Metra Ticketing

[Tcmetro]

20 minutes ago, Railguy said:

Without ticket agents does the 'buy onboard surcharge' go away?

I would assume so. Perhaps upon full rollout of ticket machines they will eliminate cash transactions with the conductors altogether.

 

Here's the stations that have TVMs already:

https://metra.com/TVM

[Smolensk]

1 hour ago, Tcmetro said:

I would assume so. Perhaps upon full rollout of ticket machines they will eliminate cash transactions with the conductors altogether.

 

Here's the stations that have TVMs already:

https://metra.com/TVM

I would be shocked if a station like Gladstone Park ever got ticket machines. 

[Railguy]

What was the reason to get ride of the 10 ride ticket? This is one of the hot issues in complaints according to news reports

[strictures]

9 hours ago, Railguy said:

What was the reason to get ride of the 10 ride ticket? This is one of the hot issues in complaints according to news reports

Abject stupidity!  Plus they want to probably stop needing the conductors to punch out the spots on the tickets.

[Busjack]

53 minutes ago, strictures said:

Abject stupidity!  Plus they want to probably stop needing the conductors to punch out the spots on the tickets.

Probably the latter, as they suppose riders will use the app.

[pudgym29]

As somebody who will get out there after 1 February 2024, I am mildly distraught at the Metra stations which will not have the ticket machine then.

Specifically: Oak Park (UP West), Jefferson Park (UP Northwest), Cicero (BNSF), Davis St. Evanston (UP North).

These are all stations which I will utilize to avoid the downtown surcharge {which it actually is not, but this makes it easier to explain}, plus Mayfair (Milwaukee North), which I would not expect to to be high on the list of installations {despite its proximity to the CTA Blue Line “L” Montrose station}. If I cannot use a credit card to buy a ticket at these stations, I will not ride those lines.

[strictures]

11 hours ago, pudgym29 said:

As somebody who will get out there after 1 February 2024, I am mildly distraught at the Metra stations which will not have the ticket machine then.

Specifically: Oak Park (UP West), Jefferson Park (UP Northwest), Cicero (BNSF), Davis St. Evanston (UP North).

These are all stations which I will utilize to avoid the downtown surcharge {which it actually is not, but this makes it easier to explain}, plus Mayfair (Milwaukee North), which I would not expect to to be high on the list of installations {despite its proximity to the CTA Blue Line “L” Montrose station}. If I cannot use a credit card to buy a ticket at these stations, I will not ride those lines.

All three of those stations are very busy, so I'm sure they will get the machines.

[geneking7320]

I noticed yesterday that the McCormick Place did not have TVMs. As this is a convention center (a visitor from Orlando, FL asked me about fare payment) Metra needs to rectify the situation.

[artthouwill]

30 minutes ago, geneking7320 said:

I noticed yesterday that the McCormick Place did not have TVMs. As this is a convention center (a visitor from Orlando, FL asked me about fare payment) Metra needs to rectify the situation.

Do any of the flag stops have vending machines?  Outside of downtown and the Hyde Park stations, the only stations I remember with TVMs were Blue Island,  Kensington,  and maybe Homewood.  I can't seem to recall any on any of the diesel lines.  

[Busjack]

4 hours ago, artthouwill said:

Do any of the flag stops have vending machines?  Outside of downtown and the Hyde Park stations, the only stations I remember with TVMs were Blue Island,  Kensington,  and maybe Homewood.  I can't seem to recall any on any of the diesel lines.  

Metra says that the stations with TVMs already have them, and posted this list. It also said:

Quote

Tickets will be available for purchase through the Ventra app, new ticket vending machines that have already been installed at the busiest stations (see here for list), and conductors on the trains.

No mention of an on-board surcharge, but clearly no TVMs on ME stations south of 11th.

[artthouwill]

On 1/17/2024 at 7:39 PM, pudgym29 said:

As somebody who will get out there after 1 February 2024, I am mildly distraught at the Metra stations which will not have the ticket machine then.

Specifically: Oak Park (UP West), Jefferson Park (UP Northwest), Cicero (BNSF), Davis St. Evanston (UP North).

These are all stations which I will utilize to avoid the downtown surcharge {which it actually is not, but this makes it easier to explain}, plus Mayfair (Milwaukee North), which I would not expect to to be high on the list of installations {despite its proximity to the CTA Blue Line “L” Montrose station}. If I cannot use a credit card to buy a ticket at these stations, I will not ride those lines.

Get the Ventra app.  It's easy to purchase a Metra ticket.  Don't buy a ticket until  the day or day before you plan to travel.  Make sure your phone is charged  and when the conductors come, pull up your ticket,  press use ticket and show it to the conductor.

[strictures]

5 hours ago, Busjack said:

Metra says that the stations with TVMs already have them, and posted this list. It also said:

The list shows one at Wilmette.  Is it inside or outside, as the station house is often locked up tight?

[Busjack]

14 hours ago, artthouwill said:

Get the Ventra app.  It's easy to purchase a Metra ticket.  Don't buy a ticket until  the day or day before you plan to travel.  Make sure your phone is charged  and when the conductors come, pull up your ticket,  press use ticket and show it to the conductor.

That's what Metra wants. However the cludge for buying a Regional Connect Pass (you have to start in the app, and then go to your Ventra account and then get a Ventra Card and load that) should be unnecessary after 12 years. They should just have a way to tap your phone on CTA or Pace.

[Tcmetro]

That begs the question if the Regional Connect Pass can be added to a virtual Ventra card in Google/Apple Pay?

All of the other CTA and Pace pass types can be added to a virtual Ventra card.

[artthouwill]

4 hours ago, Tcmetro said:

That begs the question if the Regional Connect Pass can be added to a virtual Ventra card in Google/Apple Pay?

All of the other CTA and Pace pass types can be added to a virtual Ventra card.

It definitely would need to be.   I found out the hard way once you load your Ventra card to the Google/Apple Pay wallet, the physical Ventra card is deactivated, meaning you can only use the Ventra from your Google/Apple Pay wallet on your phone to pay your fare.

After I had problems with the card reader at the L station accepting my phone virtual Ventra card,  I had to remove it from my Wallet and then re add it again.  Upon my trip home it worked fine at the L station but the same problem I had earlier at another train station was happen on the Pace bus.  I called Ventra and the lady suggested I buy another physical Ventra card ( remember the card I have was deactivated once I added it to my Wallet) call Ventra to register it to my account and load that card as needed.  If I had known this beforehand I NEVER would have loaded the Ventra card to my Wallet.  Apparently I am not the only person who has complained about this .

[Smolensk]

They don't want you buying a monthly pass, loading the card into your Apple Pay wallet and then giving the card to your buddy so both of you can ride on the same monthly pass.  So they deactivate the card.  Then if you want to share your pass, you have to give your buddy your phone.

[Busjack]

3 hours ago, Smolensk said:

They don't want you buying a monthly pass, loading the card into your Apple Pay wallet and then giving the card to your buddy so both of you can ride on the same monthly pass.  So they deactivate the card.  Then if you want to share your pass, you have to give your buddy your phone.

Makes sense, but why the cludge of having a wallet? Just include a function in the Ventra App to (after logging in) just tapping your phone. I suppose that there is the issue of passing back your phone, but one could pass back a physical card, too. But I admit I don't have the technical expertise to figure this out.

If someone is riding with a family member, do both have to show separate phones to the conductor?

[artthouwill]

5 minutes ago, Busjack said:

Makes sense, but why the cludge of having a wallet? Just include a function in the Ventra App to (after logging in) just tapping your phone. I suppose that there is the issue of passing back your phone, but one could pass back a physical card, too. But I admit I don't have the technical expertise to figure this out.

If someone is riding with a family member, do both have to show separate phones to the conductor?

Maybe for single fares on CTA and Pace but nor passes.  For Metra you definitely need separate phones, even for single one way or round trips .

[Smolensk]

1 hour ago, Busjack said:

Makes sense, but why the cludge of having a wallet? Just include a function in the Ventra App to (after logging in) just tapping your phone. I suppose that there is the issue of passing back your phone, but one could pass back a physical card, too. But I admit I don't have the technical expertise to figure this out.

If someone is riding with a family member, do both have to show separate phones to the conductor?

I don't know about the wallet thing.  That's a good question.

Multiple people can use the same card or phone on CTA and Pace.  The first tap gets charged to the unlimited ride pass (if you have one) and begins a 15 minute lockout (on the same bus or train station).  Any additional rides during the lockout period must be charged as either single rides or transfers.

Good question about multiple riders on Metra.  They used to advertise that the ten ride tickets could be shared with your traveling companions.  I don't see them saying the same about the Day Pass 5-Pack.

 

[Busjack]

9 hours ago, Smolensk said:

 

Multiple people can use the same card or phone on CTA and Pace.  The first tap gets charged to the unlimited ride pass (if you have one) and begins a 15 minute lockout (on the same bus or train station).  Any additional rides during the lockout period must be charged as either single rides or transfers.

Thanks. That makes sense.

[busfan2847]

On 1/19/2024 at 10:33 PM, artthouwill said:

Maybe for single fares on CTA and Pace but nor passes.  For Metra you definitely need separate phones, even for single one way or round trips .

No you do not. You can buy multiple Metra tickets and use as many of them as you want at once. The ticket of the phone shows a number against a black box, near the top of the image, indication how many tickets are being used.

[Busjack]

24 minutes ago, busfan2847 said:

No you do not. You can buy multiple Metra tickets and use as many of them as you want at once. The ticket of the phone shows a number against a black box, near the top of the image, indication how many tickets are being used.

That wasn't responsive to @artthouwill's post. It wasn't how many 1 day tickets or passes you can buy (clearly you have to buy 5 to substitute for the 10-punch ticket), but if you and your significant other both want a monthly pass (and maybe a Regional Connect Pass), can you put that on one phone for the two individuals? His answer appears correct.

[busfan2847]

24 minutes ago, Busjack said:

That wasn't responsive to @artthouwill's post. It wasn't how many 1 day tickets or passes you can buy (clearly you have to buy 5 to substitute for the 10-punch ticket), but if you and your significant other both want a monthly pass (and maybe a Regional Connect Pass), can you put that on one phone for the two individuals? His answer appears correct.

I was replying to:-

"For Metra you definitely need separate phones, even for single one way or round trips ."

For Monthly tickets I agree you can only put one on a single phone.

Also in Metra's Q&A it clearly states that the 10-ride replacement can be used by group's

"We use the 10-Ride Ticket when traveling in a group. Will we still be able to do that with the Day Pass 5-Pack?

Yes, you will be able to activate more than one Day Pass at a time – all five of them, if you want."

[Busjack]

3 hours ago, busfan2847 said:

I was replying to:-

"For Metra you definitely need separate phones, even for single one way or round trips ."

For Monthly tickets I agree you can only put one on a single phone.

Also in Metra's Q&A it clearly states that the 10-ride replacement can be used by group's

"We use the 10-Ride Ticket when traveling in a group. Will we still be able to do that with the Day Pass 5-Pack?

Yes, you will be able to activate more than one Day Pass at a time – all five of them, if you want."

O.K.

Maybe I'll get to my point, which is that instead of simplifying fares and payment, the hydra trademarked as Ventra has become unnecessarily complex to use, and outdated technology and parochial interests have made it more difficult to use than it need be.

Let's first consider the muddled origins. First it was a CTA contract with Cubic that at the time was open to criticism, for such things as the deceptively-marketed debit card, and charging your ATM card if you just tapped your wallet.

The Ventra App was some app the South Shore acquired, and then Metra modified it and called it Ventra. However, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with paying fares on CTA or Pace, as demonstrated by the convoluted manner of buying a Regional Connect Pass.

The bus version of Ventra is still card based, even though now you can use a virtual card in Apple or Google Wallet. However, it is not like any food ordering app I know, where once you enter your account number, you can use that app to pay for all future orders.

My parochialism comment is based on such things as a statement by a Metra director at a PART presentation "We aren't in favor of fare integration, because conductors our are face to the riders," like the two are the same--they are not. Yet they did away with ticket agents, but, unlike CTA, did not put a TVM in every station.

10 years later there are other approaches:

• The transit app, which Pace uses to integrate Mobility as a Service, also says:

  Quote

  One app to plan transit, another to pay? A dozen more for bikeshare, ridehail, scooters? Yikes. That’s cumbersome. We make it easy: with integrated planning and payments, for every mode.

   

• Modern fareboxes can be also TVMs, fare card readers, and phone app readers. Apparently CTA only bought the FB30 farebox system. However, S-B also has far more advanced multi-modal payment systems.

 

[pudgym29]

On 1/18/2024 at 11:07 PM, artthouwill said:

Get the Ventra app.  It's easy to purchase a Metra ticket.  Don't buy a ticket until  the day or day before you plan to travel.  Make sure your phone is charged  and when the conductors come, pull up your ticket,  press use ticket and show it to the conductor.

In order to get the Ventra app; I would have to obtain a smart phone. A security analyst has scribed, "The smart phone is the single most privacy breaching device mankind has ever invented, and most people accept it because of the convenience (or work requirement) such a device brings"

I have no intention of buying a smart phone. ? My mobile computing device is a laptop computer which needs a 2.4 GHz signal. I could pose a statement that limiting fare options only to people with a smart phone is discriminatory. My Ventra card should be able to load the Metra (Saturday and Sunday) weekend pass on it, similarly to how it queues 1, 3, 7, and 30-day passes. The Metra conductor should have a card reader upon which I could tap it.