Why doesn't the Pink Line go counterclockwise on the Loop?

[Pink Jazz]

I was wondering, is there any particular reason why CTA chose to make the Pink Line go clockwise on the Loop like the Purple and Orange Lines, and not counterclockwise like the Brown Line? It would seem like counterclockwise would make more sense, as there would be two lines each going both directions. Or is there something I am missing?

[BusExpert32]

I was wondering, is there any particular reason why CTA chose to make the Pink Line go clockwise on the Loop like the Purple and Orange Lines, and not counterclockwise like the Brown Line? It would seem like counterclockwise would make more sense, as there would be two lines each going both directions. Or is there something I am missing?

The CTA made transfer to the Blue Line immediate as the Pink Line enters the loop. The Pink Line used to be a branch on the Blue Line and their was fuss over the inconvenience the change would make, so they made transfer to the Blue Line right as you enter the loop at Clark/Lake.

[Brandon93]

The CTA made transfer to the Blue Line immediate as the Pink Line enters the loop. The Pink Line used to be a branch on the Blue Line and their was fuss over the inconvenience the change would make, so they made transfer to the Blue Line right as you enter the loop at Clark/Lake.

That makes logical sense. I was wondering that too. With any service changes or cuts there's always going to be someone whining & complaining.

[rvwnsd]

That makes logical sense. I was wondering that too. With any service changes or cuts there's always going to be someone whining & complaining.

Although I agree with your statement about whining and complaining, in this case I understand the complaints. For nearly 50 years, the now Pink line had direct access to UIC and an easy transfer to the Illinois Medical District. That was lost when the Pink Line was routed to the Loop. However, the CTA could easily have closed the line altogether.

[jajuan]

Complaints or fusses aside, it seems another practical reason, and quite likely the real reason, would be the headways on the Brown Line during rush hour. Rush headways on the Brown Line are 3 to 7 minutes. On the Orange Line the headway is 10 minutes and Purple Express it's about 10 to 15 minutes. Plus Purple Line Express has no service middays or weekends, staying between Linden and Howard as the Purple Line Shuttle. So in short the clockwise direction seems to have been the less crowded direction before 54th/Cermak line was split from the Blue Line and routed onto the elevated tracks as the Pink Line. So I can see the brass at CTA deciding to have the Pink Line go clockwise instead of counterclockwise.

[briman94]

What about the Orange Line then? What if it went counter-clockwise? Or what if Cottage Grove-bound Green lines turned the corner after entering the loop and went along Wells/VanBuren (although, that might be a bit cumbersome to make all those turns)

[strictures]

What about the Orange Line then? What if it went counter-clockwise? Or what if Cottage Grove-bound Green lines turned the corner after entering the loop and went along Wells/Van Buren (although, that might be a bit cumbersome to make all those turns)

If the EB Green Line trains went that way, there wouldn't be a direct connection to the State of Illinois Center & the Pedway & it would be the only line adjacent to it without that connection.

There also wouldn't be any stops close to the State St. shopping.

[MetroShadow]

One logical conclusion: Keep it simple. The switches, the procedures, and the routing.

Keep in mind that you also had the Blue line run through the subway (albeit during the rush), which responded to the complaints of losing alternate service on the Douglas Branch (but was cancelled in 2008).

[MTRSP1900-CTA3200]

What about the Orange Line then? What if it went counter-clockwise?...

If the Orange Line went counterclockwise, it would have to put up with the short headways of the Brown Line, as jajuan pointed out.

Unfortunately, I believe that a train turning from westbound Lake to southbound Wells is one of the most disruptive moves that Tower 18 can do. With the current operation, no other trains would be able to move through the junction if a train is doing that move, unless an Orange Line train was also going clockwise at the time. Even with the current setup I can't think of an in service move that would disrupt other trains more than the Lake to Wells turn.

[Bflomike]

This is a question I've always had and never thought about the instant connection to the Blue Line which makes perfect sense so I can live with the Pink Line being clockwise.

However... To play a little devil's advocate I'll go ahead and share why I always thought the Pink Line should've been placed on the outer loop track with the Brown Line. At the other two entry points to the Loop, one can ride a train in either direction if they wanted to. For instance if a passenger is on a northbound Orange Line train, and wants to alight along Wabash and thinks changing to a Green at Roosevelt will be faster, they have that option. Then at The Mart, during rush hour, someone already on a Purple Express who wants to alight along Wells can change to the Brown Line if they wanted to. Passengers entering the Loop from the Lake Street lines don't have this option. Clark/Lake is first no matter what.

[MTRSP1900-CTA3200]

Giving a little more thought into this, I'm wondering how the Purple Line Express did when it ran counterclockwise during the Brown Line station work. ChicagoL.org says Purple Line Express headways were increased, but again, that doesn't account for the Brown Line.

[Busjack]

Giving a little more thought into this, I'm wondering how the Purple Line Express did when it ran counterclockwise during the Brown Line station work. ChicagoL.org says Purple Line Express headways were increased, but again, that doesn't account for the Brown Line.

If if you are referring to Three Track, the impression I got at the time is that, everything got cut back, because there wasn't the capacity to handle as many trains on 3 tracks as 4, and the Purple Line took the brunt of the cutback. Also, that didn't affect the direction in the Loop. But maybe you are referring to a different scenario, such as when the Loop track and signal projects were being done.

Do you have a link to the specific reference?

[MTRSP1900-CTA3200]

If if you are referring to Three Track, the impression I got at the time is that, everything got cut back, because there wasn't the capacity to handle as many trains on 3 tracks as 4, and the Purple Line took the brunt of the cutback. Also, that didn't affect the direction in the Loop. But maybe you are referring to a different scenario, such as when the Loop track and signal projects were being done.

Do you have a link to the specific reference?

Yeah, I read about the situation from the bottom of this page.

However, unlike you, I did not take into account that Brown Line trains themselves would be reduced in frequency at the time. Oops.

[Busjack]

This is a question I've always had and never thought about the instant connection to the Blue Line which makes perfect sense so I can live with the Pink Line being clockwise.

However... To play a little devil's advocate I'll go ahead and share why I always thought the Pink Line should've been placed on the outer loop track with the Brown Line. At the other two entry points to the Loop, one can ride a train in either direction if they wanted to. For instance if a passenger is on a northbound Orange Line train, and wants to alight along Wabash and thinks changing to a Green at Roosevelt will be faster, they have that option. Then at The Mart, during rush hour, someone already on a Purple Express who wants to alight along Wells can change to the Brown Line if they wanted to. Passengers entering the Loop from the Lake Street lines don't have this option. Clark/Lake is first no matter what.

The issue seems to be that with all the griping when the Pink Line was separated from the Blue (resulting in a once a half hour Cermak to O'Hare train for a short time, and unfounded complaints that it would take longer to get to Michigan Ave., even though Wabash was closer than Dearborn), that complaint never arose. Nobody suggested a Loop Shuttle as there was in the early 70s, to get people from the Wells side to the Lake-Dan Ryan at Clark and Lake. Maybe with all the complaining, the extra 7 minutes to ride around the Loop on the Pink wasn't a concern, especially since with only the Green and Orange on their current routes, only the rush hour Purple would provide a way to get from Wabash to Van Buren or Wells.

[Busjack]

Yeah, I read about the situation from the bottom of this page.

The first parts of that paragraph are consistent with what I said.The last sentence doesn't ring a bell, but would be possible if both the Brown and Purple schedules were cut back. The issue, of course would have been that there were fewer trains serving to Belmont, so they could have tried to make it less confusing for those passengers.

Other than that, the theory seems to be that Brown and Purple are split so that those getting on at Wabash or Lake use the Brown and those getting on at Van Buren or Wells use the Purple, if the destination is not beyond Belmont.

Lately, there was the single direction operation when the Orange Line train derailed.

[BusHunter]

The CTA made transfer to the Blue Line immediate as the Pink Line enters the loop. The Pink Line used to be a branch on the Blue Line and their was fuss over the inconvenience the change would make, so they made transfer to the Blue Line right as you enter the loop at Clark/Lake.

You know the west entrance to the Blue line's Clark/Lake subway station is not far from the Washington/Wells station. It seems no further than the Library/State Van Buren station to the south exit stairs to the Blue line Jackson station. Now they use that as a free transfer point, why don't they use Washington/Wells to Clark/Lake as another? Then they could feasibly have first and last station loop transfers.

[teck22]

Speaking of....

http://www.transitchicago.com/mobile/alertdetails.aspx?AlertId=26050

[Busjack]

Speaking of....

http://www.transitchicago.com/mobile/alertdetails.aspx?AlertId=26050

That's the problem with just posting the link. Once the alert is lifted, we only get the service restored one.

Obviously, though, it is preferable to get into the Loop in some manner than to short turn the trains at Clinton (even if they can).