Whats is left for 1993 Orion 1s from Pace

[BusExpert32]

Saw 2279 and 2345 doing the shuttle for the Wilmette fireworks today. Many North Shore buses were out doing this route from Edens Plaza to the lakefront.

[twyztdmynd]

Thought I saw 2282 on 576. Definitely an Orion I

[BusExpert32]

Thought I saw 2282 on 576. Definitely an Orion I

I've been seeing 2280 and 2282 on Webwatch recently, so that's four I can account for seeing this past month: 2279, 2280, 2282, and 2345.

[BusExpert32]

I've been seeing 2280 and 2282 on Webwatch recently, so that's four I can account for seeing this past month: 2279, 2280, 2282, and 2345.

Does anyone have more definitive knowledge about the Orion I situation at North Shore and North?

[Busjack]

Does anyone have more definitive knowledge about the Orion I situation at North Shore and North?

As I previously indicated, Andre posted the results of his FOIA request on CPTDB here, and that seems about correct. I've seen 2272 and 2274 at Ravinia, as well as some of the 1990 buses he lists as Ravinia service. Other than the sporadic sightings, I think we have to wait to see what is on the school trippers (as he indicated here, except he left out North) in about a month.

I don't think we'll see any real movement until the Axess(es) appear.

Also, one may note that the "official roster" includes buses not in the annual budget.

[BusExpert32]

As I previously indicated, Andre posted the results of his FOIA request on CPTDB here, and that seems about correct. I've seen 2272 and 2274 at Ravinia, as well as some of the 1990 buses he lists as Ravinia service. Other than the sporadic sightings, I think we have to wait to see what is on the school trippers (as he indicated here, except he left out North) in about a month.

I don't think we'll see any real movement until the Axess(es) appear.

Also, one may note that the "official roster" includes buses not in the annual budget.

As far as the Ravinia service, the Pace website mentions two routes, 475 and 476. Are there two separate routes? Any maps I found of the Pace Shuttle Service are very vague, so where do the buses terminate around Ravinia Park?

[Railwaymodeler]

As I previously indicated, Andre posted the results of his FOIA request on CPTDB here, and that seems about correct. I've seen 2272 and 2274 at Ravinia, as well as some of the 1990 buses he lists as Ravinia service. Other than the sporadic sightings, I think we have to wait to see what is on the school trippers (as he indicated here, except he left out North) in about a month.

I don't think we'll see any real movement until the Axess(es) appear.

Also, one may note that the "official roster" includes buses not in the annual budget.

Well, that's North for ya! We're that out of the way division where buses go to die. No one really pays attention to it anymore.

Seriously, though, very soon I'll likely be seeing some Orions out on the road. School starts up in a couple weeks, and if the powers that be at the garage have much sense (There's a first for everything!), then the mechanics will be looking at the buses and sending them out on test runs. Mostly, except for Ravinia service, they've been mothballed for the summer. From what I have been told, some of them were not used at all over the summer; Only a few were out at Ravinia from North.

2368 has been out on the road here and there. One of my friends on extra board loves that bus! Says it accelerates faster than most NABIs and has good air conditioning. Of course, thinking back, one time 2335 seemed to run faster than a 6600 series even. That is sad, as the 6600s are 10 years newer, and 2335 almost made it to the Guiness Book of World Records as slowest bus in the world!

I'll keep my eyes open for any Orions. Guess that means ears open too, as I can tell the bus series without looking at it; Just need to hear the engine!

[Busjack]

As far as the Ravinia service, the Pace website mentions two routes, 475 and 476. Are there two separate routes? Any maps I found of the Pace Shuttle Service are very vague, so where do the buses terminate around Ravinia Park?

It said two routes, but I doubt it. There used to be a route between Ravinia and the Forest Preserve parking lot south of Lake-Cook Road, but permission to use it was withdrawn several years ago. Ravinia's site itself indicates only the downtown Metra lots on St. Johns Ave. I've also, on occasion, seen a bus on Lake Cook Road.

There is a turnaround on the north side of the park, about St. Johns Ave. north of where it turns east, which you can see on this Google Map. I can remember when there was also a lineup on the south end of the park. but that would have been sometime in the 1990s.

[BusExpert32]

As I previously indicated, Andre posted the results of his FOIA request on CPTDB here, and that seems about correct. I've seen 2272 and 2274 at Ravinia, as well as some of the 1990 buses he lists as Ravinia service. Other than the sporadic sightings, I think we have to wait to see what is on the school trippers (as he indicated here, except he left out North) in about a month.

I don't think we'll see any real movement until the Axess(es) appear.

Also, one may note that the "official roster" includes buses not in the annual budget.

I've seen 2279, 2280, and 2282 on Webwatch recently out of North Shore. I physically saw 2345 working the shuttle for the Wilmette July 3rd festivities. However, there are a number of ghost buses on Webwatch: 1 bus on the 421 when 2 are running, 3 buses on the 215 when 4 are running, and other circumstances on North Shore routes where buses are missing on Webwatch. I thought these could be the other Orion Is, such as 2278, 2281, 2284, 2285, 2349, or 2350, but I'm not sure what the age of the bus has to do with failure of a Webwatch connection.

[Busjack]

but I'm not sure what the age of the bus has to do with failure of a Webwatch connection.

Since all of them at least had IBS equipment that showed up on occasion, my guess is that it has something to do with the login procedure.

However, I haven't been near enough to 421 to scope out that discrepancy. I can certainly say that I haven't physically seen any Orion Is on 422 or 423 for a while now. Twy's was the only sighting on a Shuttle Bug; I checked the cage the day after that and there wasn't any there.

[BusExpert32]

Since all of them at least had IBS equipment that showed up on occasion, my guess is that it has something to do with the login procedure.

However, I haven't been near enough to 421 to scope out that discrepancy. I can certainly say that I haven't physically seen any Orion Is on 422 or 423 for a while now. Twy's was the only sighting on a Shuttle Bug; I checked the cage the day after that and there wasn't any there.

I think the one Orion I on the Shuttle Bugs is the one that transports the bus drivers to the cage and then back.

Also, there is usually an Orion I on the 422 that starts at Old Orchard at 2:00 pm eastbound and does a round trip back to Old Orchard and then back to Linden where it arrives at 3:30 pm and that's it.

[Busjack]

I think the one Orion I on the Shuttle Bugs is the one that transports the bus drivers to the cage and then back.

Also, there is usually an Orion I on the 422 that starts at Old Orchard at 2:00 pm eastbound and does a round trip back to Old Orchard and then back to Linden where it arrives at 3:30 pm and that's it.

The first isn't the case, because they rotate the buses in and out. Might have been the one day twy saw it, but otherwise wouldn't be the case

My 422 observations are based on the extension to Northbrook Ct. The one run you mention starts at New Trier Northfield on school days, and even though it isn't a school day now, maybe that is a special run, in that the couple of times I have seen a bus at Linden about then, it hasn't stopped. The outbound run at 3:30 uses a NW bus.

I also have a feeling that at some point the 422 bus on the Old Orchard-Linden only segment eventually becomes a 421, but haven't tracked it that closely.

[BusExpert32]

The first isn't the case, because they rotate the buses in and out. Might have been the one day twy saw it, but otherwise wouldn't be the case

My 422 observations are based on the extension to Northbrook Ct. The one run you mention starts at New Trier Northfield on school days, and even though it isn't a school day now, maybe that is a special run, in that the couple of times I have seen a bus at Linden about then, it hasn't stopped. The outbound run at 3:30 uses a NW bus.

I also have a feeling that at some point the 422 bus on the Old Orchard-Linden only segment eventually becomes a 421, but haven't tracked it that closely.

The run always starts at Old Orchard at 3:00, school day or not. On school days the trip is longer because it goes to New Trier and Loyola. They changed it recently since it used to have NS next to it, the S for school days only, but now the N is just a reroute during the school year.

Also, a North Shore bus on the 422 that comes into Linden (from Northbrook) at 2:39 pm becomes the 421 at 2:45 pm, but this run hasn't used an Orion I in a while.

[Busjack]

If one wants to get technical, bus 6664 is in Lake Michigan off Howard St. at the moment.

(I spotted this when trying to trace the above. Hopefully, I'll look back in a half hour.)

Update: 2 minutes later, it made it back to McCormick Blvd., where it belongs.

[BusExpert32]

If one wants to get technical, bus 6664 is in Lake Michigan off Howard St. at the moment.

(I spotted this when trying to trace the above. Hopefully, I'll look back in a half hour.)

Update: 2 minutes later, it made it back to McCormick Blvd., where it belongs.

The run has 6664 today. Must be a different bus driver today, since every time I saw the bus it was the same one who must like the Orion Is to pull one out of the garage every time.

[Busjack]

Delving a little deeper, I get 2 buses on 421, but 2656 came off of 422 and was replaced by 6263, leaving the Northbrook Court trips covered by the usual one blue NABI, one Eldo, and one Orion VI. Other bus on 421 is 6649. Looks like 6664 is heading back to the garage.

My next suspicion is either confirmed or not in 15 minutes.

[BusExpert32]

Delving a little deeper, I get 2 buses on 421, but 2656 came off of 422 and was replaced by 6263, leaving the Northbrook Court trips covered by the usual one blue NABI, one Eldo, and one Orion VI. Other bus on 421 is 6649. Looks like 6664 is heading back to the garage.

My next suspicion is either confirmed or not in 15 minutes.

But 2656 only does one round trip. Now there is a ghost bus.

Also at the moment, the NS bus on the 210 isn't showing up. And I'm pretty sure the 213 should have more than 4 buses at this time. And there's much more examples of missing buses on Webwatch than this.

My question is whether this is a problem that plagues any buses at NS, or just the Orion Is that andre still had on the roster?

[twyztdmynd]

Was at Lake Cook last night after Lollapalooza. Train was 25 minutes late. Was suprized to see an MP36 double header with an 8 car on a sunday but we all know why. I just rarely see an MP36 double. Anyway... 6 cage busses last night. 5 Eldo and 1 nabi- white.

[trainman8119]

Was suprized to see an MP36 double header with an 8 car on a sunday but we all know why. I just rarely see an MP36 double.

One probably crapped out and the other was the designated protector and was added either in

Fox Lake (from the start) or downtown (if the problem occurred later). I am sure it had nothing

to do with carrying large crowds.

[sht6131]

Was at Lake Cook last night after Lollapalooza. Train was 25 minutes late. Was suprized to see an MP36 double header with an 8 car on a sunday but we all know why. I just rarely see an MP36 double. Anyway... 6 cage busses last night. 5 Eldo and 1 nabi- white.

Train 2116 weekday out of Fox lake is a nine car double.

[Busjack]

But 2656 only does one round trip. Now there is a ghost bus.

...

Webwatch says that 2282 is on that run today, which tends to disprove your theory that the IBS is not on or not reporting from an Orion I.

[BusExpert32]

Webwatch says that 2282 is on that run today, which tends to disprove your theory that the IBS is not on or not reporting from an Orion I.

I've seen 2279, 2280, and 2282 on Webwatch recently. I was refering to other Orion Is that we used to see like 2281, 2284, 2285, 2349, etc. In the post you quoted me on, I was talking about the run on 421 that starts at 3:45 pm westbound at Linden that is always a ghost bus on Webwatch. I will just have to check it out one day.

[Busjack]

... I will just have to check it out one day.

That's true. Usually when I check out something like that, it turns out that the ghost bus has a blank or NOT IN SERVICE destination sign, indicating some sort of logging in error. Sometimes it has a nonsensical run number, such as 304A.

Heck, there were a couple of weeks with a lot of ghost buses in Highland Park. Despite what I thought, it was not because 2830 and 2831 didn't have IBSs, since they did show up on Webwatch once the announcement that they had been put into service was made. It doesn't look like 2830 is getting much use, but that's probably a different story.

[BusExpert32]

That's true. Usually when I check out something like that, it turns out that the ghost bus has a blank or NOT IN SERVICE destination sign, indicating some sort of logging in error. Sometimes it has a nonsensical run number, such as 304A.

Heck, there were a couple of weeks with a lot of ghost buses in Highland Park. Despite what I thought, it was not because 2830 and 2831 didn't have IBSs, since they did show up on Webwatch once the announcement that they had been put into service was made. It doesn't look like 2830 is getting much use, but that's probably a different story.

So what happens to the Webwatch connection if a destination sign doesn't work at all, which is likely with the age of the Orion Is?

[Busjack]

So what happens to the Webwatch connection if a destination sign doesn't work at all, which is likely with the age of the Orion Is?

I think this is another chicken and egg problem. If the dots don't flip, that's just a mechanical problem.

I base my conclusion on when I wrote "Ask Pace" on Moving Forward regarding a consistently wrong destination sign,* and they said it was controlled by the MDT (mobile data terminal) on the IBS. Hence, if the IBS is fouled up, Webwatch and usually the destination signs are fouled up on a consistent basis. And, from what you are saying, the ghost buses are consistent. Maybe it is just a matter that it doesn't recognize a particular run number, and hence can't load the instructions for that run.

A condition on that is that CTA drivers have said on this board that they can't use the Luminator box to change a sign without the Clever Device overriding it, while the Pace drivers say you can without it being overridden by the IBS. Hence, I have occasionally seen Pace drivers reach up to the box mounted over the windshield and "rolled" the sign, including on the first day of operation of the restructured routes at Linden (driver couldn't find the 422 Northbrook Ct sign, and the street supervisor said that the program trigger date might not have been properly programmed).

____

*At that time, I guess about 2006 or 2007, affected both flip dot signs on Orion Is and amber LED signs on blue NABIs.