-Red-Yellow-Purple grouping with most sets having a "Roosevelt" sign for the Red Line, but now that's being replaced with the "Ashland/63" sign for the Red Line.

Why did the CTA even create the Black downtown, Ohare and Midway signs when the Block 37 construction for the airport express service was nowhere near completion? With all the car swapping and different roller curtain combinations it is no wonder why nobody knows where they are going.

[Busjack]

I asked sw if he knew that electronic L car signs, as you call them, can be reprogrammed like bus signs evidently can and then I admitted I know nothing about either system. What's wrong with that. I admit when I don't know unlike you.

DH

You didn't answer the other points I raised, so don't expect something from others you are unwilling to do yourself.

[chicagopcclcar]

You didn't answer the other points I raised, so don't expect something from others you are unwilling to do yourself.

Then ask your other points.

[Busjack]

Then ask your other points.

Again, I suggest you read up the thread. You still seem oblivious to the Paper Sign challenge and the rest of this post.

I don't have the time to retype or even copy and paste for your benefit. Apparently you are also oblivious to what you posted on the CTA Tattler. Use a search engine and find out on your own time.

[chicagopcclcar]

Again, I suggest you read up the thread. You still seem oblivious to the Paper Sign challenge.

I don't have the time to retype or even copy and paste for your benefit. Apparently you are also oblivious to what you posted on the CTA Tattler. Use a search engine and find out on your own time.

Don't have time or don't have the knowledge. There's so much about the Chicago "L" system that you don't know and will never know given that attitude of yours. The reason why you don't want to answer is you don't KNOW the answers. Unfortunately others see that too. Or maybe you don't recognize the opinion that others have of you. My posting is not to try to convinvce you of anythng...rather to present the evidence and allows others to make up their own mind about you. It's worked quite well. And here you thought you were just playing with me. Tsk, Tsk.

[Busjack]

Don't have time or don't have the knowledge. There's so much about the Chicago "L" system that you don't know and will never know given that attitude of yours. The reason why you don't want to answer is you don't KNOW the answers. Unfortunately others see that too. Or maybe you don't recognize the opinion that others have of you. My posting is not to try to convinvce you of anythng...rather to present the evidence and allows others to make up their own mind about you. It's worked quite well. And here you thought you were just playing with me. Tsk, Tsk.

As I mentioned at the top of the thread--the topic isn't me.

You violated the terms of service before, and apparently you want to again.

Like I said, I don't work for you, Louis DePalma. And don't ask who he is.

[chicagopcclcar]

As I mentioned at the top of the thread--the topic isn't me.

You violated the terms of service before, and apparently you want to again.

Like I said, I don't work for you, Louis DePalma. And don't ask who he is.

I don't work for you either and I don't know any Louis DePalma, so would someone else tell me who he is. Thanks. In fact, is there anyone else on this forum interested in Busjack's ramblings. I'm through. Good night.

[Kevin]

Has anyone noticed the new automated announcement? I had never heard this one before but I got "We are experiencing a delay and regret the inconvenience. We expect to be moving shortly" twice on two different Reds yesterday.

I believe that this generic delay message has existed for quite some time, but it seems to be rarely used in favor of the more specific varieties.

[artthouwill]

This p.m rush, I had jyst missed a NB Green Line at 35th. The next train to arrive was a SB Ashland/63 train. Looking down the tracks southward, there was no train laid up at 37th. A few minutes later, a SB train showed up with Not In Service signs with lead car 3441. After the train unloaded, the two personnel on board did a walk through even though there was a train right behind them. This Brown Line train leaves the station and, as the Cottage Grove train pulls in, the Brown Line train switches to the middle track at 37th. Immediately behind the Cottage train is another Brown Line train, which eas a mix of Orange and Brown Line cars, but all 8 cars had yellow Skokie.signage. This train had to wait at 35th because there was a train already on the middle track at 37th, then my train came going north. What do I see going south at about 31st, another SB Brown Line with Skokie signage.

On the way to Roosevelt, I eas hoping an announcement would be made that a transfer to the NB Brown could ne made at Roosevelt by going in the subway. No such announcement came. Yet when we left Roosevelt, the operator announces that there is no Brown Line service in the Loop, but transfer to free shuttle buses at Clark/Lake to access Brown Line service. Why couldn't passengers been given the option at Roosevelt if they were traveling at least to Armitage or beyond?

Rhis early a.m., there were at least two 3200s traveling NB on the Wabash and Lake side of the Loop. Didn't see any Loop shuttle trains this p.m. rush

[chicagopcclcar]

By Wednesday, the CTA is getting the operations down pat. Kimball is calling in every departure, especially the "subway trains" identifying the run number and head car, acknowledging correct signs. At important transfer points, on sight observers are calling in any operator not making proper announcements, meaning not reading from the script they are supposed to have. Evidently a written reprimand is on the way. The three "extra" trainsets are held outside Clark Junction and put into service. Some "extras" have been 5000 series, but they can only be used in Merchandise Mart Brown line or Red line to 95th because they don't have proper signage for Brown line "subway" service. When running between Belmont and Howard, all extras run "lite" on tracks 1 and 4. No more carrying passengers. Midway/Brown line subways seem to all carry passengers all the way to Midway. I don't know about the northbounds from Midway. The Red line still has to swap at terminals when operators report being unqualified on 5000s. The subway signal system cannot handle this capacity. Is it better to put everyone on a train and travel at 15 MPH in red blocks through subway or pile more passengers into fewer trains but travel at more decent speeds. That's a rhetorical.

DH

[BusHunter]

Some "extras" have been 5000 series, but they can only be used in Merchandise Mart Brown line or Red line to 95th because they don't have proper signage for Brown line "subway" service.

DH

Nice to hear service is running better, I did spot a Brown line train with Green line Cottage Grove signs the other day. So your saying there is no Roosevelt Red line sign on the #5000's?

[chicagopcclcar]

Nice to hear service is running better, I did spot a Brown line train with Green line Cottage Grove signs the other day. So your saying there is no Roosevelt Red line sign on the #5000's?

Evidently not....no "Roosevelt" on red background sign in the 5000s menu, And that brings up a big debate on the internet about whether the signs on 5000s can be reprogrammed. The question could be answered when its known what sign will the rerouted Red line 5000s carry when headed to Ashland/63. Will it be the Green line sign currently in the menu or a new sign.