2200-series - Updates (Retired)

[RJL6000]

Today I ride the Green Line pass by 61st Street rail yard, I've seen 2200s car # 2273-74 sitting there. Inside those cars, all the seats are gone. They have tables inside and steps both in front and on the side of the cars.

As noted on chicago-l.org, those two cars have been converted to a locker room and switchman's room for the temporary reactivation of 61st Yard as a revenue storage facility during the five-month shutdown of the Dan Ryan leg of the Red Line. Other retired 2200-series railcars may also be converted to trainmen/motormen's rooms (where motormen receive their run number assignments). That saves the CTA construction costs for facilities that are to be used for no more than a few months.

[pudgym29]

On Wednesday night, 1st May, I was astonished that a 2200-series train was still in service, long after the PM rush.

I had not noticed any other 2200s earlier that day. I deduce that as more 5000s reach the system, more 2600s are being transferred to the Blue Line.

I managed to take photographs of the car (2219-20):

I have a keen feeling I will never again ride on a 2200 (in regular service).

[BusHunter]

On Wednesday night, 1st May, I was astonished that a 2200-series train was still in service, long after the PM rush.

I had not noticed any other 2200s earlier that day. I deduce that as more 5000s reach the system, more 2600s are being transferred to the Blue Line.

I managed to take photographs of the car (2219-20):

I have a keen feeling I will never again ride on a 2200 (in regular service).

Not to worry, you still have at least until the end of next month to see #2200's on the blue line.

[qwantae]

Not to worry, you still have at least until the end of next month to see #2200's on the blue line.

Probably won't be easy to catch them after 7pm daily anymore, since that time, they separate them to 4-cars and they hardly run 2200s at Night car anymore, haven't seen any of them running Night Cars since around Thanksgiving 2012 or earlier. It's best to catch them during Mornings and Mid-Afternoon until an hour after PM Rush periods. I'm not too happy that Blue is going to have only 2600s, the Blue should get Orange Line's 3200s when Orange gets 5000s.

[BusHunter]

I'm not too happy that Blue is going to have only 2600s, the Blue should get Orange Line's 3200s when Orange gets 5000s.

Who said the blue line is not getting #3200's? If CTA plans on storing extra cars in yards and taking them out for special events, like the Wells street bridge project (#2400's at Midway yard) most likely some of the #2600's will be stored. If there keeping 300-400 #2600 cars, with car capacity on the Blue line being 340-360, they would have to have #3200's on the blue line, unless they plan on storing #3200's and their not going to do that.

[Busjack]

Who said the blue line is not getting #3200's? If CTA plans on storing extra cars in yards and taking them out for special events, like the Wells street bridge project (#2400's at Midway yard) most likely some of the #2600's will be stored. If there keeping 300-400 #2600 cars, with car capacity on the Blue line being 340-360, they would have to have #3200's on the blue line, unless they plan on storing #3200's and their not going to do that.

The only question is if Orange gets 5000s, where do the about 120 some 3200s go.

[BusHunter]

The only question is if Orange gets 5000s, where do the about 120 some 3200s go.

The Blue line, that's why I'm asking "who said there not getting #3200's?". According to Chicago-l.org the Red line is slated to get all #5000's. The Pink line has all #5000's. The Green line is going to have all #5000's except for work motor #2400 cars. The Purple, Yellow and Orange lines will be most likely getting all #5000's. So where else can the #3200's go? BTW, I wonder what's going to happen with Red line extras going to Purple line, if they are all going to be #5000's and the Purple line is not yet #5000 capable. Sounds like somewhere between now and then that's going to change. Looks to me like the Purple line is going to be next to get #5000's. (I doubt their going to want to deal with that headache for too long)

[Busjack]

The Blue line, that's why I'm asking "who said there not getting #3200's?". According to Chicago-l.org the Red line is slated to get all #5000's. The Pink line has all #5000's. The Green line is going to have all #5000's except for work motor #2400 cars. The Purple, Yellow and Orange lines will be most likely getting all #5000's....

My math indicates that if they are getting 714 5000s and that leaves 400 2600s and 256 3200s to be replaced by 7000s, that results in 1370 cars, compared to starting with 1190 and the latest report being 1280. So, even if the extra 90 cars are being used now, that's still another 90 cars to account for by 2015.

[BusHunter]

My math indicates that if they are getting 714 5000s and that leaves 400 2600s and 256 3200s to be replaced by 7000s, that results in 1370 cars, compared to starting with 1190 and the latest report being 1280. So, even if the extra 90 cars are being used now, that's still another 90 cars to account for by 2015.

Well if you look at what they had when they started, 142 #2200's, 194 #2400's, around 590 #2600's, 254 #3200's, that comes out to 1290 cars needed for service. If you subtract the 714 #5000's, 254 #3200's that leaves 322 #2600 cars left. Now if they keep 400 cars, that's 80 cars to be stored. The only way the Blue line most likely would get all #2600's is when the 130th Red line extension opens, but with no construction close to starting on that that's at least 4-6 years away. By then the #7000's should be here but with CTA you never know.

[Busjack]

Well if you look at what they had when they started, 142 #2200's, 194 #2400's, around 590 #2600's, 254 #3200's, that comes out to 1290 cars...

Bad math. Your numbers come out to 1180, according to Windows Calculator.

[BusHunter]

Bad math. Your numbers come out to 1180, according to Windows Calculator.

That's what I get for doing the figures by hand. Even so, that backs up what I'm saying even more. With 110 less cars (322 minus 110) that leaves 212 #2600's needed for service. The rest would have to be stored. (I don't think they can store over 90 cars, so I'm going with 300 #2600's left) The Blue line again needs 340 for service. (120 #3200's plus around 220 #2600's) Like I say unless they want to store #3200's!! Like I was saying before, I think what's going to happen is when the 130th extension opens they would then pull the Purple line #5000's and blue line would then probably lose #3200's, but most likely that's not going to happen. (I don't see a 130th extension opening before close to 2020 at least.)

[mkohut]

That's what I get for doing the figures by hand. Even so, that backs up what I'm saying even more. With 110 less cars (322 minus 110) that leaves 212 #2600's needed for service. The rest would have to be stored. (I don't think they can store over 90 cars, so I'm going with 300 #2600's left) The Blue line again needs 340 for service. (120 #3200's plus around 220 #2600's) Like I say unless they want to store #3200's!! Like I was saying before, I think what's going to happen is when the 130th extension opens they would then pull the Purple line #5000's and blue line would then probably lose #3200's, but most likely that's not going to happen. (I don't see a 130th extension opening before close to 2020 at least.)

Without knowing the size of the rail yard at 130 and how many railcars it can hold its hard to say. Also,can they make the Howard yard bigger.?

[Busjack]

Without knowing the size of the rail yard at 130 and how many railcars it can hold its hard to say. Also,can they make the Howard yard bigger.?

There was a statement that land was reserved somewhere between 115th and 130th for a yard, but, again, that depends on expansion first.

[BusHunter]

Somewhere, I believe in the CTA project documents they stated they would need somewhere in the neighborhood of 75-90 extra cars for the 130th extension. I can't seem to find the link right now. (I might have posted something similar on here before)

[Busjack]

Somewhere, I believe in the CTA project documents they stated they would need somewhere in the neighborhood of 75-90 extra cars for the 130th extension. I can't seem to find the link right now. (I might have posted something similar on here before)

Up to now the commonly accepted number was 84 but...

The Locally Preferred Alternatives Report of August 2009 says 78, including 14 spares. To get to mk's point, it also says that "A new Red Line yard and shop facility with a 276-car capacity, would be located on a combination of industrial/vacant land to the east of the CN/MED tracks and west of the IHB and NICTD tracks at approximately 120th and Cottage Grove." To get to a topic we discussed a long way back, it also includes new bus terminals (page 68 and now out of date with the reconfiguration of 353).

[jajuan]

Up to now the commonly accepted number was 84 but...

The Locally Preferred Alternatives Report of August 2009 says 78, including 14 spares. To get to mk's point, it also says that "A new Red Line yard and shop facility with a 276-car capacity, would be located on a combination of industrial/vacant land to the east of the CN/MED tracks and west of the IHB and NICTD tracks at approximately 120th and Cottage Grove." To get to a topic we discussed a long way back, it also includes new bus terminals (page 68 and now out of date with the reconfiguration of 353).

A couple other things of note is recommending combining 103 and 106 with the new route serving the Red Line at 103rd instead of 95th; absorbing 112 into what was the 111 before the December restructuring with that route serving 111th station instead of going to 95th in addition to operating only on 111th between Pulaski and Corliss; creation of a 115 that would have been a bidirectional loop via 95th, Vincennes, 115th and Cottage Grove (obsolete there also in a sense with a 115 created under the decrowd plan); elimination of the 108; moving the south end of the 30 to the 130th station; terminate peak 9 Ashland south end at 103rd station instead of 104th/Vincennes; make south end of the 34 terminate at 130th Station; south end of 348 terminate at 130th Station (obsolete now that that route now ends in Blue Island); terminating 352 at 111th Station; and cutting 119 and 359 back to the 115th Station. Odd that they had no recommendation of combining 95E and 95W given 95W wasn't yet coordinated with 381 at the time of the recommendations.

[mkohut]

A couple other things of note is recommending combining 103 and 106 with the new route serving the Red Line at 103rd instead of 95th; absorbing 112 into what was the 111 before the December restructuring with that route serving 111th station instead of going to 95th in addition to operating only on 111th between Pulaski and Corliss; creation of a 115 that would have been a bidirectional loop via 95th, Vincennes, 115th and Cottage Grove (obsolete there also in a sense with a 115 created under the decrowd plan); elimination of the 108; moving the south end of the 30 to the 130th station; terminate peak 9 Ashland south end at 103rd station instead of 104th/Vincennes; make south end of the 34 terminate at 130th Station; south end of 348 terminate at 130th Station (obsolete now that that route now ends in Blue Island); terminating 352 at 111th Station; and cutting 119 and 359 back to the 115th Station. Odd that they had no recommendation of combining 95E and 95W given 95W wasn't yet coordinated with 381 at the time of the recommendations.

I don't think its going to happen soon.Unless Emanuel buddys from Hollywood pay to build the extension.

[jajuan]

I don't think its going to happen soon.Unless Emanuel buddys from Hollywood pay to build the extension.

We already know it's not going to happen soon. But it's still worth noting what bus service in that area could look like if the money was found to do the extension. As Busjack and I noted and alluded to, they would have to do some tweaking of those recommendations given Pace and CTA service has changed down in that area with the decrowd plan and also in part from recent Pace restructurings since the time of this proposals.

[2200SeriesFan]

Seeing that pic above that chicagopcclcar posted, it almost makes me want to do another ride to Cottage Grove again. Something I haven't done for so many years, except when I was trying to ride to the end of each line many years ago(albeit not ride all lines within one day, lol) just to say I'd done so at least once. Is it only those 2 2200s that are being stored at 61st?

Sad if indeed, the final 2200s will be retired at the end of May(wonder if there's any validity to that report). I'd really like it if they did a final 2200 series run event for them, like the CTA did with the 6000s when they were retired from what's now the Brown Line in the early 1990s. BTW when I rode the Blue Line during early evening in late April, I have to say I was surprised at the number of 2200s still operating on it, with all the new Red Line 5000s(now up to something around 5240) I've seen enter service.

Finally, I believe another poster who posted slightly above is correct that they haven't run for evening 4 car service, as late 2012 was the last time I saw any 2200s leading or trailing a 4 car Blue train. At least I started to do a lot of 2200 series pics over the last few years, in preparation for this new reality.

[sw4400]

As to a "final trip", I have spoken personally with all levels at the CTA and there seems little initiative to do this. I know some railfans might think differently, but among operating personnel there is not that much love for the 2200s, Budd Company, or even the "blinker doors."

I'm not sure about the lack of love for 2200's in general or the "Blinker Doors", but as far as the Budd Company, I think that stems back to Winter 1999, when over half of the 2600-Series railcars shorted out when snow got into their motors. That might be why operating personnel don't like Budd Company railcars.

[Busjack]

I'm not sure about the lack of love for 2200's in general or the "Blinker Doors", but as far as the Budd Company, I think that stems back to Winter 1999, when over half of the 2600-Series railcars shorted out when snow got into their motors. That might be why operating personnel don't like Budd Company railcars.

On the 2200s, anything like that would have been the storm of 79, except reports are that it messed up the 2000s worse.

However, if the whole fleet is going to go in the next 7 to 9 years, the idea of nostalgia trips will be overdone, and IRM has had several of them.

[BusHunter]

Seeing that pic above that chicagopcclcar posted, it almost makes me want to do another ride to Cottage Grove again. Something I haven't done for so many years, except when I was trying to ride to the end of each line many years ago(albeit not ride all lines within one day, lol) just to say I'd done so at least once. Is it only those 2 2200s that are being stored at 61st?

Sad if indeed, the final 2200s will be retired at the end of May(wonder if there's any validity to that report). I'd really like it if they did a final 2200 series run event for them, like the CTA did with the 6000s when they were retired from what's now the Brown Line in the early 1990s. BTW when I rode the Blue Line during early evening in late April, I have to say I was surprised at the number of 2200s still operating on it, with all the new Red Line 5000s(now up to something around 5240) I've seen enter service.

Finally, I believe another poster who posted slightly above is correct that they haven't run for evening 4 car service, as late 2012 was the last time I saw any 2200s leading or trailing a 4 car Blue train. At least I started to do a lot of 2200 series pics over the last few years, in preparation for this new reality.

IRM's going to be running a charter on June 2, 2013. http://irm.org/events/ctacharter.html I was told the #2200's might retire at the end of June. But like the linked article says it will be this summer.

[jtrosario]

Here's the link to the map featuring the 2200 brought up by chicagopcclcar:

http://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/maps/CTA_Bus_&_Rail_Map_May_2013_RLS_USEN.pdf

[IronMaidenfan]

I looked at the picture on the cover of the map, and for a moment I started to tear up a bit. Man I'm going to miss them when they leave us. But lets see what CTA will do to the 2200s on their last run.

[BusHunter]

Now they have four tracks of #2200's in Rosemont yard. Practically the whole NW corner of the yard is #2200's. There's at least 24 cars between the four tracks. Looks like service is starting to wind down for the #2200's. Now that it's getting warm out, their starting to have problems with hot cars. (#2223-24 being one of them, hopper windows opened on #2223) I think their going to avoid this problem however with the retirement of the cars. I was surprised however #2209-10 has nice AC. I was wondering why in the last year they have stripped off the ventilation covers on alot of #2200's and #2600's. I guess all that gunk from decades past was clogging up the airways.