Metra Electric Highliners

[trainman8119]

The original plan was to keep 4-6 old Highliners for work service. However, with the federal insistence on PTC, they scrapped

the idea because it would have been too costly to outfit the cars with the equipment (or so they say). I don't think there is a "plan"

for the old stuff. They can't sell them due to asbestos, but they haven't seemed to figure that out yet. They probably should

have been junked by now, but they just seem to hang around.

[richii0909]

Wow I had no idea they had asbestos.... sad they couldn't use them

[Busjack]

9 hours ago, richii0909 said:

Wow I had no idea they had asbestos.... sad they couldn't use them

Also rusted hulks. They were the last acquired cars that weren't stainless steel (discounting reacquired C&NW cars).

[andrethebusman]

Got this from Metra. Any ideas where Century Contracting is?

Note some labeled "scrap" - unsure if this means that Metra has been scrapping cars themselves, or just no scrapper info entered.

Metra_Old_Highliner_Status_Report.pdf

[Pace831]

The Highliners that had been on the Rondout siding for a while are now gone, not sure to where.

[richii0909]

On 5/24/2018 at 5:19 PM, Pace831 said:

The Highliners that had been on the Rondout siding for a while are now gone, not sure to where.

I’ve seen some on a siding on rock island mail line I believe and more in libertyville siding

[richii0909]

Just got back from IRM... was hoping to catch a ride on the old highliners... they had them parked in siding ugh lol. Anyways I asked if they have ever ran them.. he says that old highliners and Southshore cars are slow as dogs due to the them running on 1500 vs 600 at IRM. But one interesting thing is there are several youtube videos of them running by the depots and mainlines at IRM but at certain points the pantographs will just go down. I didn't understand why this happened, but strange thing is the car still had its headlamps running and the car appeared to be moving with no slow down.

 

 

 

[trainman8119]

On ‎5‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 6:04 PM, richii0909 said:

I’ve seen some on a siding on rock island mail line I believe and more in libertyville siding

All but 6 were moved to the yard in Bensenville behind some wall by the airport I am not familiar with. There are 6 eyesores sitting in the yard at Western Avenue.

[trainman8119]

On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 11:29 PM, richii0909 said:

Just got back from IRM... was hoping to catch a ride on the old highliners... they had them parked in siding ugh lol. Anyways I asked if they have ever ran them.. he says that old highliners and Southshore cars are slow as dogs due to the them running on 1500 vs 600 at IRM. But one interesting thing is there are several youtube videos of them running by the depots and mainlines at IRM but at certain points the pantographs will just go down. I didn't understand why this happened, but strange thing is the car still had its headlamps running and the car appeared to be moving with no slow down.

 

 

 

If a pantograph goes down in a car it may still have power in it if it is trainlined to another car with power. All it takes is flipping up a breaker switch in the electrical cabinet.

[richii0909]

31 minutes ago, trainman8119 said:

If a pantograph goes down in a car it may still have power in it if it is trainlined to another car with power. All it takes is flipping up a breaker switch in the electrical cabinet.

Thanks for that

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, trainman8119 said:

If a pantograph goes down in a car it may still have power in it if it is trainlined to another car with power. All it takes is flipping up a breaker switch in the electrical cabinet.

Second part of video (after :34) didn't seem to show either pantograph up.

[trainman8119]

58 minutes ago, Busjack said:

Second part of video (after :34) didn't seem to show either pantograph up.

it looks like they dropped the pans when going by the car house for some reason and that they are coasting. If you look at both sides, there is no headlight illuminated, so there is probably no power.

[r-schauer]

On ‎5‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 11:29 PM, richii0909 said:

Just got back from IRM... was hoping to catch a ride on the old highliners... they had them parked in siding ugh lol. Anyways I asked if they have ever ran them.. he says that old highliners and Southshore cars are slow as dogs due to the them running on 1500 vs 600 at IRM. But one interesting thing is there are several youtube videos of them running by the depots and mainlines at IRM but at certain points the pantographs will just go down. I didn't understand why this happened, but strange thing is the car still had its headlamps running and the car appeared to be moving with no slow down.

 

The Highliners are on display in Yard 5.  As I wrote in the PM to you, we aren't running pantograph equipment at the moment until the wire is in better shape, which is happening slowly.  Most of the work doesn't involve the wire per se, but instead the line poles, which tend to lean and move in the soft ground, which pulls the wire out of alignment.

I was the engineer on the Highliners on the one day they ran back in 2016 (two short demonstration trips on Member's Weekend).  Our trolley frogs do not have pan jumps on them yet, so I must drop the pans when running under them.  They don't go down on their own; I flip a switch in the cab.  

The cars receive their propulsion power from the overhead wire, of course, so if the pan is down on any given car, the car can't take power.  But the cars are fairly heavy and coast well, so it isn't a big deal to get through a frog area on the fly.  There's no trainlining of propulsion power between cars.

The cars each have their own battery for things like the headlight and the propulsion controls.  Even when the pan is down, the headlight will stay lit.  The battery trainline breaker that trainman8119 refers to does what it says; it doesn't trainline propulsion power.  I didn't have it turned on, and in normal conditions it would stay off.

But why isn't the headlight lit when I go westbound?  Simple reason.  Toward the end of the last trip, the batteries were getting low, so I didn't turn the headlight on when I changed ends.  They are not required by our operating rules during daylight hours.  The video of my westbound run started just after I had dropped the pans for the east station switch frog, and ended just before I put them back up to accelerate west.

Note that in my PM, I didn't say that South Shore cars are particularly slow, just the Highliners.  The South Shore cars have manual acceleration and you can wind them up as fast as you want.  East Troy does it all the time and a casual visitor would have no idea the cars are operating any way other than they were designed to.  The camshaft controller on the Highliners, although similar to those on CTA High Performance Family cars, notches up super-slow, and when you put it in Power, you just have to sit and wait for it to get into a point that actually starts to move along.

Richard

 

[richii0909]

14 hours ago, r-schauer said:

The Highliners are on display in Yard 5.  As I wrote in the PM to you, we aren't running pantograph equipment at the moment until the wire is in better shape, which is happening slowly.  Most of the work doesn't involve the wire per se, but instead the line poles, which tend to lean and move in the soft ground, which pulls the wire out of alignment.

I was the engineer on the Highliners on the one day they ran back in 2016 (two short demonstration trips on Member's Weekend).  Our trolley frogs do not have pan jumps on them yet, so I must drop the pans when running under them.  They don't go down on their own; I flip a switch in the cab.  

The cars receive their propulsion power from the overhead wire, of course, so if the pan is down on any given car, the car can't take power.  But the cars are fairly heavy and coast well, so it isn't a big deal to get through a frog area on the fly.  There's no trainlining of propulsion power between cars.

The cars each have their own battery for things like the headlight and the propulsion controls.  Even when the pan is down, the headlight will stay lit.  The battery trainline breaker that trainman8119 refers to does what it says; it doesn't trainline propulsion power.  I didn't have it turned on, and in normal conditions it would stay off.

But why isn't the headlight lit when I go westbound?  Simple reason.  Toward the end of the last trip, the batteries were getting low, so I didn't turn the headlight on when I changed ends.  They are not required by our operating rules during daylight hours.  The video of my westbound run started just after I had dropped the pans for the east station switch frog, and ended just before I put them back up to accelerate west.

Note that in my PM, I didn't say that South Shore cars are particularly slow, just the Highliners.  The South Shore cars have manual acceleration and you can wind them up as fast as you want.  East Troy does it all the time and a casual visitor would have no idea the cars are operating any way other than they were designed to.  The camshaft controller on the Highliners, although similar to those on CTA High Performance Family cars, notches up super-slow, and when you put it in Power, you just have to sit and wait for it to get into a point that actually starts to move along.

Richard

 

 

Thanks Richard for all the detailed information you really gave me a good idea about the situation. When I was referring to the SouthShore equipment it was information that I received from motor man on CTA 4391 street car... I had asked him before I found you on here. I was going to stop by today but got sidetracked with other things. Keep me in the loop on any updates on the highliners.. drop me a PM

 

Take Care,

 

Rich

[artthouwill]

Spotted a set of ME Highliners with graffiti in the yard just past Western  station on the MD line.

[Pace831]

Two Highliners are available for sale from Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum.

[Busjack]

The latest Rolling Stock Update  includes the overhaul of 26 EMUs, but then says "Lease cars to NICTD upon completion of program." The after picture shows a maroon (NICTD)) stripe:

 

Maybe that's how NICTD gets cars for the West Lake and Double Track projects.

 

[busfan2847]

13 hours ago, Busjack said:

The latest Rolling Stock Update  includes the overhaul of 26 EMUs, but then says "Lease cars to NICTD upon completion of program." The after picture shows a maroon (NICTD)) stripe:

 

Maybe that's how NICTD gets cars for the West Lake and Double Track projects.

 

These are the original 26 prototype HL-1 cars 1201-1226. They were surplus on Metra as it has enough HL-2 cars (1227-1386) to meet operational needs. South Shore does need more cars but was unable to source cars matching their existing specifications. They have leased the cars for 15 years from Metra for a $3.519M annual payment. The Autumn 2022 First & Fastest has a photograph of 1201+1202 plus NICTD GP38 1000 at the ceremonial groundbreaking for the new downtown Michigan City station.

[Busjack]

58 minutes ago, busfan2847 said:

These are the original 26 prototype HL-1 cars 1201-1226. They were surplus on Metra as it has enough HL-2 cars (1227-1386) to meet operational needs. South Shore does need more cars but was unable to source cars matching their existing specifications. They have leased the cars for 15 years from Metra for a $3.519M annual payment. The Autumn 2022 First & Fastest has a photograph of 1201+1202 plus NICTD GP38 1000 at the ceremonial groundbreaking for the new downtown Michigan City station.

On the Metra side, at the time the HL-2 cars were ordered, I wondered why they ordered 160 cars instead of 134 to maintain the fleet at 160, but they said at the time that there were factors such as seating capacity was reduced by adding washrooms. In retrospect, Metra must have figured no.

We also find out in retrospect why they tested that the NICTD and ME cars were compatible.

I discussed the South Shore point there.

[geneking7320]

Hi All;

Does anyone know [or point me to an article stating] why Metra didn't order their 12xx - 13xx series cars with 3 passenger doorways per side like NICTD?

 

Edited December 18, 2022 by geneking7320
ease of reading

[Busjack]

6 minutes ago, geneking7320 said:

Hi All;

Does anyone know [or point me to an article stating] why Metra didn't order their 12xx - 13xx series cars with 3 passenger doorways per side like NICTD?

 

ME is all high platform.

[busfan2847]

1 hour ago, geneking7320 said:

Hi All;

Does anyone know [or point me to an article stating] why Metra didn't order their 12xx - 13xx series cars with 3 passenger doorways per side like NICTD?

 

No Metra passenger bi-level car - diesel hauled or electric - has more than the one center door per car. It was not in the specification for the cars and was added to the later spec for the NICTD cars

[geneking7320]

Busjack;

The original IC Highliners had 3 doors and all platform were high. Note the post from richii0909. You can enter the car at the platform here also. The biggest functional difference between the original highliner and the NICTD car is that the cab and pantograph positions are reversed and the engineer station is raised up from the platform level.

[geneking7320]

4 minutes ago, busfan2847 said:

No Metra passenger bi-level car - diesel hauled or electric - has more than the one center door per car. It was not in the specification for the cars and was added to the later spec for the NICTD cars

Agreed. I just think Metra should have ordered cars like NICTDs. Note what I said in my reply to Busjack.

 

[Busjack]

30 minutes ago, geneking7320 said:

Busjack;

The original IC Highliners had 3 doors and all platform were high. Note the post from richii0909. You can enter the car at the platform here also. The biggest functional difference between the original highliner and the NICTD car is that the cab and pantograph positions are reversed and the engineer station is raised up from the platform level.

One could, but only if it wasn't used as the operator's cab. The 1200s were based on the 8500s, which have the high level cabs, and, as noted by @busfan2847, the NICTD cars came later.

Looks like the Alstom cars will have 4 doors, but here Metra is buying something "off the shelf," instead of something based on the Burlington cars (withdrawn spec. said they had to be compatible with everything).

BTW, from the Metra facebook link I posted under South Shore, it looks like a third door was not added to 1201.