The Breakdown Thread

[sw4400]

On today's fail bus of the day... 1322 on Damen NB. Bus has steady alert tone and keeps breaking down. Once in the middle of the street and once at a stop. Started on the 1st try in the middle of the street and took three when curbed.

[i8itall4u]

Traveling sb on the Ryan at 65th around 430 pm yesterday, I saw ahead to the left, smoke rising from what looked like a house fire. At 68th, I discovered it was a 40 ft New Flyer sb on State going slowly and billowing thick black smoke from the roof exhaust, like an old train engine. Going back as far as the old GM 100s-300s, I have never seen a bus smoking that much. My thought was; why would supervision/control have the operator try to pull the bus in?

[sw4400]

Traveling sb on the Ryan at 65th around 430 pm yesterday, I saw ahead to the left, smoke rising from what looked like a house fire. At 68th, I discovered it was a 40 ft New Flyer sb on State going slowly and billowing thick black smoke from the roof exhaust, like an old train engine. Going back as far as the old GM 100s-300s, I have never seen a bus smoking that much. My thought was; why would supervision/control have the operator try to pull the bus in?

I bet it was a Cummins ISL model(1630-2029). Something about those engines... they put out a lot of black smoke, but it sounds like this one might've blown it's turbo(or something else) if there was that much smoke coming out the exhaust pipe. I'm sure it wasn't the beginning of an engine fire or the smoke would've been pouring out the back vents of the bus, engine hood or sides w/ flames possibly.

[jajuan]

I bet it was a Cummins ISL model(1630-2029). Something about those engines... they put out a lot of black smoke, but it sounds like this one might've blown it's turbo(or something else) if there was that much smoke coming out the exhaust pipe. I'm sure it wasn't the beginning of an engine fire or the smoke would've been pouring out the back vents of the bus, engine hood or sides w/ flames possibly.

It's not necessarily true that it was a Cummins ISL because with the bus being an apparent 29, I can tell you that older model NFs numbering 10xx from 103rd have been known to give off a lot of exhaust like he described as well.

[BusHunter]

It's not necessarily true that it was a Cummins ISL because with the bus being an apparent 29, I can tell you that older model NFs numbering 10xx from 103rd have been known to give off a lot of exhaust like he described as well.

I know the #4000's have a problem with smoking exhausts. But the smoke comes up from under the tail of the bus. One bus last week, #4165 was so bad the driver parked it at State/Monroe (just south of there) But there have been others like a bus in the #4180's the week before. Seems so far like it's mostly NP buses. Maybe they have too many artics to maintain.

[jajuan]

Don't get me started again about NP being over stacked in artics. I made that point when the number first approached 120 but some wanted to press how garage rehabs haven't started yet when my overall point clearly was that they could have been making use of 77th long before this month as at the time they bumped NP's artic count to about 130 or so, it wasn't being used.

[Sam92]

I know the #4000's have a problem with smoking exhausts. But the smoke comes up from under the tail of the bus. One bus last week, #4165 was so bad the driver parked it at State/Monroe (just south of there) But there have been others like a bus in the #4180's the week before. Seems so far like it's mostly NP buses. Maybe they have too many artics to maintain.

I know some #4060's have that problem from when they were at 103rd really bad. Kinda contradicts the Clean Air Hybrid Bus label if you ask me :lol:

[Sam92]

I know the #4000's have a problem with smoking exhausts. But the smoke comes up from under the tail of the bus. One bus last week, #4165 was so bad the driver parked it at State/Monroe (just south of there) But there have been others like a bus in the #4180's the week before. Seems so far like it's mostly NP buses. Maybe they have too many artics to maintain.

I think thats 4181 you saw. I remember watching it come down Balbo to pull into the Congress plaza terminal and seen clouds of smoke. Not to mention VERY noisy inside and out when I rode it.

[sw4400]

Don't get me started again about NP being over stacked in artics. I made that point when the number first approached 120 but some wanted to press how garage rehabs haven't started yet when my overall point clearly was that they could have been making use of 77th long before this month as at the time they bumped NP's artic count to about 130 or so, it wasn't being used.

Somewhere in one of the threads, a point was made about 77th not having any artic-assigned routes. That was the sticking point until recently as to why there were no articulated buses there. I don't remember the thread or who or whom posted about it, but I do remember that brought up. As far as the overrun of artics at North Park, I can only surmise this as the reason:

• X98 Avon Express (reported recently to be assigned to Forest Glen and be non-artic. Route had artics when assigned to North Park)
• 22 Clark
• 36 Broadway(not sure if artics ever run this route, but I think it's busy enough for one or two)
• 50 Damen
• 56 Milwaukee(marked as shared with Forest Glen. This route would definately require artics, IMO)
• 135 Clarendon/LaSalle Express
• 136 Sheridan/LaSalle Express
• 146 Inner Drive/Michigan Express
• 147 Outer Drive Express
• 148 Clarendon/Michigan Express
• 152 Addison(shared with Forest Glen. Uses artics for school arrival/dismissal)
• 154 Wrigley Field Express
• "L" Shuttles(North Park might be the garage that assigns Shuttle Buses for "L" Service during Service Disruptions throughout most of the city. Green Line, Pink Line, and Red and Blue Line service south of the Subways might be supplied by Kedzie or 77th)

Blue= Routes that use artics

Orange= Routes that could use artics based on ridership

Gray= Routes that did use artics but are not anymore or being transferred to another garage

So that's ten routes that use artics and two maybes with the X98 being transitioned to Forest Glen. 12 total routes*. That might be the most artic-assigned routes at any artic-capable garage to this point.

*=Presuming the "Maybe" routes do use artics.

[Busjack]

...

• 56 Milwaukee(marked as shared with Forest Glen. This route would definately require artics, IMO)
• ...

Orange= Routes that could use artics based on ridership

IMO, so long as 56 is parallel to the Blue Line, there is no justification for artics there. Jan. 2013 Ridership report of 10,280 weekday doesn't justify it either (compared to 4 of 22,000 or 79 of 29,000, for instance).

[BusHunter]

Somewhere in one of the threads, a point was made about 77th not having any artic-assigned routes. That was the sticking point until recently as to why there were no articulated buses there. I don't remember the thread or who or whom posted about it, but I do remember that brought up. As far as the overrun of artics at North Park, I can only surmise this as the reason:

• X98 Avon Express (reported recently to be assigned to Forest Glen and be non-artic. Route had artics when assigned to North Park)
• 22 Clark
• 36 Broadway(not sure if artics ever run this route, but I think it's busy enough for one or two)
• 50 Damen
• 56 Milwaukee(marked as shared with Forest Glen. This route would definately require artics, IMO)
• 135 Clarendon/LaSalle Express
• 136 Sheridan/LaSalle Express
• 146 Inner Drive/Michigan Express
• 147 Outer Drive Express
• 148 Clarendon/Michigan Express
• 152 Addison(shared with Forest Glen. Uses artics for school arrival/dismissal)
• 154 Wrigley Field Express
• "L" Shuttles(North Park might be the garage that assigns Shuttle Buses for "L" Service during Service Disruptions throughout most of the city. Green Line, Pink Line, and Red and Blue Line service south of the Subways might be supplied by Kedzie or 77th)

Blue= Routes that use artics

Orange= Routes that could use artics based on ridership

Gray= Routes that did use artics but are not anymore or being transferred to another garage

So that's ten routes that use artics and two maybes with the X98 being transitioned to Forest Glen. 12 total routes*. That might be the most artic-assigned routes at any artic-capable garage to this point.

*=Presuming the "Maybe" routes do use artics.

Even now, 77th is not assigning artics on the weekend (so far) so these buses are typically only going to be used during the week. I don't know if 77th is going to use that many artics, ( I don't see them using 35 artics, without the #6 route) especially after the Ryan project is over. I see some of those heading to NP after the Ryan project is over.

[jajuan]

Somewhere in one of the threads, a point was made about 77th not having any artic-assigned routes. That was the sticking point until recently as to why there were no articulated buses there. I don't remember the thread or who or whom posted about it, but I do remember that brought up. As far as the overrun of artics at North Park, I can only surmise this as the reason:

• X98 Avon Express (reported recently to be assigned to Forest Glen and be non-artic. Route had artics when assigned to North Park)
• 22 Clark
• 36 Broadway(not sure if artics ever run this route, but I think it's busy enough for one or two)
• 50 Damen
• 56 Milwaukee(marked as shared with Forest Glen. This route would definately require artics, IMO)
• 135 Clarendon/LaSalle Express
• 136 Sheridan/LaSalle Express
• 146 Inner Drive/Michigan Express
• 147 Outer Drive Express
• 148 Clarendon/Michigan Express
• 152 Addison(shared with Forest Glen. Uses artics for school arrival/dismissal)
• 154 Wrigley Field Express
• "L" Shuttles(North Park might be the garage that assigns Shuttle Buses for "L" Service during Service Disruptions throughout most of the city. Green Line, Pink Line, and Red and Blue Line service south of the Subways might be supplied by Kedzie or 77th)

Blue= Routes that use artics

Orange= Routes that could use artics based on ridership

Gray= Routes that did use artics but are not anymore or being transferred to another garage

So that's ten routes that use artics and two maybes with the X98 being transitioned to Forest Glen. 12 total routes*. That might be the most artic-assigned routes at any artic-capable garage to this point.

*=Presuming the "Maybe" routes do use artics.

148 uses them to a large degree for the PM rush. I live a couple blocks north of the 50's north terminus and can tell you an artic on there now is rare. The improved intervals between buses on the 135, 136, 146, and 147 have worked out in a way that one might see a 1000 on each of those more often than was the case before December 16th because artics would be seen running half empty. You especially see more 40 footers for all during the AM rush times and 146 and sometimes 147 in midday. I know the weekday short trips see 40 footers quite regularly. So CTA is pushing it with having that garage stacked with 130 some odd artics. And it definitely does NOT need to take on more if 77th were to give up some after the Dan Ryan project, something I would find rather dumb if the 4 and 79 are making good use of them after several of us have observed they could be used regardless of 77th not having the 6. The 6 was not the only heavy route at the garage. Let's start being real on that

[sw4400]

And it definitely does NOT need to take on more if 77th were to give up some after the Dan Ryan project, something I would find rather dumb if the 4 and 79 are making good use of them after several of us have observed they could be used regardless of 77th not having the 6. The 6 was not the only heavy route at the garage. Let's start being real on that

Well they have to be moved somewhere if they don't remain at 77th following the Red Line Dan Ryan project. North Park, Kedzie and 103rd are the only other artic-capable garages until 2015-2016 at the earliest. You can't put artics at garages where they can't house or service them currently.

[Busjack]

Well they have to be moved somewhere if they don't remain at 77th following the Red Line Dan Ryan project. North Park, Kedzie and 103rd are the only other artic-capable garages until 2015-2016 at the earliest. You can't put artics at garages where they can't house or service them currently.

Besides your "if," I discussed this today in the Garage Rehab thread, including that some maintenance is already starting.

While BusHunter made an attempt to quantify how many 77th would keep, I don't think you have. Maybe you can figure out how many buses now run on 3, 4, 79, and 87, and then estimate if there are enough artics to provide base coverage.

But you only provided 2 potential additions to NP, one of which I questioned. So, unless NP is going to start running 9 or 49 to the exclusion of 74th....it doesn't need additional articulated buses.

[BusHunter]

Somewhere in one of the threads, a point was made about 77th not having any artic-assigned routes. That was the sticking point until recently as to why there were no articulated buses there. I don't remember the thread or who or whom posted about it, but I do remember that brought up. As far as the overrun of artics at North Park, I can only surmise this as the reason:

• X98 Avon Express (reported recently to be assigned to Forest Glen and be non-artic. Route had artics when assigned to North Park)
• 22 Clark
• 36 Broadway(not sure if artics ever run this route, but I think it's busy enough for one or two)
• 50 Damen
• 56 Milwaukee(marked as shared with Forest Glen. This route would definately require artics, IMO)
• 135 Clarendon/LaSalle Express
• 136 Sheridan/LaSalle Express
• 146 Inner Drive/Michigan Express
• 147 Outer Drive Express
• 148 Clarendon/Michigan Express
• 152 Addison(shared with Forest Glen. Uses artics for school arrival/dismissal)
• 154 Wrigley Field Express
• "L" Shuttles(North Park might be the garage that assigns Shuttle Buses for "L" Service during Service Disruptions throughout most of the city. Green Line, Pink Line, and Red and Blue Line service south of the Subways might be supplied by Kedzie or 77th)

Blue= Routes that use artics

Orange= Routes that could use artics based on ridership

Gray= Routes that did use artics but are not anymore or being transferred to another garage

So that's ten routes that use artics and two maybes with the X98 being transitioned to Forest Glen. 12 total routes*. That might be the most artic-assigned routes at any artic-capable garage to this point.

*=Presuming the "Maybe" routes do use artics.

I'm still seeing artics on the #37 even though the Wells Street bridge project is over; also they run artics on pretty much all the #125's.

[sw4400]

Besides your "if," I discussed this today in the Garage Rehab thread, including that some maintenance is already starting.

While BusHunter made an attempt to quantify how many 77th would keep, I don't think you have. Maybe you can figure out how many buses now run on 3, 4, 79, and 87, and then estimate if there are enough artics to provide base coverage.

But you only provided 2 potential additions to NP, one of which I questioned. So, unless NP is going to start running 9 or 49 to the exclusion of 74th....it doesn't need additional articulated buses.

I couldn't throw out a number as I don't know what will happen to the artics at 77th when the Dan Ryan Red Line project is done. They might keep all that are assigned or have some or all sent to other garages. Only thing to clarify is until garage rehabs are done, NP, K and 1 are the only other artic-capable garages. BusHunter reported here that FG is getting it's hoists rebuilt, so maybe artics might find their way there in the future.

There must be enough routes to require articulated buses at 77th. I don't think they just started putting them there just for the Red Line project, which doesn't begin until May anyway. They could've put them there in late April then and just park them until the shutdown if that was the case.

[jajuan]

So apparently you now get the point I and others have made for months that they can't keep acting like they only have three artic ready garages when all the while they actually have FOUR. North Park does not need more. Some of us have discussed in the 4300 thread that folks keep forgetting 77th does have 3,4,79, and 79 as well as the addition of the 8 from the last pick that qualify for some form of artic use as Busjack implied above in this thread. So it's probably well past time to quit suggesting that NP be stacked beyond the 130 plus that's already pushing it because of garage rehabs not being complete.

[jajuan]

I'm still seeing artics on the #37 even though the Wells Street bridge project is over; also they run artics on pretty much all the #125's.

Yeah looks like Kedzie getting 4300s has them bumping artics use back up on 125. Plus I think the artic use remaining on the 37 is mainly in rush hour because in midday a 1000 on that route is lucky to see more than five passengers during a complete trip of the entire route. So an artic definitely isn't needed at that time of day.

[sw4400]

#6420 was involved in an accident on the #52A route early this morning, causing it to smash into a building. Damage doesn't look too bad, though I wonder if the CTA will repair it to put it back on the road or just retire it since retirements should be starting in the next year or so.

Story

[Busjack]

#6420 was involved in an accident on the #52A route early this morning, causing it to smash into a building. Damage doesn't look too bad, though I wonder if the CTA will repair it to put it back on the road or just retire it since retirements should be starting in the next year or so.

Story

Put your bets on either:

• That is (at least theoretically, although I doubt it) one of the oldest ones.
• Based on Nova's representations since about 1998 (note the picture with the really old school windows), the van hit one of the resilient rocker panels and did little or no damage. On the current page: "Most Nova Bus skirt panels can be replaced in under five minutes without bodywork, special training or tooling – just another exclusive feature to help your bus get back on track in no time after a minor side impact."

I'm putting my money on the latter. Update: But I might have put too much into the presence of the van and not enough into "it hit the building."

[BusHunter]

#6420 was involved in an accident on the #52A route early this morning, causing it to smash into a building. Damage doesn't look too bad, though I wonder if the CTA will repair it to put it back on the road or just retire it since retirements should be starting in the next year or so.

Story

It's most likely gone unless it tapped the building. Being one of the oldest Novas, it will probably be retired anyway after October.

[qwantae]

Last Night, when I drove On Harlem (On my way home) through Palos Park and I saw an Eldorado #2817 driving northbound on Harlem at 127th around 12:30am, I was wondering where was it coming from that late at night either been sitting breakdown for hours from doing 386 or just being long test driving.

[jajuan]

Kedzie's NF #1354 at Roosevelt and Ashland WB. It was working the 12 Roosevelt. CTA wrecker #250 towed it back to Kedzie Garage just before I boarded a NB 9 Ashland this morning at approximately 9:20 AM.

[sw4400]

I wonder how long this bus will be out. It's a 4300-Series DE60LFR as indicated by the roof fins. Hopefully it's not 4319, otherwise that bus is clearly jinxed...

Bus vs. Dump Truck

[cta5658]

I wonder how long this bus will be out. It's a 4300-Series DE60LFR as indicated by the roof fins. Hopefully it's not 4319, otherwise that bus is clearly jinxed...

Bus vs. Dump Truck

It's #4323