Routes that need Artics or Increased Service

[Busjack]

10 minutes ago, sht6131 said:

No I do not. If you are relating to ridership, the schedule dept. gives Roosevelt 12 to 13 minutes Sat. and 14 on Sunday. Cermak gets 15 minutes on Saturday and 16 minutes on Sunday. Should the schedule dept. decrease the interval or is there another issue I should be aware of?

As far as deceasing the interval, the staff shortage probably precludes that. Note that after the last adjustment, there wasn't a spring bus pick.

[Tcmetro]

Cermak started getting artics during the pandemic. Somehow it's kept them although I believe they've been taken off Cottage Grove, 79th, Chicago, Pulaski, etc.

Roosevelt has had artics on the weekends for a while now. I've always thought that they should improve the frequency and run 40 foot buses. Roosevelt is a traffic nightmare from Michigan to Halsted at almost all hours.

[artthouwill]

During the week,  both Roosevelt and Cermak have a mixture of artics and 40 ft buses which seems to go all artics on the weekend.   Due to recent changes,  it appears that K only runs a few artics on the 151 During weeksay rush hours.  Outside of that,  NP runs that route alone which frees up  artics to use on other routes.

One possible reason Cottage Grove and 79th list artics could be the high number of artics at SS getting repairs.  Another reason is that 79th isn't conducive for running artics and the turn at 115th and Front St is too difficult for artics to make.  It's inconsistent for the 40ft buses to turn on Front St and the artics using King Drive.  Also 77th doesn't consistently keep artics in its fleet nor does it really have a use for them outside of those two routes.

 

[Mr.NewFlyer1279]

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

During the week,  both Roosevelt and Cermak have a mixture of artics and 40 ft buses which seems to go all artics on the weekend.   Due to recent changes,  it appears that K only runs a few artics on the 151 During weeksay rush hours.  Outside of that,  NP runs that route alone which frees up  artics to use on other routes.

One possible reason Cottage Grove and 79th list artics could be the high number of artics at SS getting repairs.  Another reason is that 79th isn't conducive for running artics and the turn at 115th and Front St is too difficult for artics to make.  It's inconsistent for the 40ft buses to turn on Front St and the artics using King Drive.  Also 77th doesn't consistently keep artics in its fleet nor does it really have a use for them outside of those two routes.

 

C and 77th lost their artics last year that’s why they’re not on 79th or Cottage no more

[Shannoncvpi]

4 hours ago, Mr.NewFlyer1279 said:

C and 77th lost their artics last year that’s why they’re not on 79th or Cottage no more

Yea C was losing them when I switched to C it was only like 5 artics left but they were gone a few days later

[artthouwill]

4 hours ago, Mr.NewFlyer1279 said:

C and 77th lost their artics last year that’s why they’re not on 79th or Cottage no more

I know.   I was just stating why 77th lost their artics.

[Mr.NewFlyer1279]

2 hours ago, artthouwill said:

I know.   I was just stating why 77th lost their artics.

idk if you remember but when 7 had em there used to be trips to 115th idk how they made that sharp turn lmao

[YoungBusLover]

1 hour ago, Mr.NewFlyer1279 said:

idk if you remember but when 7 had em there used to be trips to 115th idk how they made that sharp turn lmao

The turn isn't that hard to make, angling out wide about 40 feet from the intersection is what I always did with them. Management had layover on Cottage then after departure we would make the turn heading WB to King Drive before heading back NB. Some operator for whatever reason would try and make that turn on to Front Street and they would end gettting the max angle joint fail activated on the bus. 

[strictures]

The 155 desperately needs artics during the day, when so many people use it to go shopping on Devon.

[artthouwill]

7 hours ago, YoungBusLover said:

The turn isn't that hard to make, angling out wide about 40 feet from the intersection is what I always did with them. Management had layover on Cottage then after departure we would make the turn heading WB to King Drive before heading back NB. Some operator for whatever reason would try and make that turn on to Front Street and they would end gettting the max angle joint fail activated on the bus. 

This was exactly my point.  The 40 ft buses used Front St and the artics used King Drive.  If you were waiting by the ME Kensington station and an artic came, you missed the bus.  If you waited at 115th and King Drive  and a 40 ft bus came and turned on Front St, you missed the bus.  Ir sounds minor.  The route used to turn on King Drive from 115th, but someone decided that serving the Metra Electric station on Front St was a good idea.   Maybe it is, but artics weren't taken into consideration when that happened.    

To your point,  the angle shouldn't be too bad.  The NB 26 has a sharper turn from NB Exchange to EB 83rd St.  Granted,  the viaduct immediately east of Front St and the narrowness of Front St make that turn more difficult.  If there are are any parked cars or sitting vehicles,  that makes it worse.  Removing artics from the 4 makes sense.

[YoungBusLover]

7 hours ago, artthouwill said:

This was exactly my point.  The 40 ft buses used Front St and the artics used King Drive.  If you were waiting by the ME Kensington station and an artic came, you missed the bus.  If you waited at 115th and King Drive  and a 40 ft bus came and turned on Front St, you missed the bus.  Ir sounds minor.  The route used to turn on King Drive from 115th, but someone decided that serving the Metra Electric station on Front St was a good idea.   Maybe it is, but artics weren't taken into consideration when that happened.    

To your point,  the angle shouldn't be too bad.  The NB 26 has a sharper turn from NB Exchange to EB 83rd St.  Granted,  the viaduct immediately east of Front St and the narrowness of Front St make that turn more difficult.  If there are are any parked cars or sitting vehicles,  that makes it worse.  Removing artics from the 4 makes sense.

Yessir, you're correct. That's what happened every time during the pandemic until they we're eventually traded away. I would do my best to honk my horn at people to head over to King Drive so they wouldn't miss the bus. That Metra station being used as the overall terminal at Front Street was the dumbest thing in the world to implement.  Cottage Grove and 115th Street should of remained the layover area for both 40/60 foot buses at that time and King Drive should of been the first stop because I barely picked up anyone that came out of ME station coming from the south. 

[YoungBusLover]

3 hours ago, strictures said:

The 155 desperately needs artics during the day, when so many people use it to go shopping on Devon.

Traffic on Devon would make service worse in my honest opinion.

[Busjack]

21 minutes ago, YoungBusLover said:

Traffic on Devon would make service worse in my honest opinion.

 Undoubtedly the case, especially how congested it is between California and Ridge.

[strictures]

I rode the 22 today after 1PM.  Extremely crowded buses, the NB driver refuse to let people on at Bryn Mawr & Ridge.

Clark definitely also needs artics all day.

[strictures]

6 hours ago, YoungBusLover said:

Traffic on Devon would make service worse in my honest opinion.

That makes no sense whatsoever!

[artthouwill]

52 minutes ago, strictures said:

That makes no sense whatsoever!

Devon is like 79th.  Whatever benefits of having larger loads would be offset by swell times and traffic. 

[sht6131]

2 hours ago, strictures said:

I rode the 22 today after 1PM.  Extremely crowded buses, the NB driver refuse to let people on at Bryn Mawr & Ridge.

Clark definitely also needs artics all day.

They need more buses and a better schedule. 12 to 15 min nb after 1 weekdays There Saturday and Sunday schedule is better than that.

[Busjack]

40 minutes ago, sht6131 said:

They need more buses and a better schedule. 12 to 15 min nb after 1 weekdays There Saturday and Sunday schedule is better than that.

Again, the problem is the staff shortage. No sense scheduling more trips if CTA can't man them.

[Shannoncvpi]

21 hours ago, YoungBusLover said:

The turn isn't that hard to make, angling out wide about 40 feet from the intersection is what I always did with them. Management had layover on Cottage then after departure we would make the turn heading WB to King Drive before heading back NB. Some operator for whatever reason would try and make that turn on to Front Street and they would end gettting the max angle joint fail activated on the bus. 

Man the first time I got that alert it scared tf out of me I though I broke the bus

[sht6131]

2 hours ago, Busjack said:

Again, the problem is the staff shortage. No sense scheduling more trips if CTA can't man them.

I understand that and I respect your comments, but the schedule dept. schedules more 22 buses on the weekends without the regard of not having enough staff if that is the issue regarding weekdays. I would think drivers would rather work weekdays instead of weekends.

[strictures]

11 hours ago, sht6131 said:

They need more buses and a better schedule. 12 to 15 min nb after 1 weekdays There Saturday and Sunday schedule is better than that.

I've waited for a NB Clark for 40 minutes one day & 30 on another day.  Those are weekday midday times.  Since I'm at Devon, I can see the 36 Broadways pulling out of the Clark/Arthur terminal, no shortage of them, so reassign a few drivers to Clark, which is a far more important route than Broadway!  normal has always been 12 minute headways.  But the CTA has always screwed around with Clark, as I remember back in the 70s when they cut every other bus at Devon & only every other went to Howard all day long.  The other problem is they need to bring back the street corner supervisors, who would alter schedules as needed.  Moving up one run if necessary or reassigning a bus to a different route.  I remember the Jackson/Michigan supervisor reassigning a #3 & making it a #4 when there weren't any SB #4s for 30 minutes.  When we went past 13th/Michigan, there were a half dozen #4s all running in a huge bunch NB!

[YoungBusLover]

On 5/9/2023 at 11:33 PM, sht6131 said:

I understand that and I respect your comments, but the schedule dept. schedules more 22 buses on the weekends without the regard of not having enough staff if that is the issue regarding weekdays. I would think drivers would rather work weekdays instead of weekends.

The schedule dept has no control over the manpower though, the available manpower is there to cover the runs. However, the real problem lies in the operators using FMLA, sickbook entries and other forms of time off methods to not cover the runs for a multitude of reasons. Nonetheless, the 22 is a high demand route with priority over the 155. Does the 155 cover games at Wrigley every other weekend? Some operators would work weekends just not on Clark due to all the congestion, games at a Wrigley ,multiple detours and last but not least overall distance. If I worked out of NP I'd find a way to work the 97 over the 22 on weekends. 

[YoungBusLover]

5 minutes ago, strictures said:

I've waited for a NB Clark for 40 minutes one day & 30 on another day.  Those are weekday midday times.  Since I'm at Devon, I can see the 36 Broadways pulling out of the Clark/Arthur terminal, no shortage of them, so reassign a few drivers to Clark, which is a far more important route than Broadway!  normal has always been 12 minute headways.  But the CTA has always screwed around with Clark, as I remember back in the 70s when they cut every other bus at Devon & only every other went to Howard all day long.  The other problem is they need to bring back the street corner supervisors, who would alter schedules as needed.  Moving up one run if necessary or reassigning a bus to a different route.  I remember the Jackson/Michigan supervisor reassigning a #3 & making it a #4 when there weren't any SB #4s for 30 minutes.  When we went past 13th/Michigan, there were a half dozen #4s all running in a huge bunch NB!

Those street corner supervisors are still around just not in mass like they once were. Most of the time they're at relief points and terminals these days, Some still travel to certain points along a route to sit at and monitor things but that's about it. Waiting 30-40 minutes during a weekday sounds about right coming towards the end of a pick, I've noticed an uptick in runs missing all over the system and I assume you might say that, "Well, it's like this all the time regardless of the timing of the pick." I'll acknowledge that and respond in this regard. Reassigning runs from other routes to cover the disparity in service on another route is temporary band-aid to a much bigger wound. When it's feasible it'll happen with little issue but a majority of the time reassigned runs are usually put in place at the relief point going SB from Foster or usually at an interval that makes sense to help balance service out. I remember getting pulled off the 8 last Fall on a Sunday by a supervisor sitting at the terminal to cover a large gap in service on 79th heading EB, now mind you service was even worse on the 8 that day but since 79th has priority I got placed out there for my entire first half.  

[YoungBusLover]

On 5/9/2023 at 5:27 PM, strictures said:

That makes no sense whatsoever!

So you'd think adding 4 to 5 artics on a congested street such as Devon would make service better or worse? The route isn't that long to begin with. That's like putting artics on the 77 all day eventually heavy congestion will make service come to a slow crawl and most operators already have a hard time keeping up with the street so to speak as it is right now. 

To arrthouwill's point, Devon is exactly like 79th, Kimball, North Pulaski or Even Belmont. Certain routes wouldn't be able to sustain running artics entirely unless its a mixed fleet but even with a mixed fleet 9 times out of 10, operators with 40 footers will sit behind a 60 footer until they feel like going around them which is usually after that bus gets packed to the max. 

Quote

Devon is like 79th.  Whatever benefits of having larger loads would be offset by swell times and traffic. 

 

[Busjack]

58 minutes ago, strictures said:

The other problem is they need to bring back the street corner supervisors, who would alter schedules as needed. 

That's totally ancient thinking. The control center has BusTracker, and theoretically could have that authority, But then riders would complain to the media that a bus shown on the schedule as SB at Clark and Morse never showed up.  But I'll defer to @YoungBusLoveron that.