Latest 5000-series Rail Car Rendering

[Kevin]

In addition to showcasing CTA's upcoming web site redesign, the Customer Communications Report PDF from today's board meeting includes an updated exterior rendering of the 5000-series rail car on page 19. I've attached that slide as an image for convenience.

[sw4400]

In addition to showcasing CTA's upcoming web site redesign, the Customer Communications Report PDF from today's board meeting includes an updated exterior rendering of the 5000-series rail car on page 19. I've attached that slide as an image for connivence.

It kinda looks like a 3200 almost. Except with that weird paint scheme, I wonder if the CTA will modify the 3200's and 2600's so all train cars look basically the same(even though the 5000's cannot train with these cars). I thought CTA was going to stick with the stainless steel look.

[Busjack]

Of course, you have to wonder whether that is like the articulated bus with a passenger door on the left side in the driver's compartment in a previous report.

One can't really also tell whether CTA is going back to black masking around the side windows, or those are just attempts at reflection lines.

[greenstreet]

Of course, you have to wonder whether that is like the articulated bus with a passenger door on the left side in the driver's compartment in a previous report.

Good point. I'm not sure the creator of the Powerpoints is really tied into transit operations. Though I have noticed less and less typos or misstatements in their presentations recently.

I'm surprised by what appears to be the sweeping darker color graphic on the train. I thought they made a point to do away with all exterior decoration except the logo, car number and necessary signage?

[Busjack]

You can add the air conditioners on the top of 1000 in the other reports. Now, if they had said it was 800 and that was the battery pack....

As well as the misplaced CTA logos on the L cars in the Strategic Report.

[Zol87]

I really like the new paint scheme but I'm not a fan of the new headlights. Otherwise, it looks great. I can't wait to ride it.

[Guest]

I really like the new paint scheme but I'm not a fan of the new headlights. Otherwise, it looks great. I can't wait to ride it.

I thought they were going to be an updated 3200 series type car.

[Busjack]

I thought they were going to be an updated 3200 series type car.

As far as the shell, the President's Reports said basically yes (except that the vent chase next to the doors would be bigger, so the windows near there would be smaller), but the board also gave him authority for aesthetic changes. See January President's Report, starting at page 28.

Various proposed headlight treatments are on pages 35 and 36. Given the trend toward projection headlights, I suppose that something like that or in the picture at the top of this topic is possible. Also given that CTA has traditionally used fiberglass ends on cars (most noticeable when the 2400s had red white and blue ends) some sculpting of the front is possible.

However, the black streaks on the side are subject to interpretation, whether they are actually decals or just "vites" (according to Mort Walker of Beetle Bailey, vertical cartoon lines to indicate speed or reflection). Experience with the changing sides of 2400s and 2600s indicates it is not paint.

Also, as Greenstreet has pointed out, and I have repeated proved, we're "not sure the creator of the Powerpoints is really tied into transit operations." Also, the first post was "the latest ... rendering." It isn't like someone took a picture at the plant and said this is what is being assembled.

BTW, the prototypes are supposed to be here in 2009, which isn't that far away, so we'll probably know soon enough.

[sw4400]

When could we possibly see units 5001-5002, 5003-5004(IMO, they need two married pairs because these A/C cars cannot be trained with D/C cars)?

-Spring 2009

-Summer 2009

-Fall 2009

-Winter 2009

And which lines will have them?

-Blue Line

-Brown Line

-Red Line

-Green Line

-Orange Line

-Purple Line

-Pink Line

-Yellow Line

-or a "Stretch Your Legs" tour of duty(a short period on each line to introduce them to the CTA "L" Train riders)

[RJL6000]

When could we possibly see units 5001-5002, 5003-5004(IMO, they need two married pairs because these A/C cars cannot be trained with D/C cars)?

-Spring 2009

-Summer 2009

-Fall 2009

-Winter 2009

And which lines will have them?

-Blue Line

-Brown Line

-Red Line

-Green Line

-Orange Line

-Purple Line

-Pink Line

-Yellow Line

-or a "Stretch Your Legs" tour of duty(a short period on each line to introduce them to the CTA "L" Train riders)

Actually, there will be 10 cars (5001-5010) of this new series for testing. I don't know when they'll arrive, but they will be initially placed on a "Stretch Your Legs" tour of duty as described above.

[rmadisonwi]

At least two of the units already exist and are going through/will soon go through initial testing at the plant before coming to CTA.

[Guest]

At least two of the units already exist and are going through/will soon go through initial testing at the plant before coming to CTA.

All I can say is get your rides, pics and videos now of the 2200s, the end is near! The last "blinker door" style "old school" type subway cars.

[sw4400]

As far as who gets the new ones first this is how I figure it this is just speculation, BTW. I may be incorrect before you say anything, Busjack!

1) Blue or Brown Line(this will start retirement of 2200's(Blue Line) and move 2600's(Blue Line) or 3200's(Brown Line) )

2) *see above*

3) Pink Line(this will finish retirement of 2200's and move 2600's to other lines)

4) Purple Line(this will start retirement of 2400's and move any 2600's and 3200's this line uses to other lines)

5) Green Line(this will finish retirement of 2400's and move any other series cars this line uses to other lines)

[Mr.cta85]

In addition to showcasing CTA's upcoming web site redesign, the Customer Communications Report PDF from today's board meeting includes an updated exterior rendering of the 5000-series rail car on page 19. I've attached that slide as an image for convenience.

If you go to chicago-l.org and go to train roster they have a description of the 5000 series trains and they look like 3200's. But this new photo espically the paint scheme reminds me of the old paint scheme you seen on the old 2600 series. I cant wait till they finally get here they been saying for years about the arrival of the new trains.

[Guest]

If you go to chicago-l.org and go to train roster they have a description of the 5000 series trains and they look like 3200's. But this new photo espically the paint scheme reminds me of the old paint scheme you seen on the old 2600 series. I cant wait till they finally get here they been saying for years about the arrival of the new trains.

Yup, L car deliveries are few and far. Lets turn the clock back a bit, 16 years!. The last order was back in 1992 with the MK 3200s, before that the Budd/TA 2600s in 1981 and 1985. Think about it, the last delivery of subway cars had retired the 6000s as well as the last 5-50 cars on the Skokie Swift.

[Busjack]

As far as who gets the new ones first this is how I figure it this is just speculation, BTW. I may be incorrect before you say anything, Busjack!

1) Blue or Brown Line(this will start retirement of 2200's(Blue Line) and move 2600's(Blue Line) or 3200's(Brown Line) )

2) *see above*

3) Pink Line(this will finish retirement of 2200's and move 2600's to other lines)

4) Purple Line(this will start retirement of 2400's and move any 2600's and 3200's this line uses to other lines)

5) Green Line(this will finish retirement of 2400's and move any other series cars this line uses to other lines)

Not yelling, but the Purple and Green Lines are pretty unlikely, given low ridership, and, in the Purple Line case, most of the cars only being used during rush hour. 406 pretty much just covers the Blue and Pink Lines (142 2200s and 200 3000s, most of the latter to be displaced, as you noted, but I think more likely to the Green and Purple lines). Still think that the other 60 are for Brown Line expansion, but they will be coming a couple of years too late for that (unless they start with the Brown Line, which is unlikely given the need to retire the 2200s).

Based on 406, you are doing double counting if you have both the Blue and Pink lines completely 5000s (likely, especially since they can't train with earlier generations) and also directly replacing 2400s (unlikely).

Something else to throw out there is that since Douglas is now operationally disconnected from the Blue (which wasn't the case when this was first bantered about), the quickest way to retire the 11 sets of 2200s (22 cars) may be to just send some Blue Line 3000s there.

However, since we are two CTA Presidents away from the original pronouncements and 2 or 3 years from seeking the first order of 406 completed, anything can happen and probably will.

Also, as with the buses, we don't know the future timing of the exercise of options, except that according to the consultant's report (which is probably in the trash can by now), the last 86 were supposedly for the Airport Express routes.

Finally, for nostalgia buffs: Since both the 2200 and 2400 series have stainless steel bodies, generally there is nothing wrong about them, and, as has been noted, not much difference in the bodies compared to the 5000s. However, that's not to say that the undercar equipment may be shot.

[RJL6000]

Something else to throw out there is that since Douglas is now operationally disconnected from the Blue (which wasn't the case when this was first bantered about), the quickest way to retire the 11 sets of 2200s (22 cars) may be to just send some Blue Line 3000s there.

Actually, the Pink Line now runs entirely with 2600-series cars numbered in the upper 3100s -- 3157 to 3200, to be exact. All of the 2200s are currently assigned to the Blue Line.

And the Blue Line lost some of its 2900s to the Purple Line. The Blue Line 2600-series fleet now consists of 2979-3030 and 3033-3156 -- 176 cars (in addition to the 140-ish 2200s all assigned to that line).

[Busjack]

Actually, the Pink Line now runs entirely with 2600-series cars numbered in the upper 3100s -- 3157 to 3200, to be exact. All of the 2200s are currently assigned to the Blue Line.

Thanks for the clarification, which would seem to reinforce that the Pink Line probably now would be the last to get 5000 class cars, since it has the upper number 3100s.

Here's another question: would the fact that the Loop signal project is apparently the last to get started also affect where 5000s are tested or eventually deployed?

[RJL6000]

Thanks for the clarification, which would seem to reinforce that the Pink Line probably now would be the last to get 5000 class cars, since it has the upper number 3100s.

More than likely, the Pink Line will receive additional 3100s from the Blue Line when the 5000s arrive in large numbers.

[artthouwill]

I believe Blue Line gets first 250 of these cars, 144 of them to retire the 2200s. The remainder of the 5000s go to the Brown Line and its 3200s replace the 2400s on the Green and Purple Lines. The displaced 2600s from the Blue Line get split among the Pink and Red Lines. This is only speculation.

[Busjack]

I believe Blue Line gets first 250 of these cars, 144 of them to retire the 2200s. The remainder of the 5000s go to the Brown Line and its 3200s replace the 2400s on the Green and Purple Lines. The displaced 2600s from the Blue Line get split among the Pink and Red Lines. This is only speculation.

Anything is possible with current CTA management, but 2600s from the Blue Line wouldn't be needed to displace 2600s from the Red and Pink Lines, which already have 2600s. Then you would have to displace those 2600s somewhere, but you are already putting 3200s on the Green and Purple. But there aren't enough 3200s on the Brown Line to cover that (remember, about 110 are on the Orange, leaving about 138 on the Brown, and 8 on the Yellow).

Because they don't trainline with existing cars, one would think that the Blue Line would be exclusively 5000s, but RJL's numbers indicate that you would need at least 320 to do that, not 250.

Of course, one would also have to throw in that the 3200s are about ready for their midlifes. If they take 40 off the property at a time, like they did the 2600s, then anything can happen.

[chgofan78]

It would make sense for the Blue Line to get 5000-series cars (considering all the signal upgrades the route is getting), but wouldn't the entire route have to have the same equipment for the route to function well? I think the CTA should split these cars among the Blue, Pink, and Yellow Lines. I think 330 cars should be assigned to the Blue Line. Right now the Blue Line has 318 cars assigned to it. The Pink Line should get 66 cars which would allow rush hour service to expand to 6 cars. The Blue and Pink Lines share equipment when there are shortages so this idea would work there. Finally, 10 cars get assigned to the Yellow Line. The 220 2600 cars assigned to the Blue and Pink Lines now should get split between Green and Purple Lines. My final breakdown would be as followed.

Red Line- 360 2600 series cars

Yellow Line- 10 5000 series cars

Blue Line- 330 5000 series cars

Green Line- 140 2600 series cars

Purple Line- 96 2600 series cars

Orange Line- 108 3200 series cars

Brown Line- 148 3200 series cars

Pink Line- 66 5000 series cars

If the cars were assigned in this manner, it allows the Green, Orange, Blue and Purple Lines to expand service by one to three more trains during rush hour. Plus, it allows every route to consolidate equipment to one series of cars except the Brown Line which would get 3457-3458 and boost its total to 150 cars.

[Guest]

Hello all,

The Spring, 2009 issue of First and Fastest magazine just come out and on the back cover is a picture of the first two brand new 5000 series cars at Bombardier's plant in NY. Not a good shot of the cab end because it is pulled by a CP Rail SD-40 but it looks like the familiar 2600 series ends. You can see the exterior sides look identical to the 3200s except for one or two smaller windows along the sides, one of them behind the motorman's window. No numbers or any other markings on them. The Spring 2009 First and Fastest issue is very good, everyone reading this should get a copy. The main story are the new NICTD bilevel cars, some great shots! I cant wait to read it. Also IRM will be getting South Shore Line car #1100 and an excellent article on the special private car #553 run on the UP/Metra North Line, both in the CNW days and Metra. Good issue!!

[Jon]

Could you scan the pictures? I'd be interested in seeing that. (The 5000s I mean, of course)

[sw4400]

Hello all,

The Spring, 2009 issue of First and Fastest magazine just come out and on the back cover is a picture of the first two brand new 5000 series cars at Bombardier's plant in NY. Not a good shot of the cab end because it is pulled by a CP Rail SD-40 but it looks like the familiar 2600 series ends. You can see the exterior sides look identical to the 3200s except for one or two smaller windows along the sides, one of them behind the motorman's window. No numbers or any other markings on them. The Spring 2009 First and Fastest issue is very good, everyone reading this should get a copy. The main story are the new NICTD bilevel cars, some great shots! I cant wait to read it. Also IRM will be getting South Shore Line car #1100 and an excellent article on the special private car #553 run on the UP/Metra North Line, both in the CNW days and Metra. Good issue!!

If you do, copyright them to First and Fastest Magazine... so Busjack doesn't get in a tizzy. <_<