Random Pace

[Erin Mishkin Jr.]

Spotted this in 20444 the other day. If any of y'all get this bus then this panel better be fixed because we don't want it to hurt anyone's heads. Rode 20444 last weekend as well the panel was not loose but on Thursday it was

[NewFlyerMCI]

Route 301 & 322 seem long on the map (and they are), but the ride seems so quick. But then you get off, and you've been on the bus for 40-50 minutes, but it just doesn't seem like it...

In other news, Yorktown Center needs some sort of express bus.

[Railguy]

Express bus to where?

[NewFlyerMCI]

1 hour ago, Railguy said:

Express bus to where?

I said Yorktown Center and meant Oakbrook Center, but some sort of I-290 alignment for a trip or two on the 301 or 322 would be nice lol. It's not feasible, but it would be a nice thought. Right now, I've more incentive to go to Woodfield Mall via transit over Oakbrook/Yorktown

[BusHunter]

7 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

I said Yorktown Center and meant Oakbrook Center, but some sort of I-290 alignment for a trip or two on the 301 or 322 would be nice lol. It's not feasible, but it would be a nice thought. Right now, I've more incentive to go to Woodfield Mall via transit over Oakbrook/Yorktown

Funny they have studies to extend service from des plaines blue line onto wb I-290 and they take all the buses off I-290

[NewFlyerMCI]

2 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Funny they have studies to extend service from des plaines blue line onto wb I-290 and they take all the buses off I-290

I mean, the 757 is only suspended right, not permanently cut? I'm assuming that's what you're referring to?

[Railguy]

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Funny they have studies to extend service from des plaines blue line onto wb I-290 and they take all the buses off I-290

IDOT is programmed to receive CMAQ funding for BOS between Foredt Pk Des Plaines Ave to Mannheim.   Pace committed to opersting express service might get your wish

[artthouwill]

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Funny they have studies to extend service from des plaines blue line onto wb I-290 and they take all the buses off I-290

The 747 was a popular route.   First Saturday service was cur  with the 301 being extended to Oak Brook Mall on Saturdays. The Sunday service was extended.   Then they made the decision to combine the 301 and the 747.

The 767 operated from 54th Pink Line to Schaumburg serving N Riverside before running Desplaines to I 290 and running with the 757.  That route was eliminated due to low ridership.

The 757 was a victim of the pandemic.  I believe the signage is still up at the south entrance of the Forest Park st, but the schedule is no longer posted.

The problem with these routes wer of them detoured during the P.M rush eastbound because of horrendous traffic on I 290. Traffic was snared EB from before St Charles Rd through Oak Park.   Most757 and 767s jumped off at St Charles to 25th  Ave and Madison and Van But Forest Park. 

The 747 couldn't enter I 290 from Roosevelt Rd because the ramp was always closed during the p.m rush.  The 647 just ran Roosevelt Rd to Desplaines and to Forest Park.   Passengers would get off the bus along Roosevelt Rd, but the bus wouldn't pick up 301 passengers.   Perhaps their complaintswd to the merger of the 301 and 747 

[BusHunter]

2 hours ago, artthouwill said:

The 747 was a popular route.   First Saturday service was cur  with the 301 being extended to Oak Brook Mall on Saturdays. The Sunday service was extended.   Then they made the decision to combine the 301 and the 747.

The 767 operated from 54th Pink Line to Schaumburg serving N Riverside before running Desplaines to I 290 and running with the 757.  That route was eliminated due to low ridership.

The 757 was a victim of the pandemic.  I believe the signage is still up at the south entrance of the Forest Park st, but the schedule is no longer posted.

The problem with these routes wer of them detoured during the P.M rush eastbound because of horrendous traffic on I 290. Traffic was snared EB from before St Charles Rd through Oak Park.   Most757 and 767s jumped off at St Charles to 25th  Ave and Madison and Van But Forest Park. 

The 747 couldn't enter I 290 from Roosevelt Rd because the ramp was always closed during the p.m rush.  The 647 just ran Roosevelt Rd to Desplaines and to Forest Park.   Passengers would get off the bus along Roosevelt Rd, but the bus wouldn't pick up 301 passengers.   Perhaps their complaintswd to the merger of the 301 and 747 

Why not just take roosevelt to mannheim 

[artthouwill]

7 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Route 301 & 322 seem long on the map (and they are), but the ride seems so quick. But then you get off, and you've been on the bus for 40-50 minutes, but it just doesn't seem like it...

In other news, Yorktown Center needs some sort of express bus.

Currently the 877 and 888 are suspended due to the pandemic.   These are the sour suburban expresses that run on i 294 between Roosevelt and 127th.   As mentioned above,  the 747 served Oak Brook mall. But not Yorktown  before being combined with the 301.

There was talk of extending the Blue Line Forest Park branch from Desplaines to either Manheim or Oak Brook Mall.  Once upon a time.there was talk of extending the O'Hare branch of the Blue Line to Woodfield but express bus service between Schaumburg and Rosemont won.  Evidently the pandemic killed 757 ridership to the point of suspension.   At least those riders have the 303 to connect with Rosemont and the 223 a, 600, and 606.

[BusHunter]

4 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

Currently the 877 and 888 are suspended due to the pandemic.   These are the sour suburban expresses that run on i 294 between Roosevelt and 127th.   As mentioned above,  the 747 served Oak Brook mall. But not Yorktown  before being combined with the 301.

There was talk of extending the Blue Line Forest Park branch from Desplaines to either Manheim or Oak Brook Mall.  Once upon a time.there was talk of extending the O'Hare branch of the Blue Line to Woodfield but express bus service between Schaumburg and Rosemont won.  Evidently the pandemic killed 757 ridership to the point of suspension.   At least those riders have the 303 to connect with Rosemont and the 223 a, 600, and 606.

I wonder when I 490 is done would there be any service using that. You could always make an elgin, streamwood and south schaumburg shuttle to rosemont. 

[artthouwill]

8 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

I wonder when I 490 is done would there be any service using that. You could always make an elgin, streamwood and south schaumburg shuttle to rosemont. 

The only route I can see is the 895 assuming that it bypasses Rosemont.   Maybe there could be a Tri State service that could have stations along the tollway enroute. Maybe the 895 could serve the satellite concourses or any western terminal built in the future. 

[BusHunter]

14 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

The only route I can see is the 895 assuming that it bypasses Rosemont.   Maybe there could be a Tri State service that could have stations along the tollway enroute. Maybe the 895 could serve the satellite concourses or any western terminal built in the future. 

Or maybe a return of the 757 but to rosemont. What kills the 757 is the 223 serves some of its route. Maybe they could use a 223 express.

 

[Busjack]

51 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

 At least those riders have the 303 to connect with Rosemont and the 223 a, 600, and 606.

At the time 757 was suspended, there were news stories with riders complaining how long the alternative trip was. At least you demonstrated what it was.

[artthouwill]

39 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Or maybe a return of the 757 but to rosemont. What kills the 757 is the 223 serves some of its route. Maybe they could use a 223 express.

 

I think the 757 and the 223 serve different markets.   The 223 serves people who either live north or northwest side of the city.  Perhaps even some south siders use that route.  The 757 is designed specifically for west siders and near west suburbanites even though both routes share the Rte 83 corridor of the Elk Grove Industrial area.   The 223 has high ridership because it also serves the Higgins Rd office complexes 

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, BusHunter said:

I wonder when I 490 is done would there be any service using that. You could always make an elgin, streamwood and south schaumburg shuttle to rosemont. 

There was supposed to be a study of the Elgin-O'Hare (Ill. 390) corridor, which is where you appear to be heading.

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

The only route I can see is the 895 assuming that it bypasses Rosemont.   Maybe there could be a Tri State service that could have stations along the tollway enroute. Maybe the 895 could serve the satellite concourses or any western terminal built in the future. 

Prepandemic, the 895 bypass was via I-88 and I-355 (not as direct as I-290 from the Tri-State).

Most of the rest is covered by the I-294 Tri-State Market & Facilities Feasibility Study,. The Summary Report appears to recommend in-line stations at 103rd/Harlem (with transit center to connect with 95th and Harlem Pulse lines), Cermak Toll Plaza (connects with Cermak Pulse and 301), O'Hare Oasis, and Meachem Rd. on I-90, with the Burr Ridge PNR being a transfer point between the I-55 and Tri-State routes.

The fly in the ointment, as I see it, is that the routes in the studied Harvey-Rosemont corridor were either suspended by the pandemic, or, in the case of 889 (Harvey-Rosemont), was spectacularly unsuccessful.

[NewFlyerMCI]

290 actually outpaced the 352 for the #1 ridership spot in weekly ridership for December 2021. Can't remember the last time it's been ousted from that spot.

Also crazy is the disparity btwn 1st busiest and 10th is almost 30k riders

Edit: Nvm, CTA's is almost 100k lol

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

290 actually outpaced the 352 for the #1 ridership spot in weekly ridership for December 2021. Can't remember the last time it's been ousted from that spot.

Also crazy is the disparity btwn 1st busiest and 10th is almost 30k riders

Edit: Nvm, CTA's is almost 100k lol

That is a surprise considering how short of a route 290 is compared to the 352.  Perhaps the 108 store some ridership in the city.  People aren't willing to walk as far in the cold and snow.  The 290 isn't an express and has no help from the 96.  

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

 

Also crazy is the disparity btwn 1st busiest and 10th is almost 30k riders

 

It has always been sort of that, although the biggest disparity has been between the top group and the rest of the system.

Top ones have always been (in no particular order) 352, 290, 270/Pulse, 250. 307, 381, 322, 318. Not surprisingly, all are classified as CTA Connectors, and most are also slated for Pulse. 352, 290. 270/Pulse, and 381 also have considerable city territory.

Looking at RTAMS, what's surprising is that Saturday ridership is almost the weekday number on  352, 290, 307 and Pulse.

[Busjack]

22 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

That is a surprise considering how short of a route 290 is compared to the 352.  Perhaps the 108 store some ridership in the city.  People aren't willing to walk as far in the cold and snow.  The 290 isn't an express and has no help from the 96.  

As the South Halsted  Study I previously cited indicated, the heavy ridership and the only segment considered for Pulse is 95th to Harvey. So, length isn't everything.

In the debate over the Coordination Plan, it wasn't an issue of who was stealing from whom, but that while the policy was that CTA would withdraw where Pace provided service (such as 270 and 349) Pace didn't have the resources to take over 108. Nonetheless, the survey recommends canning 108 and beefing up 8A, which I suppose would divert riders to the Red Line to Halsted Pulse.

[NewFlyerMCI]

1 hour ago, Busjack said:

It has always been sort of that, although the biggest disparity has been between the top group and the rest of the system.

Top ones have always been (in no particular order) 352, 290, 270/Pulse, 250. 307, 381, 322, 318. Not surprisingly, all are classified as CTA Connectors, and most are also slated for Pulse. 352, 290. 270/Pulse, and 381 also have considerable city territory.

Looking at RTAMS, what's surprising is that Saturday ridership is almost the weekday number on  352, 290, 307 and Pulse.

349 as well, which always surprises me with how busy it can get despite not having any CTA connection. In fact, I think the 349 & 364 are the two routes that rotate in/out of the top  10 that don’t have any CTA connection (although both routes have Harvey TC in common)

The weekend ridership doesn’t surprise me (at least Saturday wouldn’t). 307 and 352 basically just get slightly less frequent, it’d be a shame if Pace had lackluster service on Pulse and while I can’t personally attest to the 290 like I can the 307, if I had to have a shortlist of reliable weekend Pace routes, it’d be on there just because of how often I’ve seen it in that top 10 list

[artthouwill]

7 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

349 as well, which always surprises me with how busy it can get despite not having any CTA connection. In fact, I think the 349 & 364 are the two routes that rotate in/out of the top  10 that don’t have any CTA connection (although both routes have Harvey TC in common)

The weekend ridership doesn’t surprise me (at least Saturday wouldn’t). 307 and 352 basically just get slightly less frequent, it’d be a shame if Pace had lackluster service on Pulse and while I can’t personally attest to the 290 like I can the 307, if I had to have a shortlist of reliable weekend Pace routes, it’d be on there just because of how often I’ve seen it in that top 10 list

The 349 connects with East west routes between 79th and 119th.  

[Busjack]

10 hours ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

349 as well, which always surprises me with how busy it can get despite not having any CTA connection. ...

Maybe you meant with the L, but see below.

2 hours ago, artthouwill said:

The 349 connects with East west routes between 79th and 119th.  

Also, it has its main CTA connection at 79th and Western, and assumed passengers carried by 49A. It has similar city characteristics as 352, except that a portion of Western divides Chicago and Evergreen Park.

[artthouwill]

1 minute ago, Busjack said:

 

Also, it has its main CTA connection at 79th and Western, and assumed passengers carried by 49A. It has similar city characteristics as 352, except that a portion of Western divides Chicago and Evergreen Park.

And the 349 is a local making all stops. 

[MetroShadow]

On 2/10/2022 at 7:44 PM, artthouwill said:

I think the 757 and the 223 serve different markets.   The 223 serves people who either live north or northwest side of the city.  Perhaps even some south siders use that route.  The 757 is designed specifically for west siders and near west suburbanites even though both routes share the Rte 83 corridor of the Elk Grove Industrial area.   The 223 has high ridership because it also serves the Higgins Rd office complexes 

I took the 757 from HQ whenever I needed to go to the West Side (and when I lived in Wicker Park, there was no purpose for me to go to Forest Park). The route's market, as you've mentioned, is accurate: West Side folx don't have a connection to Elk Grove, Higgins, Rolling Meadows, and points north. Ridership was there on the North of Busse (but not as strong as the Busse Corridor). 223 obviously is important to get to the other side of the Airport, unsure if 490 would even change that.

On 2/10/2022 at 4:39 PM, BusHunter said:

Why not just take roosevelt to mannheim 

I miss the 747 as much as the next person, but that route was only as good as the 290 portions (and until BoS is provided, it's not worth the cost). 747 Drivers did take that, but everyone else had the same idea, and your arrival time to Forest Park for that (and the 757, which took Mannheim-Madison-Forest Park or North-Mannheim-Lake-5th-Madison-Forest Park) suffered.

On 2/10/2022 at 7:54 PM, Busjack said:

There was supposed to be a study of the Elgin-O'Hare (Ill. 390) corridor, which is where you appear to be heading.

Prepandemic, the 895 bypass was via I-88 and I-355 (not as direct as I-290 from the Tri-State).

Most of the rest is covered by the I-294 Tri-State Market & Facilities Feasibility Study,. The Summary Report appears to recommend in-line stations at 103rd/Harlem (with transit center to connect with 95th and Harlem Pulse lines), Cermak Toll Plaza (connects with Cermak Pulse and 301), O'Hare Oasis, and Meachem Rd. on I-90, with the Burr Ridge PNR being a transfer point between the I-55 and Tri-State routes.

The fly in the ointment, as I see it, is that the routes in the studied Harvey-Rosemont corridor were either suspended by the pandemic, or, in the case of 889 (Harvey-Rosemont), was spectacularly unsuccessful.

The agency wants feedback. I think it would make the case to make those routes stronger whenever they return.

On 2/10/2022 at 10:50 AM, NewFlyerMCI said:

Route 301 & 322 seem long on the map (and they are), but the ride seems so quick. But then you get off, and you've been on the bus for 40-50 minutes, but it just doesn't seem like it...

In other news, Yorktown Center needs some sort of express bus.

See above. 747 to 301 was like the 270 and the "Pulse Express Trips."

(Would it make sense to even combine 301 and 305 to OakBrook or Ardmore, and a revamped 747 (335x) to Wheaton?)