Resumption of Pace routes and services

[Busjack]

On 5/18/2022 at 4:58 PM, Busjack said:

The Board meeting video included a discussion of VanGo, which appears to be a souped-up employment shuttle service. The reference to Lake County and later to Lake-Cook Road appear to me that the Shuttle Bug transit buses are not coming back.

An update on that, including this reference to the staff presentation, which started with "Prior to the pandemic, Pace operated Shuttle Bug commuter routes..."

Director Soto indicated that this would be a good fit in Lake Forest.

NOTE: The Call and Ride topic has been renamed to On Demand and VanGo, so discuss it there.

[Busjack]

Only thing significant on this front at the Planning/Infrastructure Meeting of June 29  is that while Route 696 is still suspended, there will be service on Route 697 between Harper College and NWTC. Also, there will be a modification of Route 565 to serve the Advanced Technology Center.

[MetroShadow]

On 7/3/2022 at 6:35 PM, Busjack said:

Only thing significant on this front at the Planning/Infrastructure Meeting of June 29  is that while Route 696 is still suspended, there will be service on Route 697 between Harper College and NWTC. Also, there will be a modification of Route 565 to serve the Advanced Technology Center.

A "presentation" will be discussed on 697 at the Board Meeting next week. 

Harper College is the main anchor of whatever love child came out of 690, 696, and 699 after the recession cuts of 2010.

[Busjack]

12 minutes ago, MetroShadow said:

A "presentation" will be discussed on 697 at the Board Meeting next week. 

Harper College is the main anchor of whatever love child came out of 690, 696, and 699 after the recession cuts of 2010.

696 and 699 are correct. Using Chicago Transit and Railfan to refresh my recollection, 690 bit the dust at about the same time, but only ran between Arlington Heights Metra and Buffalo Grove via Arlington Heights Road.

 

[Tcmetro]

Here's the new 697 schedule:

https://www.pacebus.com/route/697

 

Found through a search as I noticed Pace has started putting out alerts for the changing schedules.

[renardo870]

Regarding the 19 Pace routes that had service reductions due to the Covid-19 pandemic, are there any discussions to fully restore some or all the routes by the next pick?

[Railguy]

Driving Innovation  innititatives include service restructuring of low performing services.  I doubt these services will return im their previous format if ever.

[Railguy]

My guess izsCorridor services would most likely see service increases 

[Busjack]

12 hours ago, Railguy said:

My guess izsCorridor services would most likely see service increases 

Except for something like 887, 888, 895, they were never cut. Feds gave CTA and Pace money to keep service running. What was cut was service relating to offices and Metra.

[Busjack]

13 hours ago, renardo870 said:

Regarding the 19 Pace routes that had service reductions due to the Covid-19 pandemic, are there any discussions to fully restore some or all the routes by the next pick?

All indications at the board meetings are that feeders are not coming back. Pace and Metra do not want to subsidize them.  See the On Demand and VanGo topic.

[renardo870]

22 minutes ago, Busjack said:

All indications at the board meetings are that feeders are not coming back. Pace and Metra do not want to subsidize them.  See the On Demand and VanGo topic.

I wasn't referring to the Metra feeder routes or routes like 327, 355, 372, etc. I figured that they may be restructured at best. I was referring to  the 19 existing routes that had some runs cut like Pulse Milwaukee, 364, 850, 851, 855, etc.

[Busjack]

2 hours ago, renardo870 said:

I wasn't referring to the Metra feeder routes or routes like 327, 355, 372, etc. I figured that they may be restructured at best. I was referring to  the 19 existing routes that had some runs cut like Pulse Milwaukee, 364, 850, 851, 855, etc.

In short. the question should have been if any frequencies will be restored.

[renardo870]

1 hour ago, Busjack said:

In short. the question should have been if any frequencies will be restored.

In a nutshell, that's what I was trying to convey. Thanks, Busjack. ???‍♂️

[artthouwill]

4 hours ago, Busjack said:

Except for something like 887, 888, 895, they were never cut. Feds gave CTA and Pace money to keep service running. What was cut was service relating to offices and Metra.

The signs are still up for the 877 and 888 in yhe Oak Brook and Lombard areas,  though I haven't seen either route operating yet.

[Busjack]

Only thing new in the Sept. meeting budget presentation is that the suspended routes are being zeroed out.

[MetroShadow]

4 hours ago, Busjack said:

Only thing new in the Sept. meeting budget presentation is that the suspended routes are being zeroed out.

I presume that means they're discontinued and ain't coming back? 

[rotjohns]

5 hours ago, MetroShadow said:

I presume that means they're discontinued and ain't coming back? 

If that's the case, they need to take the bus stop signs down.  

[artthouwill]

23 minutes ago, rotjohns said:

If that's the case, they need to take the bus stop signs down.  

I'm sure they will eventually or tape over the eliminated routes if it shares a bus stop with an existing route.  But they have to have the public hearings first and, since its a budget plan, it has to be approved by the RTA. 

[Busjack]

8 hours ago, MetroShadow said:

I presume that means they're discontinued and ain't coming back? 

Yesm that's what they said. Resources are going into other services..

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

I'm sure they will eventually or tape over the eliminated routes if it shares a bus stop with an existing route.  But they have to have the public hearings first and, since its a budget plan, it has to be approved by the RTA. 

Actually, the hearing on the 2022 budget took care of the suspensions, and if this needs a hearing, the hearings on the 2023 budget also will suffice. RTA only determines if the budget is balanced. Each service board has the right to set its own level of service.

[artthouwill]

2 hours ago, Busjack said:

Actually, the hearing on the 2022 budget took care of the suspensions, and if this needs a hearing, the hearings on the 2023 budget also will suffice. RTA only determines if the budget is balanced. Each service board has the right to set its own level of service.

Basically it's what I am saying.   Pace is required to have a hearing in regards to service cuts.  It's just folded into a budget hearing so they're killing two birds with one stone.   RTA is only concerned about it balanced budget 

[renardo870]

On 9/22/2022 at 12:03 PM, artthouwill said:

Basically it's what I am saying.   Pace is required to have a hearing in regards to service cuts.  It's just folded into a budget hearing so they're killing two birds with one stone.   RTA is only concerned about it balanced budget 

I'm surprised that Pace would just discontinue all of the suspended routes and not even attempt a restructuring of some of the routes Metra Feeder routes in particular. I'm aware of the Lake County TMA routes not returning, but none of the BSNF feeders, that crazy. I'm surprised that a few routes couldn't be salvaged and restructured to operate during peak hours. I'm sure everyone isn't working from home and more people have returned to the office. Is there something on play down the line as ridership increases?

[artthouwill]

2 hours ago, renardo870 said:

I'm surprised that Pace would just discontinue all of the suspended routes and not even attempt a restructuring of some of the routes Metra Feeder routes in particular. I'm aware of the Lake County TMA routes not returning, but none of the BSNF feeders, that crazy. I'm surprised that a few routes couldn't be salvaged and restructured to operate during peak hours. I'm sure everyone isn't working from home and more people have returned to the office. Is there something on play down the line as ridership increases?

It's not in the budget to staff and operate these routes yjst already haven't been operating,  so eliminating them makes perfect sense 

  That doesn't mean that some routes can't possibly return in a restructured way.  Take 327 for instance.   Pace could easily take one 318 trip and extend it to replace the 327 or remove the route  and interline with the 318 or one of the Madison routes if there's enough demand for it.  The 995 or some other form of it may come when the stations for I 294 service are built when the TriState rebuild is complete.   That also might include some form of the 877 and 888

If Metra feeders aren't subsidized by Metra. I don't see any of them coming back

 

[Busjack]

3 hours ago, renardo870 said:

I'm surprised that Pace would just discontinue all of the suspended routes and not even attempt a restructuring of some of the routes Metra Feeder routes in particular. I'm aware of the Lake County TMA routes not returning, but none of the BSNF feeders, that crazy. I'm surprised that a few routes couldn't be salvaged and restructured to operate during peak hours. I'm sure everyone isn't working from home and more people have returned to the office. Is there something on play down the line as ridership increases?

 

1 hour ago, artthouwill said:

It's not in the budget to staff and operate these routes yjst already haven't been operating,  so eliminating them makes perfect sense 

  That doesn't mean that some routes can't possibly return in a restructured way.  Take 327 for instance.   Pace could easily take one 318 trip and extend it to replace the 327 or remove the route  and interline with the 318 or one of the Madison routes if there's enough demand for it.  The 995 or some other form of it may come when the stations for I 294 service are built when the TriState rebuild is complete.   That also might include some form of the 877 and 888

If Metra feeders aren't subsidized by Metra. I don't see any of them coming back

 

@artthouwill pretty well summed it up. The on;y justification for the feeders was that the parking lots, especially in Naperville and Lisle, were full, and if they are not full, Metra will not subsidize the feeders. The demand is thus easy to ascertain. Pace put in the expanded On Demand in Naperville, and expanded TNCs in Du Page County.

But, @artthouwill, similarly, 327 isn't coming back unless the employer subsidizes it.

If there is any restructuring, it will be like the proposed NS one, i.e. more cuts, like doing away with fixed route service in areas of Glenview and Northbrook.

[andrethebusman]

RTA had to clean house once before in 1982. They overexpanded 1977-81 and it bankrupted them. There has to be an actual need for a route, not some nebulous "build it and they will come". After two years, the reality that the suspended routes were no longer needed has been recognized.

 The sad part is that the North Shore realignment was probably a good idea at the time it was planned, and would still be good if it had been implemented, the fact it wasn't now means all new ideas will be proposed at some point.