Busjack Posted April 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 I think I know what the Electric Test Buses will be.... New Flyers!!! There's a company called Electric Fuel Transportation Corp. that takes standard-sized 40' Buses and mounts the EFTC Zinc-Air Fuel Cell into the Bus. FR's. .... Theoretically that's fine, especially if they met their claim that the batteries could run a transit bus for 8 hours and be swapped out for recharge. However, I got suspicious when they said they were putting them on an RTS bus, which no longer exists, so, as usual, I cleaned up the url and went to the home page. Their Electric Vehicle page says "The EV program is presently inactive." Also, the last press release is Nov. 2004, and I am sure battery technology has changed since then. So other than the swappable battery idea, I don't think this is it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted April 26, 2011 Report Share Posted April 26, 2011 The Spin View is neat, but basically any new bus looks about the same on the inside. I would rather see the motor and battery pack. The steering wheel looks as if it's from a car or luxury yacht, and the driver's seat looks way more comfortable than what's currently at the CTA. Overall the bus looks like it is 10-20 years ahead of it's time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted June 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 From today's agenda, it looks like CTA is ready to make an award on this. Update: The Press Release at the bottom says New Flyer, so someone wasn't lucky, but we'll have to find out what system is being used. Further Update: That was in the preceding paragraph of the press release and now noted on the home page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 Isn't Siemens the same company that made the ISE-Thundervolt 900-Series New Flyers? I haven't heard a lot about these units.... it's almost like they're non-existent. Are they that bad of a design? And if so, why would the CTA let Siemens make two all-electric buses then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted June 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 Isn't Siemens the same company that made the ISE-Thundervolt 900-Series New Flyers?? As far as the internet indicates, no. ISE's corporate page indicates that it is a subsidiary of Bluways NV, which is a Belgian company. We all know that Siemens is German. In fact, New Flyer previously indicated that it was making contingency plans with respect to ISE because ISE was then in bankruptcy. Where do you get these ideas??????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
See Tea Eh Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 I see 800s and 900s in service with about equal frequency (that is to say, every once in a while). Given that the 900s represent about one half of once percent of the bus fleet, it's quite understandable that you wouldn't see them very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVTArider Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 If these BEVs from New Flyer work out alright I wonder if CTA will consider converting diesel units to electric? CCW recently converted a D40LF to BEV: http://www.completecoach.com/zeps-timelapse/ CCW page on the ZEPS project Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 If these BEVs from New Flyer work out alright I wonder if CTA will consider converting diesel units to electric? CCW recently converted a D40LF to BEV: http://www.completec...zeps-timelapse/ CCW page on the ZEPS project Given that they just announced converting 1030 diesels to diesels, undoubtedly not. As you may note, I earlier questioned the bona fides of a federal government grant of about $2.5 million to test two buses for one year. Maybe something like this would work on a downtown shuttle route (like 124) if there were a charging station at Navy Pier or under Wacker Drive, but certainly not on something like an LSD express route. The only thing I note as precedent is that around 1995, CTA had a test of 3 NF-Ballard fuel cell buses. They lasted a couple of years, but none were subsequently ordered, and at one time there was an RFP to repower them as diesel, but that never happened, either. They just became hulks at 77th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted August 2, 2012 Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 Surfing the news page at New Flyer I came across an article in which they announce it's first order for an all electric bus. (I thought they already had one) If you read the article, they mention they will be building on the Xcelsior platform. Further digging turns up the pictures of the bus at it's unveiling here. So I guess the CTA will be getting 2 Xcelsiors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted August 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2012 Surfing the news page at New Flyer I came across an article in which they announce it's first order for an all electric bus. (I thought they already had one) If you read the article, they mention they will be building on the Xcelsior platform. Further digging turns up the pictures of the bus at it's unveiling here. So I guess the CTA will be getting 2 Xcelsiors. You never know, but I assume that an Xcelsior is a lighter bus. Anyway, it appears that CTA is getting it for 1/3 of the cost of that prototype. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoNova Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 I checked out the Complete Coach Works website and searched "Fuel Conversions," and read that they could also convert a diesel bus into a hybrid diesel-electric bus. As far as the NABI artics are concerned, maybe CTA could have Complete Coach Works recycle/rehabilitate those artics into hybrid buses, and/or maybe into BRT buses for the upcoming BRT, instead of scrapping them. Just an idea. It may save CTA a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJL6000 Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 I checked out the Complete Coach Works website and searched "Fuel Conversions," and read that they could also convert a diesel bus into a hybrid diesel-electric bus. As far as the NABI artics are concerned, maybe CTA could have Complete Coach Works recycle/rehabilitate those artics into hybrid buses, and/or maybe into BRT buses for the upcoming BRT, instead of scrapping them. Just an idea. It may save CTA a lot of money. Actually, it is definitely unfeasible to convert those NABI artics: Their problems are structural, and the conversions do absolutely nothing at all whatsoever to fix those structural problems. Those buses will continue to fall apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 I checked out the Complete Coach Works website and searched "Fuel Conversions," and read that they could also convert a diesel bus into a hybrid diesel-electric bus. As far as the NABI artics are concerned, maybe CTA could have Complete Coach Works recycle/rehabilitate those artics into hybrid buses, and/or maybe into BRT buses for the upcoming BRT, instead of scrapping them. Just an idea. It may save CTA a lot of money. To add on about this not solving the structural issues that got these buses pulled, it would also be a waste of money from the standpoint that the CTA announced plans to add a possible 200 plus extra artics in the next couple years. The 100 that are set to be here in total by next year plus a sliding number of 50 to 150, based on what others report reading in the RFP for bids, from the yet to be awarded contract to whatever manufacturer for a combo order of 40 foot standard buses and 60 foot artics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted August 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 Actually, it is definitely unfeasible to convert those NABI artics: Their problems are structural, and the conversions do absolutely nothing at all whatsoever to fix those structural problems. Those buses will continue to fall apart. I agree with that one, including that they are supposedly going to the scrapper. Also, if the problems are structural, how is one going to support a battery pack on its roof? Maybe what someone like ChicagoNova can explain the fascination with junk (NABIs here, others with Flxs elsewhere). I think I will hybridize a New Look, next. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 You never know, but I assume that an Xcelsior is a lighter bus. Anyway, it appears that CTA is getting it for 1/3 of the cost of that prototype. Yes, they well be New Flyer XE40 "Xcelsior" models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 Yes, they well be New Flyer XE40 "Xcelsior" models. Hopefully they can get some more Xcelsiors in this 40/60 bid, if New Flyer wins. (They probably will win.) Then they could have 3 different looking buses from NF in abundance. The Seattle 100,the XE Xcelsior, and the current model. The only thing I don't like about the Xcelsior is if you look at the interior one of the stairs to the back of the bus is cut on an angle. I don't know if that would be a hazard or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.cta85 Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 Hey I have a question, does anybody know when will the 425 buses that cta got from Seattle will be coming in and are those New Flyer buses? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
See Tea Eh Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 CTA is not getting 425 buses from Seattle. Further, discussion on the not-yet-bid order for 425 buses is already going on in this thread and this thread, in both of which you have already posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
completecoach Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 Actually, it is definitely unfeasible to convert those NABI artics: Their problems are structural, and the conversions do absolutely nothing at all whatsoever to fix those structural problems. Those buses will continue to fall apart. Complete Coach Works is currently finishing up a structural rehab contract for 60ft Articulating Neoplan SF MUNI buses. Cracking, and in a few extreme cases, complete structural failure, have plagued the sixty foot Neoplan buses at San Francisco MUNI for several years. The problem persisted even after SF MUNI applied the Neoplan prescribed field repair procedure. Working with MUNI engineering staff Complete Coach Works developed a comprehensive fix that seeks to not only repair and reinforce the localized manifestation of the cracks, but seeks a bigger picture approach to the affected area by adding additional structural members, strategically located gusseting and header plates, along with a steel plate that covers the entire exposed area shown below and plug welded to both spread the stresses and loads as well as tying the entire area together to form a stronger section. This contract was written as a result of another rehab project we did a few years ago, SF MUNI 62 bus rehab, and the discovery was made that the articulating structural joints were failing. These comprehensive structural builds are still operating strong, even with San Francisco's abusive roads and steep grades/turns, and drivers years later. As it may be true that conversions/retrofits from several inexperienced remanufacturing companies do not fix the structural imperfections of manufacturing, Complete Coach Works' approach is one that puts the customer first and delivers a high quality service for each bus they touch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 I agree with that one, including that they are supposedly going to the scrapper. Also, if the problems are structural, how is one going to support a battery pack on its roof? Maybe what someone like ChicagoNova can explain the fascination with junk (NABIs here, others with Flxs elsewhere). I think I will hybridize a New Look, next. I have to agree with Busjack... the NABI's are gone and aren't coming back, and nobody is to blame for that except NABI and their shoddy work on the 60-LFW buses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoNova Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 I have to agree with Busjack... the NABI's are gone and aren't coming back, and nobody is to blame for that except NABI and their shoddy work on the 60-LFW buses. CTA just shouldn't have purchased those buses in the first place. They might have done better if they purchased maybe New Flyer artics (diesel at least) at the time they purchased the NABI artics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 CTA just shouldn't have purchased those buses in the first place. They might have done better if they purchased maybe New Flyer artics (diesel at least) at the time they purchased the NABI artics. I think New Flyer did put a bid in for the 225 Articulated bus order, but for some reason, CTA went with NABI(I don't know if it was because of the Buy America Act and maybe New Flyer was in Winnipeg only, not St. Cloud, MN at the time). In any case, CTA chose them, and to quote the knight for Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade... "You have chosen..... poorly." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoNova Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 I think New Flyer did put a bid in for the 225 Articulated bus order, but for some reason, CTA went with NABI(I don't know if it was because of the Buy America Act and maybe New Flyer was in Winnipeg only, not St. Cloud, MN at the time). In any case, CTA chose them, and to quote the knight for Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade... "You have chosen..... poorly." Yes, CTA chose.....poorly. New Flyer began making D60LFs in 1995. If CTA would've chosen those artics instead, there might have been a total of 434 (or 376 at least) artics running around Chicago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
See Tea Eh Posted August 7, 2012 Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Yes, CTA chose.....poorly. New Flyer began making D60LFs in 1995. If CTA would've chosen those artics instead, there might have been a total of 434 (or 376 at least) artics running around Chicago. Why don't you use your perfect hindsight to retroactively change CTA's decision...oh, wait. You can't. Now, if you had predicted 10 or so years ago (or whenever the contract was signed) that NABI buses were going to be junk and that CTA should go with New Flyer instead, that's one thing. But complaining 3.5 years after they were pulled from service and saying CTA should have, a decade ago, purchased a different product is like me saying I should have picked six specific lottery numbers for last week's Powerball drawing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted August 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2012 Why don't you use your perfect hindsight ... Why don't people use this topic to discuss ELECTRIC BUSES? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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