Ventra - Bugs, Feedback, and Questions

[BusHunter]

The Ventra Card has two separate subaccounts: A Transit Account and a Debit Account. Money in the Transit Account cannot be spent with the debit card and cannot be transferred to the Debit Account.

If your employer somehow allowed you to fund the Debit Account, then yes you could take advantage. But if your employer is not monitoring what you do with the prepaid Mastercard, why bother with the Ventra Card? Just take your employer's prepaid Mastercard to Jewel or Nordstrom or wherever and have yourself a shopping spree.

Yeah just like the guys on EBay do!! Shortages do happen, even with passes, when CTA announced they raised fares and passes got more expensive people were out buying 2,3 or 4 passes. Well you get enough people doing that and you get a shortage.

[Railwaymodeler]

Yesterday I witnessed a couple teenagers go bats on a North Division driver. Apparently the two got on the bus, one Ventra card worked, the other did not. The driver had the kid whose card did not work pay cash fare, as he explained to me later when I asked, the garage management told him to enforce the cash fare rule. This resulted in the kid who had the defective card, becoming loud and borderline violent, threatening to "whoop" the driver's a**. The guy she was with held her back and settled her down at least, but not without threatening to have the driver fired.

This whole thing is already a fiasco if you ask me.

[Kevin]

I also just received my Ventra Card. I am a CCP user with a 30-day pass. My balance and pass did not transfer yet.

Mine eventually transferred 12 hours after activating.

I can't think of a good reason for anyone to use a personal card to use ventra, except possibly tourists.

One less card to carry. I try to have the extreme opposite of Costanza's wallet.

The charges posted to my contactless bankcard using PAYG are a bit confusing, however.

On Wednesday morning, I used my own card for a rail trip and then later a bus trip. In the evening, I used it for another rail trip. If my calculations are correct, that's a total of $6.50. But this is what got posted for that day:

9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $5.00
9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $1.75

That adds up to $6.75, a quarter more than what fares should have been. My only hypothesis is that I was charged $2.25 instead of $2 for the bus trip. Unless I missed something in the 7,000+ word Terms and Conditions, PAYG should still charge only $2 for bus trips.

[Busjack]

Mine eventually transferred 12 hours after activating.

One less card to carry. I try to have the extreme opposite of Costanza's wallet.

The charges posted to my contactless bankcard using PAYG are a bit confusing, however.

On Wednesday morning, I used my own card for a rail trip and then later a bus trip. In the evening, I used it for another rail trip. If my calculations are correct, that's a total of $6.50. But this is what got posted for that day:

9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $5.00
9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $1.75

That adds up to $6.75, a quarter more than what fares should have been. My only hypothesis is that I was charged $2.25 instead of $2 for the bus trip. Unless I missed something in the 7,000+ word Terms and Conditions, PAYG should still charge only $2 for bus trips.

Ask trigger about that, but a cash bus trip is $2.25, not $2.00 (Top of the CTA fare chart). It is $2.00 only with a fare card.

Remember what I said earlier about deception and complaining when you get your bank statement?

[Kevin]

Ask trigger about that, but a cash bus trip is $2.25, not $2.00 (Top of the CTA fare chart). It is $2.00 only with a fare card.

Remember what I said earlier about deception and complaining when you get your bank statement?

That will certainly need to get clarified. I didn't pay with a fare card, but I also didn't pay with cash. Note that the fare chart makes no mention of Ventra.

[jajuan]

That will certainly need to get clarified. I didn't pay with a fare card, but I also didn't pay with cash. Note that the fare chart makes no mention of Ventra.

Yes that does indeed that needs to be clarified since Ventra is replacing all the current fare cards. Will the PAYG option count as paying cash or paying with a fare card?

[Busjack]

Yes that does indeed that needs to be clarified since Ventra is replacing all the current fare cards. Will the PAYG option count as paying cash or paying with a fare card?

Everything trigger has said up to now is that it is only a substitute for cash, and Kevin's transaction confirms that. Apparently only a transit account attached to either a Ventra card or some other card counts as a fare card.

Again, do you see the point I made about disclosure at the point of the transaction? Something shouldn't need to be clarified a couple of days later.

[artthouwill]

Mine eventually transferred 12 hours after activating.

One less card to carry. I try to have the extreme opposite of Costanza's wallet.

The charges posted to my contactless bankcard using PAYG are a bit confusing, however.

On Wednesday morning, I used my own card for a rail trip and then later a bus trip. In the evening, I used it for another rail trip. If my calculations are correct, that's a total of $6.50. But this is what got posted for that day:

9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $5.00
9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $1.75

That adds up to $6.75, a quarter more than what fares should have been. My only hypothesis is that I was charged $2.25 instead of $2 for the bus trip. Unless I missed something in the 7,000+ word Terms and Conditions, PAYG should still charge only $2 for bus trips.

I could be wrong, but I've seen bus operators charge cash paying customers $2.25. I thought the fare for the bus was $2.00 cash, but maybe that is only on transit cards. In any event, I would think PAYG would also charge $2.00. Could it be possible that contactless debit or credit cards could be seen as cash and thus subject to the extra .25?

Just checked the CTA website and the cash fare on buses is $2.25 ($2.00 with CC and transit cards). So again, I can only surmise that you were charged a cash fare with your debit card, hence the extra $0.25.

This being the case, what would be charged from an actual Ventra card as opposed to a contactless debit card? I know for sure any thoughts that I may have had concerning using a contactless bank card to load passes is surely out the window.

[sw4400]

Mine eventually transferred 12 hours after activating.

One less card to carry. I try to have the extreme opposite of Costanza's wallet.

The charges posted to my contactless bankcard using PAYG are a bit confusing, however.

On Wednesday morning, I used my own card for a rail trip and then later a bus trip. In the evening, I used it for another rail trip. If my calculations are correct, that's a total of $6.50. But this is what got posted for that day:

9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $5.00
9/12/2013   Debit Card Transaction    Ventra Account Chicago IL 9/11     $1.75

That adds up to $6.75, a quarter more than what fares should have been. My only hypothesis is that I was charged $2.25 instead of $2 for the bus trip. Unless I missed something in the 7,000+ word Terms and Conditions, PAYG should still charge only $2 for bus trips.

This is why I am not sold, nor will ever be about the contactless bank card option that Ventra offers. The little hidden fees creep up on you very slowly, like here where Kevin states the total more than the fares should be. The math shows that he went on three bus rides($2.25) but was overcharged by .50 cents according to the fare chart. Ventra should fall under full fare with farecard, thus he should only be charged $2.00/ride with only one transfer cost of .25 cents with a total of three rides being $6.25. Kevin, you say you were using a contactless bank card, which I'm guessing is your own personal Debit/Credit Card. I don't know how that works, if MetaBank and CTA consider that a farecard or do they classify that as cash. It sounds like the latter.

[artthouwill]

Bought my Ventra Card loaded with a CTA 7-day pass from the Howard Red Line station's Ventra vending machine, and yes the vending machines do give you a receipt upon you pressing yes at the "Would you like a receipt?" prompt. I did the registration through my smart phone while sitting on a 22 Clark bus that was on layover. That was actually quick and painless, and the $5 fee I got charged at the vending machine did get credited to card as a transit value within two seconds of me logging into my transit account after registering my card. The 7-day pass was also shown in the pass queue ready for use upon my first successful tap. I was pleasantly surprised to find purchase process itself was quite seamless. It took me less than five minutes to complete the transaction. The registration took me maybe another five minutes. So far so good in my personal Ventra transition.

And the Ventra site does explicitly say that you have to take the card out of your wallet and swipe it alone against the Ventra reader or else tapping a wallet or purse like with Chicago Card or CCP will result in either your debit card or credit card registering a tap if they are equipped with the RFID chip.

You said you bought your Ventra Card loaded with a 7 - Day CTA pass at the Howard L station.

1 Did you also have to pay the extra $5.00 on site?

2. After you registered your card, the $5.00 should be credited back to your card? How would that be reflected? Upon your first use, will the $2.00 fare be deducted, leaving you with $3.00 balance, or will the "month" start on your loaded pass? If the latter, would you receive a $5 credit when you decide to load another pass onto your card?

[sw4400]

Here's a situation with a series of questions posed to the forum:

• If you have a multi-day pass(we'll say 7-Day for example and three friends tagging along with you), can you use that pass for yourself and the other three friends? Do you just tell the Bus Operator and he/she inputs some info into the Ventra reader and as you tap and pass the card to your friends, it says "GO" for each? More importantly, does your card incur charges if all you have is the $5.00 credit on it from first purchasing or does it show 7-Day Pass 0.00 for each tap from your friends after you? I don't really know how this works, but if I understand correctly, multiple people with you can use a Ventra Card with a multi-day pass on it too.

True or am I just lost by the info?

[owine]

Here's a situation with a series of questions posed to the forum:

• If you have a multi-day pass(we'll say 7-Day for example and three friends tagging along with you), can you use that pass for yourself and the other three friends? Do you just tell the Bus Operator and he/she inputs some info into the Ventra reader and as you tap and pass the card to your friends, it says "GO" for each? More importantly, does your card incur charges if all you have is the $5.00 credit on it from first purchasing or does it show 7-Day Pass 0.00 for each tap from your friends after you? I don't really know how this works, but if I understand correctly, multiple people with you can use a Ventra Card with a multi-day pass on it too.

True or am I just lost by the info?

I bet it works just like a multi-day pass on a CCP did. With my CCP and 30 day pass, I could do passbacks and the fare was added on to my next reload transaction. For example, if I passed back two bus rides, I was charged $104 at my next reload.

[Amtrak41]

There is timeout period for the various day passes, like 20 minutes until the next use, so no passback.

Makes no difference what the hardware is.

[Busjack]

...

This being the case, what would be charged from an actual Ventra card as opposed to a contactless debit card? I know for sure any thoughts that I may have had concerning using a contactless bank card to load passes is surely out the window.

Unless CTA was lying about no fare increase, a Ventra card should count the same as any other stored value card, i.e. a loaded transit card or one of the varieties of Chicago Card, in which case the rate is $2.00/25 cents first transfer, 2nd transfer free.

But what happened to Kevin is exactly what I mentioned a week or so ago, and I got flamed.

Also, since Kevin then mentioned the Pay as You Go Option, I assume that if trigger's theory were on the website, Kevin would have found it. But it wasn't on the website.

As far as using a contactless bank card, you can register it with a transit account, and supposedly put a pass on it, but Kevin was using it as an open fare medium as opposed to a transit account.

Speaking of CTA PR lying for a CTA liar, check out this from the home page news feed.

[jajuan]

You said you bought your Ventra Card loaded with a 7 - Day CTA pass at the Howard L station.

1 Did you also have to pay the extra $5.00 on site?

2. After you registered your card, the $5.00 should be credited back to your card? How would that be reflected? Upon your first use, will the $2.00 fare be deducted, leaving you with $3.00 balance, or will the "month" start on your loaded pass? If the latter, would you receive a $5 credit when you decide to load another pass onto your card?

Yes I got charged the fee on site, and yes after registration it was immediately refunded to my card. It's reflected on my card as a $5 transit value, in essence the equivalent of me carrying a $5 transit card and a 7-Day pass in my wallet but on one card. Upon first tap, the loaded pass would take precedence. A short hierarchy in what registers first for Ventra is multi-day pass, stored transit value, PAYG (this last one if you're using your contactless debit or card to track your Ventra accounts). When my pass is used up I can wait one day before loading another pass and use the $5 toward one day of travel to and from work, or I can just keep reloading passes until I decide to use the $5. Another scenario is since I bought the CTA only 7-Day, in theory the $5 is there for use if I wanted to use Pace one day for any reason and fares would be deducted from the $5 since the 7-Day pass I loaded isn't valid on Pace and Ventra is supposed to go to the next fare media option down the line to attempt to register a fare for you. I could also have it in reserve for use for a friend or family member to tap a second time after I do a tap against my pass. I did double check the Ventra site to make sure I was correct that it would be 1st tap my pass, the 2nd tap friend or relative from the stored transit value. So to answer sw's question yes you can have a pass loaded on your card and then tap it again for a second or more persons but you have to have enough separate stored transit value to cover the addition people loaded on the card in addition to your pass in that case. On the bus, you do have to inform the bus operator you're tapping for multiple people so the operator sets the reader on multiple fare reads. For the L though, you just tap for each addition person. I can even add more with the $5 in addition with reloading any passes. There are multiple options to how I use the $5 or add to it, but nothing would get deducted from it until I either don't have a pass loaded on my card or unless I do multiple taps in a multiple person scenario while I have an active pass in cue for use.

[owine]

On the Ventra website, under Support History there is the following entry:

"Chiacago Card Plus - New Card Order"

[jajuan]

From the Ventra site the order of what's looked for by the Ventra reader when you tap is in this order:

1. Joint CTA-Pace passes that are valid on both transit agencies
2. Agency-specific passes that are valid on just one participating transit agency
3. Shorter duration passes
4. Longer duration passes
5. Transit Benefit Value
6. Transit Value
7. PAYG if using a contactless credit or debit card or mobile phone

[pudgym29]

I am registered with CTA for my Chicago Card. I also have an account with CTA through which I have ordered numerous magnetic-striped 1, 2 (when those were offered), 3, and 7-day passes. I never got a notice about exchanging my Chicago Card for a Ventra card. Maybe it lost track of me. I did get the notice when my first Chicago Card was going to expire.

Anyhow, a day came when I needed to ride transit. I wound up at the Belmont Blue Line "L" station. I took a minute to note the machine's instructions. I opted to buy a new Ventra card. I'm glad to state that I successfully deduced how to buy the card, and put $25.00 on it. When I got back to the domicile later that night, I manuevered to the Ventra W-WW site and registered said card. My balance was accurate to the penny.

What I would like to see from the Ventra card is: When I tap my card, it should display my current balance. If my Chicago Card could do that, so should it. I also want more clarification on how I pre-register a 1, 3, or 7-day pass on Ventra. It sounds to me like I have to go to the website (or can I go to an "L" station?) and tell it I want to begin using a pass. If I want to board an eastbound #77 Belmont bus as my first ride of a 3-day pass, I think I have to go to the website immediately before boarding.

Oh, and what about the value on my Chicago Card? Ummm, don't tell CTA, but I think my last use of it put my balance at -$1.50. So I am not worried about its value being transferred.

[Busjack]

...

Anyhow, a day came when I needed to ride transit. I wound up at the Belmont Blue Line "L" station. I took a minute to note the machine's instructions. I opted to buy a new Ventra card. I'm glad to state that I successfully deduced how to buy the card, and put $25.00 on it. When I got back to the domicile later that night, I manuevered to the Ventra W-WW site and registered said card. My balance was accurate to the penny. ...

If you go to the CTA Tattler, it appears that the bigger stink is getting the card in the mail and figuring out what your access code is, without which you don't get further. Also, apparently a user needs a web enabled device to get an access code before one can call the 800 number to activate the card, or gets put on interminable hold, according to Kevin O'Neil.

As I said a couple of days ago, what is going to be the next confusing mess to blame on the customers?

[BusHunter]

If you go to the CTA Tattler, it appears that the bigger stink is getting the card in the mail and figuring out what your access code is, without which you don't get further. Also, apparently a user needs a web enabled device to get an access code before one can call the 800 number to activate the card, or gets put on interminable hold, according to Kevin O'Neil.

As I said a couple of days ago, what is going to be the next confusing mess to blame on the customers?

It would make a little sense since you have to manage your account online, but they can't expect all riders to be online.

I got confused in my first five seconds at the ventra machine. When you go to buy a card, the machine asks "how do you want your $5 applied as transit value or as a pass." If you applied it as transit value could you then use the value as a pass? I don't understand why you have to decide already? Why don't they just have a balance and you can later decide what to purchase and if you don't purchase anything then the bus or train deducts a standard fare.

[sw4400]

What am I looking at here with the transactions marked "CTA Back Office"... one for $5.00 and one for $0.00??? I was at work when those went through. I still have my $5.00 credit, but that mystifies me. Was this something to do with when I first registered, because I got the $5.00 credit same day.

[owine]

If you go to the CTA Tattler, it appears that the bigger stink is getting the card in the mail and figuring out what your access code is, without which you don't get further. Also, apparently a user needs a web enabled device to get an access code before one can call the 800 number to activate the card, or gets put on interminable hold, according to Kevin O'Neil.

As I said a couple of days ago, what is going to be the next confusing mess to blame on the customers?

This is the dumbest of the dumb Ventra issues. The letter that came with my card issued the same exact edict about logging in to the website first to set my access code before calling to activate the card. I'm sorry that so many seem to have issues following basic instructions...

[Busjack]

This is the dumbest of the dumb Ventra issues. The letter that came with my card issued the same exact edict about logging in to the website first to set my access code before calling to activate the card. I'm sorry that so many seem to have issues following basic instructions...

But the real question is why someone is coming up with instructions so complex (as I pointed out on the CTA Tattler, way more complex than to activate a credit card or pay taxes online) that the target audience can't figure it out? Does everyone have to have the intelligence of Claypool or have trigger at their right hand just to get a ride? Why should someone picking up a phone at Customer Service take so long? Comcast has at least figured that one out.

Also, there is the issue stated on the CTA Tattler that you have to keep and make the connection to the e-mail. Are those people blowing smoke?

[owine]

But the real question is why someone is coming up with instructions so complex (as I pointed out on the CTA Tattler, way more complex than to activate a credit card or pay taxes online) that the target audience can't figure it out? Does everyone have to have the intelligence of Claypool or have trigger at their right hand just to get a ride? Why should someone picking up a phone at Customer Service take so long? Comcast has at least figured that one out.

Also, there is the issue stated on the CTA Tattler that you have to keep and make the connection to the e-mail. Are those people blowing smoke?

Here's how I did it, which I think is reasonable:

I got the email three weeks ago saying my card had been printed and mailed including my temporary username and password. I logged into the Ventra website, changed my password and set an access code as part of the process. Then all I needed to do was call the automated line to activate my card.

It's the same exact thing that activating a credit/debit card does, but in that case they ask for a PIN/SSN to verify you. With all of the hoopla about the optional debit card, isn't this access code (which is essentially a customer service PIN, not uncommon) better than the alternative, associating your SSN with your transit account?

With that said, a better process probably would have been to not assign usernames/passwords in advance and essentially ship unregistered cards. But I wouldn't be surprised if there were factors that made than unfeasible.

[Busjack]

...

With that said, a better process probably would have been to not assign usernames/passwords in advance and essentially ship unregistered cards. But I wouldn't be surprised if there were factors that made than unfeasible.

Apparently that's what the people who had Chicago Cards, but decided to buy Ventra cards at a station or a retail outlet, did.

But then CTA couldn't get into the charade that they were "waiving" the $5 fee, which would have been credited on registration, anyway.

Again, any credit card with which I have dealt came with instructions to call 1-800-whatever to activate it, and then go to the website if you wanted to use online account features, not the other way around. More recently, they have said you can activate it on their website, but the 1-800 number option is still there.

Of course, the only reason a mailed credit card has to be activated is to assure that the intended recipient received it, since about 25 years ago there were reports of credit cards being stolen in the mail by identity thieves.