Random Pace

[Shannoncvpi]

On 4/19/2020 at 11:21 AM, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

they allowed to drive with out plates? looks like it’s on route to

Yea it is it was running on the 318

[NewFlyerMCI]

The 270 used to be about the 3rd busiest pace route, with about ~70k passengers a month in recent times. Now, Pulse has entered the top 10, at about spot number 7, with ridership in the high 50k's, low 60k's

[artthouwill]

39 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

The 270 used to be about the 3rd busiest pace route, with about ~70k passengers a month in recent times. Now, Pulse has entered the top 10, at about spot number 7, with ridership in the high 50k's, low 60k's

At one time,  the 353 was a top ten route  before CTA created the 111 King Drive/111th.  Peak service was every 15 minutes between 95th and Riverdale and 30 minutes off peak.  

The 359 joined the top 10 when the route was extended from 119th and Halsted to 95th Red Line. 

352 was always in the top 10 but the owl service vaulted it to number 1.

 

[NewFlyerMCI]

2 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

352 was always in the top 10 but the owl service vaulted it to number 1.

 

That explains the disparity between it and #2, I always wondered why that was. The 349's ridership also surprises me, considering every other route in the list serves at least 1 CTA station

[Pace831]

I noticed Pace buses were running a special head sign for the COVID-19 crisis:

THANK YOU MEDICAL STAFF

AND FIRST RESPONDERS

WE STAND WITH YOU!

[artthouwill]

On 4/26/2020 at 4:06 PM, NewFlyerMCI said:

That explains the disparity between it and #2, I always wondered why that was. The 349's ridership also surprises me, considering every other route in the list serves at least 1 CTA station

I think 349's spike is related to CTA abandoning the 49A.  The 69A went from Being an all say route (in coordination with Pace) to rush hours only before CTA gave it over to Pace completely. 

Reminds me of the 17 Westchester that CTA ran.  When CTAcut it to rush only, Pace invented the 317 to run off peak.  Then CTAgave up the 17 completely to Pace.

[NewFlyerMCI]

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

I think 349's spike is related to CTA abandoning the 49A.  The 69A went from Being an all say route (in coordination with Pace) to rush hours only before CTA gave it over to Pace completely. 

Reminds me of the 17 Westchester that CTA ran.  When CTAcut it to rush only, Pace invented the 317 to run off peak.  Then CTAgave up the 17 completely to Pace.

Somewhat related, how come the 381 and 307 don't make limited stops along side their shared routings with CTA?

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Somewhat related, how come the 381 and 307 don't make limited stops along side their shared routings with CTA?

Actually the 381 has  always been a limited stop route in the city since it was rerouted to the 95th station.  Before the most recent coordination with CTA, the 381 stopped at Halsted, Vincennes,  Ashland,  and Wood (RI Metra).  After that,  it made all stops. Now it's every 1/2 mile, plus Wood.  

The original routing when Suburban Transit Systems operated the route started from 63rd and Halsted, as did Soyrh Suburban Safeway's Harvey cia Western route ( now the 349).  The route went west to Morgan. south on Morgan to 87th, east to Vincennes, south on Vincennes and west on 85th to Kean Ave in Hickory Hills.

As for the 307, it only runs 1 mile with the 62H between 63rd and 55th.  Plus the 307 continues in Harlem whereas the 62H turns on Archer.  As for the portion between Harlem Green Line and Grand,  that portion has always been the 307's territory.  Between North Blvs and North Ave, it's all suburban.  Between North Ave and Grand is the border between Chicago and Elmwood Park.  The 90 used to end at Grand before being extended south to the Green Line.  Pace did change the 307 short turns from ending some SB trips at Ogden to ending some NB trips at the Green Line to reduce some duplication.  There are still people north of Lake St that want to travel south on Harlem like to N Riverside Mall and beyond.

IRS one thing for Pace to do limited stops in the city when it shares a route with CRA, but it should service every stop in a suburb regardless of CTA'S presence.

[NewFlyerMCI]

51 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

Actually the 381 has  always been a limited stop route in the city since it was rerouted to the 95th station.  Before the most recent coordination with CTA, the 381 stopped at Halsted, Vincennes,  Ashland,  and Wood (RI Metra).  After that,  it made all stops. Now it's every 1/2 mile, plus Wood.  

The original routing when Suburban Transit Systems operated the route started from 63rd and Halsted, as did Soyrh Suburban Safeway's Harvey cia Western route ( now the 349).  The route went west to Morgan. south on Morgan to 87th, east to Vincennes, south on Vincennes and west on 85th to Kean Ave in Hickory Hills.

As for the 307, it only runs 1 mile with the 62H between 63rd and 55th.  Plus the 307 continues in Harlem whereas the 62H turns on Archer.  As for the portion between Harlem Green Line and Grand,  that portion has always been the 307's territory.  Between North Blvs and North Ave, it's all suburban.  Between North Ave and Grand is the border between Chicago and Elmwood Park.  The 90 used to end at Grand before being extended south to the Green Line.  Pace did change the 307 short turns from ending some SB trips at Ogden to ending some NB trips at the Green Line to reduce some duplication.  There are still people north of Lake St that want to travel south on Harlem like to N Riverside Mall and beyond.

IRS one thing for Pace to do limited stops in the city when it shares a route with CRA, but it should service every stop in a suburb regardless of CTA'S presence.

Huh, I thought that practice stopped on the route since they no longer depict it on the map. Thanks for the info.

[artthouwill]

10 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Huh, I thought that practice stopped on the route since they no longer depict it on the map. Thanks for the info.

Actually you are correct.   I checked the posted stops list on the 381 and it makes all local stops in the city.  It actually makes sense because its schedule is coordinated with CTA's 95th route.  That's part of the reason that 1/2 of CTA'S 95th route don't operate West of the Red Line.   

[Sam92]

6 hours ago, artthouwill said:

Actually you are correct.   I checked the posted stops list on the 381 and it makes all local stops in the city.  It actually makes sense because its schedule is coordinated with CTA's 95th route.  That's part of the reason that 1/2 of CTA'S 95th route don't operate West of the Red Line.   

All 95 95th trips are full length. Schedule coordination was broken apon combination of 95E and 95W only trip that short turns at the red line is a school trip from Throop that goes downtown and either works J14 or 26

[artthouwill]

4 hours ago, Sam92 said:

All 95 95th trips are full length. Schedule coordination was broken apon combination of 95E and 95W only trip that short turns at the red line is a school trip from Throop that goes downtown and either works J14 or 26

A lot has changed then.  My understanding was that when 95E and 95W were combined, 95th would only run half of the trips rest if the Red Line for 2 reasons. 

1.  To coordinate with 381 and avoid running both buses on the same schedule and not to mention the supplemental service provided by the 112 and

2.  The heavier loads were on the 95E portion of the route.   381 was a high frequency route by itself so there was no need to run every 95 the length of the route.  The is what CTA AND PACE said when this was introduced.   What changes?

The other thing is this.  Uf CTA is running every 95 full length, then why is the 381 making all stops in the city instead if the old half mile stopping pattern?

[NewFlyerMCI]

2 hours ago, artthouwill said:

A lot has changed then.  My understanding was that when 95E and 85W were combined, 95th would only run half of the trips rest if the Red Line for 2 reasons. 

1.  To coordinate with 381 and avoid running both buses on the same schedule and not to mention the supplemental service provided by the 112 and

2.  The heavier loads were on the 95E portion of the route.   381 was a high frequency route by itself so there was no need to run every 95 the length of the route.  The is what CTA AND PACE said when this was introduced.   What changes?

The other thing is this.  Uf CTA is running every 95 full length, then why is the 381 making all stops in the city instead if the old half mile stopping pattern?

85W ?

That's why I had asked about the 381, cause I remember it did used to make limited stops between Western & Ryan and it didn't anymore when I took it about 2 weeks ago. The schedule isn't much coordinated either, just one look at the weekday evening WB service sees each route leaving within 3-5 mins of each other at the red line (and that's assuming WB 95 isn't late/early) so their effectively right behind each other.

[Sam92]

15 hours ago, artthouwill said:

A lot has changed then.  My understanding was that when 95E and 95W were combined, 95th would only run half of the trips rest if the Red Line for 2 reasons. 

1.  To coordinate with 381 and avoid running both buses on the same schedule and not to mention the supplemental service provided by the 112 and

2.  The heavier loads were on the 95E portion of the route.   381 was a high frequency route by itself so there was no need to run every 95 the length of the route.  The is what CTA AND PACE said when this was introduced.   What changes?

The other thing is this.  Uf CTA is running every 95 full length, then why is the 381 making all stops in the city instead if the old half mile stopping pattern?

There was never any plans to coordinate the new 95 and 381 all that was discussed as hypothetical scenarios on why 95E and 95W were separated in the forum. You're probably thinking about busjack and jajuan always bumping heads about how it wouldn't work cause passengers wouldn't be able to tell the difference between short turns. But nah #95 was always on pretty much 11-15 min frequency with all buses going straight through outside of the school trip. Only thing that DID change is at some point, pull-ins and pull-outs start and end at stony island

[artthouwill]

50 minutes ago, Sam92 said:

There was never any plans to coordinate the new 95 and 381 all that was discussed as hypothetical scenarios on why 95E and 95W were separated in the forum. You're probably thinking about busjack and jajuan always bumping heads about how it wouldn't work cause passengers wouldn't be able to tell the difference between short turns. But nah #95 was always on pretty much 11-15 min frequency with all buses going straight through outside of the school trip. Only thing that DID change is at some point, pull-ins and pull-outs start and end at stony island

I did some research.   The Pace=CTA  coordination was in 2012 and based on cording 95W and 381.  The limited stops in the city on 381 was eliminated at that time.

Now the question is since CTA combined 85E and 95W, why isn't the new schedule coordinated or why didn't Pace resume limited stop service in the city?

[NewFlyerMCI]

9 hours ago, artthouwill said:

I did some research.   The Pace=CTA  coordination was in 2012 and based on cording 95W and 381.  The limited stops in the city on 381 was eliminated at that time.

Now the question is since CTA combined 85E and 95W, why isn't the new schedule coordinated or why didn't Pace resume limited stop service in the city?

Would it have messed up a possible 381 interline with another pace route? Also, I feel as though it would've been diffucult to have inter-agency coordination between two routes that don't at least start or end at the same place. The 381 would've been counting on the WB 95 always being on time. And somewhat vice versa with the EB 95 counting on the EB 381

[Sam92]

13 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Would it have messed up a possible 381 interline with another pace route? Also, I feel as though it would've been diffucult to have inter-agency coordination between two routes that don't at least start or end at the same place. The 381 would've been counting on the WB 95 always being on time. And somewhat vice versa with the EB 95 counting on the EB 381

Essentially before recombining 95E and 95W, 95W could be treated as a short turn 381 with both acting as red line feeders. The combination of #95 pretty much be splits 95 and 381 into 2 distinct and different markets with 381 being strictly a feeder from the suburbs and west 95th while #95 is now a cross south side connection and therefore they are no longer really in competition with each other

[artthouwill]

3 hours ago, Sam92 said:

Essentially before recombining 95E and 95W, 95W could be treated as a short turn 381 with both acting as red line feeders. The combination of #95 pretty much be splits 95 and 381 into 2 distinct and different markets with 381 being strictly a feeder from the suburbs and west 95th while #95 is now a cross south side connection and therefore they are no longer really in competition with each other

I get it, but once upon a time, the 381 was limited stops in the city.  It changed to all stops when 95W and 381 were coordinated.   Now that 95 is one thru route, why isn't the 381 reverting back to limited stops within the city?

[Sam92]

2 hours ago, artthouwill said:

I get it, but once upon a time, the 381 was limited stops in the city.  It changed to all stops when 95W and 381 were coordinated.   Now that 95 is one thru route, why isn't the 381 reverting back to limited stops within the city?

Possibly an uptick in demand when the 381 started making all stops especially sharing the same stop as WB 95

[NewFlyerMCI]

7 hours ago, artthouwill said:

I get it, but once upon a time, the 381 was limited stops in the city.  It changed to all stops when 95W and 381 were coordinated.   Now that 95 is one thru route, why isn't the 381 reverting back to limited stops within the city?

 

4 hours ago, Sam92 said:

Possibly an uptick in demand when the 381 started making all stops especially sharing the same stop as WB 95

Probably explains the route placement in the terminal, with 381 and WB 95 being right next to each other

[NewFlyerMCI]

I notice the Axess buses out of West have what I assume are shields, but they look so DIY and not like any other shield I've seen from another transit agency. It looks like maybe PVC pipe and plastic or fiberglass? And there's no latch mechanism as well, my 379 driver today just let it swing btwn herself and the cabin, much like how the separator on the Greyhound bus looks. Were these here before the pandemic?

[jesi2282]

20 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

I notice the Axess buses out of West have what I assume are shields, but they look so DIY and not like any other shield I've seen from another transit agency. It looks like maybe PVC pipe and plastic or fiberglass? And there's no latch mechanism as well, my 379 driver today just let it swing btwn herself and the cabin, much like how the separator on the Greyhound bus looks. Were these here before the pandemic?

https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2020/04/10/pace-barriers/

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

I notice the Axess buses out of West have what I assume are shields, but they look so DIY and not like any other shield I've seen from another transit agency. It looks like maybe PVC pipe and plastic or fiberglass? And there's no latch mechanism as well, my 379 driver today just let it swing btwn herself and the cabin, much like how the separator on the Greyhound bus looks. Were these here before the pandemic?

No they weren't.   This is a response to the pandemic.   I believe that the shields came with Pace's New Flyers and the Axxess buses are being retrofitted.   If I see one I will let everyone know what it looks like.

Greyhound buses were outfitted with security shields/doors after since high profile incidents involving passengers attacking Greyhound drivers in the open road AFTER the September 11 terrorist attacks.  I've never seen any on other carriers.

[NewFlyerMCI]

Seems Pace is aware of the FedEx problem. Today, they had an EZ Rider tailing the Axess on the WB 379. Having seen all the midway routes for some time now, the 379 and 386 never use EZ Riders from what I've seen. I asked the bus driver why there were two buses, since it should've been nearly impossible to bunch on this schedule and he said it was for social distancing. I'd gotten on at 79th/Harlem, since I don't like waiting in the crowd at 79th/Sayre and when he said that, I asked him if it was for the upcoming crowd and he said yes.

For reference, the FedEx workers use either the 386 or 379 going to the facility from Midway, about ~10 riders in the morning and 5-7 in the evening on the 386. For the 379, ~10 people board at Midway, with another 15-30 boarding at 79th/Cicero and in the evening, it can be anywhere from 15 to 30+ people waiting for the 379 towards midway, with almost everyone getting off at 79th/Cicero. These numbers are just for my sort (Day), no idea what Sunrise, Twilight and Midnight look like.

[rotjohns]

12 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Seems Pace is aware of the FedEx problem. Today, they had an EZ Rider tailing the Axess on the WB 379. Having seen all the midway routes for some time now, the 379 and 386 never use EZ Riders from what I've seen. I asked the bus driver why there were two buses, since it should've been nearly impossible to bunch on this schedule and he said it was for social distancing. I'd gotten on at 79th/Harlem, since I don't like waiting in the crowd at 79th/Sayre and when he said that, I asked him if it was for the upcoming crowd and he said yes.

For reference, the FedEx workers use either the 386 or 379 going to the facility from Midway, about ~10 riders in the morning and 5-7 in the evening on the 386. For the 379, ~10 people board at Midway, with another 15-30 boarding at 79th/Cicero and in the evening, it can be anywhere from 15 to 30+ people waiting for the 379 towards midway, with almost everyone getting off at 79th/Cicero. These numbers are just for my sort (Day), no idea what Sunrise, Twilight and Midnight look like.

Well considering both routes moved to a Saturday schedule, it makes sense to have multiple buses hit Fedex to promote social distancing.  I'm surprised it wasn't two Axess buses instead of the EZ Rider if the amount of Fedex workers is that steep.  Plus I'm sure work at Fedex has picked up dramatically since everybody's ordering online. It also gives another driver that could've been furloughed a chance to work and stay busy.