Pace responds to CTA's "Crowd Reduction Plan"

[jesi2282]

According to WBBM, Pace is planning to tweak some of its routes in an effort to help CTA riders effected by their "Crowd Reduction Plan". The most obvious of the changes are going to be the elmination of "Posted Stop Service" on #270, #331, #349 and #423, and we already know #317 is picking up rush hour service.

But the more interesting one is the reroute of the #353, which will operate via 95th, Stony Island, Bishop Ford Freeway, 130th; completing skipping CTA overlap on King Drive. Which gives us an answer on the overlap debate.

Another interesting one: Pace wants to help #64 riders, which will mean a reroute of the #209, I'm guessing it would be using #64's routing to Canfield/Higgins and then back to #209 routing north of Higgins.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/10/10/pace-to-replace-some-discontinued-cta-bus-lines/

[BusHunter]

According to WBBM, Pace is planning to tweak some of its routes in an effort to help CTA riders effected by their "Crowd Reduction Plan". The most obvious of the changes are going to be the elmination of "Posted Stop Service" on #270, #331, #349 and #423, and we already know #317 is picking up rush hour service.

But the more interesting one is the reroute of the #353, which will operate via 95th, Stony Island, Bishop Ford Freeway, 130th; completing skipping CTA overlap on King Drive. Which gives us an answer on the overlap debate.

Another interesting one: Pace wants to help #64 riders, which will mean a reroute of the #209, I'm guessing it would be using #64's routing to Canfield/Higgins and then back to #209 routing north of Higgins.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/10/10/pace-to-replace-some-discontinued-cta-bus-lines/

This should be interesting. Routing to the #64 takes customers away from the Harlem Blue line, delaying them by 10 minutes, not that the #209 has many customers these days. I guess they believe this will up the #209 ridership, but there is no need for it on the weekends. They may have to add buses to the #270 and #331 and this might axe eldorados on the #423 on the weekdays. Probably the end result is the inner city CTA cuts, like the #11 and #145 will hurt the most, as Pace will not rescue them, but some of those cuts I believe may come back.

[Busjack]

According to WBBM, Pace is planning to tweak some of its routes in an effort to help CTA riders effected by their "Crowd Reduction Plan". The most obvious of the changes are going to be the elmination of "Posted Stop Service" on #270, #331, #349 and #423, and we already know #317 is picking up rush hour service.

But the more interesting one is the reroute of the #353, which will operate via 95th, Stony Island, Bishop Ford Freeway, 130th; completing skipping CTA overlap on King Drive. Which gives us an answer on the overlap debate.

Another interesting one: Pace wants to help #64 riders, which will mean a reroute of the #209, I'm guessing it would be using #64's routing to Canfield/Higgins and then back to #209 routing north of Higgins.

http://chicago.cbslo...-cta-bus-lines/

The article, while helpful, is very sketchy. While News Radio 780 says it was announced with the Budget, Pace (at this moment) doesn't have a press release for that.

For instance, while it says Pace will help 56A riders, it also has references to "slight reroutes" and "only reroute would be 353." Hence, it is not clear to me if and how 209 would be rerouted.

Similarly, while it seems clear to me that 353 will be rerouted via the Bishop Ford Freeway, that might mean that my point that the 353 Riverdale trips will be eliminated, but that's not sure. That would result in Pace having a turnaround at 136th that it doesn't need, and probably the need for another connection with 348.* The resulting route would be similar to the old "Thornton via 142nd" South Suburban Safeway route, when it was separate from the "Roseland-Altgeld" although, of course, not to downtown.

Hence, I

• thank you for the link.
• guess Pace and CTA conferred more than earlier indicated.
• have to wait to see what is announced.

_________

*Update: Rereading the article, I see that it says Bishop Ford and 130th, so the loop at 136th would still be valid. I don't see how that saves Pace any running time though, since going back and forth to the Bishop Ford (4 miles added to the trip) and the expressway being congested have to be problems, although there probably isn't much traffic on that portion of 130th.

[mkohut]

Its possible 209 can go Canfield to Foster.Then Foster to Harlem.Then Harlem to Harlem Blue Line.

[Busjack]

Its possible 209 can go Canfield to Foster.Then Foster to Harlem.Then Harlem to Harlem Blue Line.

I modified my post after rereading it.

You are concurring with jesi's point that 209 will take care of 64, which probably isn't much of a here nor there.

The bigger question is whether anything will substitute for 56A on Devon between Harlem and Milwaukee. Maybe nobody rides it.

[mkohut]

I don't see why anybody should you have 68,88,and 423 right by there.

[Busjack]

I don't see why anybody should why you have 68,88,and 423 right by there.

Appears correct. As pointed out numerous times here, it isn't for E-W travel, but some way to get to Jefferson Park.

The only quibble I have is that 56A is east of Harlem, while the routes you cite are at Harlem (in the vicinity of Devon).

[MetroShadow]

I don't see why anybody should you have 68,88,and 423 right by there.

If anything, I thought perhaps extending the 88 to Touhy (on the weekends) could be helpful; but if people need a bus, they can either go to NW Highway, Touhy, or Avondale to get a bus.

That 353 reroute could benefit people coming from the South, especially if the Red Line reconstruction poses a problem.

[mkohut]

If anything, I thought perhaps extending the 88 to Touhy (on the weekends) could be helpful; but if people need a bus, they can either go to NW Highway, Touhy, or Avondale to get a bus.

That 353 reroute could benefit people coming from the South, especially if the Red Line reconstruction poses a problem.

How would you get 88 to Touhy

Ridership is low for both 68 and 88 on weekends,

Even Pace cancel Sunday service on 209

[Busjack]

How would you get 88 to Touhy

Ridership is low for both 68 and 88 on weekends,

Even Pace cancel Sunday service on 209

Anyway, 68 goes to Touhy (Park Ridge Metra).

In that 209 goes from Park Ridge via Canfield, there would be no point duplicating it with 88.

[Busjack]

...

That 353 reroute could benefit people coming from the South, especially if the Red Line reconstruction poses a problem.

Only if Pace is correct in its assertion that via the Bishop Ford will save time.

I would argue that going non stop via Indiana and Michigan from 130th would be quicker, but that's open to debate. That was once proposed for 355, but the riders there just said to route it to the South Shore.

In any event, they are still going to be stuck without a train at 95th, and have to board a CTA shuttle.

[CURRENTZ_09]

As regards to the Red Line Shuttles, we'll just have to wait until the Spring to see how they are going to operate with Dan Ryan Traffic. Wish CTA would give an assessment on how these Shuttles are going to operate. We are Six months away and we only have a tenative outline of how they would operate.

[sw4400]

I would hope for a restoration of the #11 between Fullerton and Western, but all has been mum thus far...

[CURRENTZ_09]

I would hope for a restoration of the #11 between Fullerton and Western, but all has been mum thus far...

I can agree, the 11 seems to be a power player on the northside, looks like it supplements the Brown Line, not hurt it

[mkohut]

I would hope for a restoration of the #11 between Fullerton and Western, but all has been mum thus far...

Each Alderman is given 1.2 million to use for there Ward.Why not ask the Alderman to use that money for it.

[Busjack]

Each Alderman is given 1.2 million to use for there Ward.Why not ask the Alderman to use that money for it.

1. How did this become the non-Pace topic all the sudden?

2. That's supposedly for capital improvements in the ward (a usual allocation), not to subsidize the CTA.

[mkohut]

I'm trying to give him a idea to save the route.

At the end of the day its the Alderman to give the people what they want.

[Mr.cta85]

What Im still wondering is if the 353 is rerouted via 95 to stony island onto Bishop Ford to 130th then what route would replace the King Drive stretch from 95th to 111th?? Would it be cta #3 or is that where the new 111th king drive kicks in??

[Busjack]

What Im still wondering is if the 353 is rerouted via 95 to stony island onto Bishop Ford to 130th then what route would replace the King Drive stretch from 95th to 111th?? Would it be cta #3 or is that where the new 111th king drive kicks in??

No. As thoroughly documented in the CTA Topic (at least this is related to Pace)*, the 111 111th-King Dr. CTA bus (proposed split from 115th-Pullman) would cover the route between 111th and 95th. When that announcement was made, it was then speculated that Pace would drop the route segment, confirmed today.

If you are concerned about south of 111th, the 115-Pullman bus on Cottage Grove is less than a block away.

_________

*I see that my post a bit later on Pace not rerouting it on the Bishop Ford turned out wrong. At least I admit it.

[Mr.cta85]

No. As thoroughly documented in the CTA Topic (at least this is related to Pace), the 111 111th-King Dr. CTA bus (proposed split from 115th-Pullman) would cover the route between 111th and 95th. When that announcement was made, it was then speculated that Pace would drop the route segment, confirmed today.

If you are concerned about south of 111th, the 115-Pullman bus on Cottage Grove is less than a block away

Oh ok that's pretty cool then I like the new 111th route already lol and I wasn't concerned just wondering that's all but thanks for clarifying that for me.

[MetroShadow]

Going on topic, 353 could be routed through Torrence and/or Doty to 103rd if the Ford gets backed up.*

_____

* And that's if the Bridge over 127th still isn't done yet. I got backtracked when I was heading to Burnham a couple of weeks ago due to said bridge.

[Busjack]

Going on topic, 353 could be routed through Torrence and/or Doty to 103rd if the Ford gets backed up.*

I rode a 355 that did that once, i.e. Hegewisch, Torrence, 103, and back on the Dan Ryan. However, IIRC, the reason was that a train was blocking 130th.

However, I can't see doing that if the most direct path for 353 is as I indicted--nonstop via Michigan and Indiana

Driving, one time I thought that using Doty (in the sense of the service road) might have been quicker, but the first time I could bail out was at 130th, and then ending up using the same route that 353 does.

[MetroShadow]

Driving, one time I thought that using Doty (in the sense of the service road) might have been quicker, but the first time I could bail out was at 130th, and then ending up using the same route that 353 does.

I went Torrence, 126, Doty, 103, and the Bishop Ford. That's 10 minutes I'm not getting back. Stupid bridge (that is ironically replacing the blocked trains).

[Busjack]

I did. On the Passenger Notice Page for the 353 is the following:...

Nowhere on this page nor the Pace & CTA Coordination Plan link on the Pace homepage says anything about 353 being roerouted VIA 95th, Stony/Bishop Ford and 130th...

The notice must must have changed, because it now says:

• Route 353 would be rerouted to operate express between 130th/ Indiana and the CTA Red Line 95th/Dan Ryan Station (via 130th Street - I-94/Bishop Ford Expressway - Stony Island Avenue - 95th Street).
• Route 353 would no longer operate on Michigan Avenue, 111th Street or King Drive within the City of Chicago.
• Courtesy stops would be made at 130th/Indiana, 95th/King Dr. and at the CTA Red Line 95th/Dan Ryan Station so that Route 353 customers could transfer to CTA Routes 111 and 34 which provide alternative service on the portions of Route 353 that would be modified within the City of Chicago.
• The span and frequency of service within the City of Chicago would be reduced.
• There would be no change to the span or frequency of service for customers traveling to River Oaks Center or to the Homewood Park-n-Ride.

The implication I get is that the 136-Indiana runs will be cut.

[jtrosario]

The Jeffery Jump terminal (103rd St. and Stony Island Garage terminal) sure looks close enough to the new Pace 353 Route that a stop could be placed there for 353, say for about 5 months starting in Spring of 2013. Might even take slight pressure off the 95th/Dan Ryan terminal's bus-to-bus transfers during that period.