February System Pick

[artthouwill]

Based on the info so far, it looks like K is going to need additional buses for its already overcrowded garage. As stated they will split the 8 and 82 with other garages, but the sum of those buses won't add up to the buses needed for 21, 50, 60, and 62

[rideonrulez]

Speculation or confirmed?

It certainly isn't speculation...

Looks like alot of sharing between garages. that could have a benefit if there looking to cut manpower. with a north and south garage for each they can quickly get those rush hour service buses off the street after the rush as opposed to a long pull in from an opposing terminal. so far the #54b and #62 seem the longest unless you pull the #62 in from downtown or kedzie.

There is ALOT of shared routes. So much I wouldn't even want to bother typing it all up for you guys.

Based on the info so far, it looks like K is going to need additional buses for its already overcrowded garage. As stated they will split the 8 and 82 with other garages, but the sum of those buses won't add up to the buses needed for 21, 50, 60, and 62

Not really, Kedzie is losing some of the 134,143,145 & 148 not to mention a few trippers on other Kedzie mainstays....

Trust me, this pick will bring you strange sightings....

[rideonrulez]

Now all we need is to add Flxibles to the mix to make this more interesting. The CTA without high floor buses would definitely lose my interest, and then sometime after that Pace too. I'm going to have to get a new hobby, and stamp collecting wouldn't be it.

It won't be mine either, I just had to think up of something boring to show how boring our hobby will be comes doomsday....

[jajuan]

It certainly isn't speculation...

There is ALOT of shared routes. So much I wouldn't even want to bother typing it all up for you guys.

Not really, Kedzie is losing some of the 134,143,145 & 148 not to mention a few trippers on other Kedzie mainstays....

Trust me, this pick will bring you strange sightings....

You say some. So by that does it mean those are going to be shared routes with NP?

[dre_cta6221]

now this is strange Nova 6587 was on 112 vincennes today

[BusHunter]

Based on the info so far, it looks like K is going to need additional buses for its already overcrowded garage. As stated they will split the 8 and 82 with other garages, but the sum of those buses won't add up to the buses needed for 21, 50, 60, and 62

Yeah no kidding i did a check on what was on the street this morning. 18 #62's,14 #50's,12 #21's, 15 #60's, 22 #82's (maybe half that if sharing) that adds up to about 70 buses and were not counting any spares. With some of the LSD service going away from Kedzie to NP that will add to NP's capacity problems for sure. Kedzie looks to be in the same boat.

[jajuan]

Yeah no kidding i did a check on what was on the street this morning. 18 #62's,14 #50's,12 #21's, 15 #60's, 22 #82's (maybe half that if sharing) that adds up to about 70 buses and were not counting any spares. With some of the LSD service going away from Kedzie to NP that will add to NP's capacity problems for sure. Kedzie looks to be in the same boat.

I was thinking the same thing on this. Even before getting the reports that a fair number of routes will be shared, I kept coming to the thought that Kedzie and NP are really going to get a brunt of the work that's left after the cuts go through.

[Busjack]

Yeah no kidding i did a check on what was on the street this morning. 18 #62's,14 #50's,12 #21's, 15 #60's, 22 #82's (maybe half that if sharing) that adds up to about 70 buses and were not counting any spares. With some of the LSD service going away from Kedzie to NP that will add to NP's capacity problems for sure. Kedzie looks to be in the same boat.

Of course, the fallacy here is that those routes will have as many buses on them on February 10 as they do now. As I previously mentioned, getting rid of the X routes only accounts for about 1/3 of the 280 or so buses Rodriguez says will be off the street.

[qwantae]

Does Cicero south of 24th St. need that much frequency? Would 24th be a regular terminus for southbound buses outside of weekday rush hours: i.e.; every second bus would run to Ford City?

It makes much better sence, it if they can go that route. Extended couple late night hours on 54B wouldn't be a bad idea.

[Busjack]

It makes much better sence, it if they can go that route. Extended couple late night hours on 54B wouldn't be a bad idea.

One thing that is clear from Rodriguez's presentation is that while Owl will be preserved, otherwise night hours won't be extended.

[qwantae]

now this is strange Nova 6587 was on 112 vincennes today

I've rode a Nova #6599 on X28 from Downtown to 67th, this past Thursday PM rush.

[artthouwill]

Of course, the fallacy here is that those routes will have as many buses on them on February 10 as they do now. As I previously mentioned, getting rid of the X routes only accounts for about 1/3 of the 280 or so buses Rodriguez says will be off the street.

Generally the less frequent service would apply to off peak service. Posted on the buses and trains was a notice concerning the cuts effective FEb 7th. It specifically indicated that local routes whose express counterparts were being cut would only see a reduction in service during the hours that those expresses would not be operating.

[Busjack]

Generally the less frequent service would apply to off peak service. Posted on the buses and trains was a notice concerning the cuts effective FEb 7th. It specifically indicated that local routes whose express counterparts were being cut would only see a reduction in service during the hours that those expresses would not be operating.

This is horribly unclear.

Take something like X55. It now runs roughly 6 to 9 am and 1:30 to 6:00 p.m.

Of course, a bit earlier, they took resources out of 55 to put in X55. Apparently the same with 9, 49, and 80.

Now, does that mean that 55 gets cut midday? Does that also mean that the rush 55 is going to be down to the current once every 15 minutes, and the resources taken out of 55 9 months ago aren't being put back? Similarly, is 49 going to be down to every 10 to 15 minutes, because that is what it now is when the X49 is running?

Of course, that says nothing about what, say, 8 is going to be after the cuts.

As I said before, if 280 buses are going to be taken out of the system, that's 3 times more than just what would be removed by canceling the Xs. Also, the way the system now works, the only way to take buses out of the system is rush hour, since that is the only time when the garages and yards are nearly emptied. Cutting midday service may cut the labor cost, but it doesn't free up 280 buses to be junked.

[renardo870]

So on the south side, if 77th is getting 35, 39, 43, 170, 171 and 172, is the 6 and 71 moving to 103rd? What abt the 3 and 4 being shared @ 103rd? the 8 and 67 could be shared @ 77th and the 49A should shift to 74th. Kedzie should let 77th run the #10 part time like it was before 3-23-08. The 44 sould go to 77th. On the north end, I guess FG and C could help with NP routes like the did during the 3 track project a few years back. It's going to be kinda hectic with deadhead trips on some routes. and the #50 isnt being shared with NP? In a few years, the Archer replacement will be built. But will we have any drivers left?

[BusHunter]

This is horribly unclear.

Take something like X55. It now runs roughly 6 to 9 am and 1:30 to 6:00 p.m.

Of course, a bit earlier, they took resources out of 55 to put in X55. Apparently the same with 9, 49, and 80.

Now, does that mean that 55 gets cut midday? Does that also mean that the rush 55 is going to be down to the current once every 15 minutes, and the resources taken out of 55 9 months ago aren't being put back? Similarly, is 49 going to be down to every 1o to 15 minutes, because that is what it now is when the X49 is running?

Of course, that says nothing about what, say, 8 is going to be after the cuts.

As I said before, if 280 buses are going to be taken out of the system, that's 3 times more than just what would be removed by canceling the Xs. Also, the way the system now works, the only way to take buses out of the system is rush hour, since that is the only time when the garages and yards are nearly emptied. Cutting midday service may cut the labor cost, but it doesn't free up 280 buses to be junked.

Probably the #80, #55 and #49 will go to a more frequent schedule than now. (1 for every 4 x buses in the rush.)But I wouldn't expect service levels to go back to what they were before the x routes frequency increases. Everything is being cut back to 20 - 30 minutes frequency, in the off peak. (middays, nights and weekends) The question for me is are they cutting the rush frequency? It sounds like they are but not as harsh as in the off peak. Why would they post signs that routes like the #134 would have less frequent service when it only runs in the rush?

[Busjack]

So on the south side, if 77th is getting 35, 39, 43, 170, 171 and 172, is the 6 and 71 moving to 103rd? What abt the 3 and 4 being shared @ 103rd? the 8 and 67 could be shared @ 77th and the 49A should shift to 74th. Kedzie should let 77th run the #10 part time like it was before 3-23-08. The 44 sould go to 77th. On the north end, I guess FG and C could help with NP routes like the did during the 3 track project a few years back. It's going to be kinda hectic with deadhead trips on some routes. and the #50 isnt being shared with NP? In a few years, the Archer replacement will be built. But will we have any drivers left?

Pretty much none of this makes any sense, so I suppose it is possible with CTA Management. However, I wouldn't bet on it.

1. 77th is going to be losing X3 and X4. That takes care of any problem with taking the Archer routes you listed--only 35 has any traffic.

X3--13 buses

X4--7 buses*

2. There is no way to get relief from 103rd to 3 and 4 [well, maybe to 3 as it lays over at 98th and State]. Also, 103rd isn't losing any routes, so any "sharing" it would do would only be if the frequency on its current routes is significantly cut. Besides the political ramifications of that, the only route where sharing could conceivably make sense is 6--but only if the "shared ones" are pullouts or pullins, and the relief would probably have to be at Marquette and Jeffery. The only justification for moving 29 was that it could be relieved at 95-Red Line.

3. Since 74th is losing X9, X55, and 53AL, there is certainly no point in moving routes out of there, while there certainly is a reason to give them part of 8.

4. The one thing you have right is that FG probably will take over some of NP's work.

5. What makes you think they will build a new Archer? Maybe in a very long term, but unless someone has a secret pot of money (and WGN says the state is already $5 billion in the hole) the RTA will be a long time paying off the borrowing to prevent the fare hike, even if the economy rebounds. Hence, no resources to reinstate service, unless somehow those suing everyone get the judge to create them.

________________

*Not to mention another issue what happens to the frequency of the local route, which, since these return as locals, does that mean the deadhead local will be cut? Probably so, despite what art tried to imply? Since one can't sort out those returning buses on the public version of Bus Tracker, probably more than the 20 I indicated going northbound will be cut.

[qwantae]

This is horribly unclear.

Take something like X55. It now runs roughly 6 to 9 am and 1:30 to 6:00 p.m.

Of course, a bit earlier, they took resources out of 55 to put in X55. Apparently the same with 9, 49, and 80.

Now, does that mean that 55 gets cut midday? Does that also mean that the rush 55 is going to be down to the current once every 15 minutes, and the resources taken out of 55 9 months ago aren't being put back? Similarly, is 49 going to be down to every 1o to 15 minutes, because that is what it now is when the X49 is running?

They should bring back 174- Midway/Garfield back for Hyde Park riders to help with crowded 55, but that won't happen, will it? 55 Local is already bad as it is now during Afternoon rush while X55 is operating.

[Busjack]

They should bring back 174- Midway/Garfield back for Hyde Park riders to help with crowded 55, but that won't happen, will it? 55 Local is already bad as it is now during Afternoon rush while X55 is operating.

It seems like you have a hard time comprehending the concept of service cuts. Especially for a route that the private benefactor said it would no longer fund.

[Busjack]

Probably the #80, #55 and #49 will go to a more frequent schedule than now. (1 for every 4 x buses in the rush.)But I wouldn't expect service levels to go back to what they were before the x routes frequency increases. Everything is being cut back to 20 - 30 minutes frequency, in the off peak. (middays, nights and weekends) The question for me is are they cutting the rush frequency? It sounds like they are but not as harsh as in the off peak. Why would they post signs that routes like the #134 would have less frequent service when it only runs in the rush?

I think you got the point.:D

[artthouwill]

How will this pick play out seniority wise or how has it played out in the past with garage closings? Will Archer drivers with high seniority bump seniority of senior drivers at other garages? Let's say the #3 senior driver at Archer has more seniority than the #1 driver at 77th and he decideds to go there. Would he become the 1st to pick the new runs at 77th? Would he fall to the bottom of the 77th pick as far as runs, but keep his vacation seniority? Or does each driver based on system wide seniority get to pick any run at any garage?

[cta_44499_FG]

How will this pick play out seniority wise or how has it played out in the past with garage closings? Will Archer drivers with high seniority bump seniority of senior drivers at other garages? Let's say the #3 senior driver at Archer has more seniority than the #1 driver at 77th and he decideds to go there. Would he become the 1st to pick the new runs at 77th? Would he fall to the bottom of the 77th pick as far as runs, but keep his vacation seniority? Or does each driver based on system wide seniority get to pick any run at any garage?

Seniority is system wide. How do you think system picks work out?

So....your assumptions are correct....if the 3rd Archer driver has more seniority than the top 77th guy/girl....they become the new kid on the block if they go over there.

[cta_44499_FG]

They should bring back 174- Midway/Garfield back for Hyde Park riders to help with crowded 55, but that won't happen, will it? 55 Local is already bad as it is now during Afternoon rush while X55 is operating.

174 is subsidized, as is the X98 (hence why it wasn't cut)....so long as the company wanting it pays...it stays.

[Busjack]

174 is subsidized...

Except that it is no longer, hence why it was cut at the request of the sponsor (U of C) after a hearing.

[BusHunter]

I think you got the point.

According to what I read on the budget the service frequency will decrease even in the rush period. To quote them 'we will try and impact the least amount of customers". Based on that any frequency cuts in the rush would be not as extreme but sounds like there will be cuts. According to the budget, they will run 18 percent less bus service and I believe 9 percent less rail service overall. (in total) As far as the signs stating that all local routes running with x routes (like #80) will not be cut in the rush, they are saying the service frequency cuts will be in the off peak only on those routes. The rush service will most likely be increased to a frequency level that parallels the surrounding service levels after the cuts.

[Guest]

Yesterday I went to the uniform store at Jeff Pk. to get some Pace uniforms and badges made. In the store I ran into one of my buddies from FG, he tells me of the changes happening next month. He told me that its possible with all the route shuffling due to Archer's closing that FG may get the #76 Diversey back. In addition he also tells me #74 Fullerton may also be transferred to FG.