Busjack Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I agree all garages do have rough routes but I'm saying some more than others. Most of 74th are in the englewood neighborhood and trust me it's rough over there and I should know Growing up in englewood there and riding the routes as much as I did as a kid that's all I'm saying. But of course we'll definitely find out once the 7900's start to arrive but I'm sticking with 74th being the 1st to get them. On the rough routes, 103 gets Roseland (Blair Holt shooting), 77 essentially has Auburn-Gresham, and as I noted the El Kabonging of a driver was on Roosevelt. My long route point was, in this context, that at one time I was surprised to see the same buses in Hyde Park, Englewood, and the Midway Airport area, but that's what you get when the E-W lines go continuously from Jackson Park to Cicero Ave. The only point of this speculation is whether one wants to bet that the 300 Novas are really going only to FG and 74. I wouldn't, but I don't think any are going to K, P, or 103. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Ok time to calm down sir. I think you're taking the whole thing WAAAAYYYYY too seriously there. Nobody said 74th buses were going through the war zone of World War III, but you still have to be real that Englewood is not exactly a worry free paradise. I agree all garages do have rough routes but I'm saying some more than others. Most of 74th are in the englewood neighborhood and trust me it's rough over there and I should know Growing up in englewood there and riding the routes as much as I did as a kid that's all I'm saying. But of course we'll definitely find out once the 7900's start to arrive but I'm sticking with 74th being the 1st to get them. I used to live in Englewood myself but y'all can't just flat out say that it's the worst neighborhood when it comes to bus routes going through that neighborhood. That's just somewhat biased. I'm not mad about this but a little bit disappointed. On the rough routes, 103 gets Roseland (Blair Holt shooting), 77 essentially has Auburn-Gresham, and as I noted the El Kabonging of a driver was on Roosevelt. My long route point was, in this context, that at one time I was surprised to see the same buses in Hyde Park, Englewood, and the Midway Airport area, but that's what you get when the E-W lines go continuously from Jackson Park to Cicero Ave. The only point of this speculation is whether one wants to bet that the 300 Novas are really going only to FG and 74. I wouldn't, but I don't think any are going to K, P, or 103. Thank you!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Seriously Garmon? What bias? I had family pretty much next to the above mentioned Roseland growing up within walking distance of where young Blair Holt got shot and depending on the route taken often passed through Englewood to get to their homes. And sorry to say it was and is a rough neighborhood. There is no getting around that. If you want to go by the numbers of violent crimes, Austin would would probably be the spot to make an operator from K and C leery. It also happens to be their westernmost edge of covered territory. By virtue of 74th running two of the longest routes in the system, they have operators going through the Rockwell Gardens area, Back of the Yards, Englewood, West Englewood and Auburn Gresham which can be potential hot spots. Notice one of those is on the West Side. All of those are relatively worse than what K and C operators have to deal with which was my original point before your tirade. Yeah I mentioned Englewood as a potential hot spot but I challenge you to point to where I said it was the worst in the city. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Seriously Garmon? What bias? I had family pretty much next to the above mentioned Roseland growing up within waljibg distance of where young Blair Holt got shot and depending on the route taken often passed through Englewood to get to their homes. And sorry to say it was and is a rough neighborhood. There is no getting around that. If you want to go by the numbers of violent crimes, Austin would would probably be the spot to make an operator from K and C leery. It also happens to be their westernmost edge of covered territory. By virtue of 74th running two of the longest routrs in the system, they have operators going through the Rockwell Gardens area, Back of the Yards, Englewood, West Englewood and Auburn Gresham which can be potential hot spots. Notice one of those is on the West Side. All of those are relatively worse thsn what K and C oprrators gave to deal with which was my origibal point before your tirade. Yeah I mentioned Englewood as a potential hot spot but u challenge you to point to where I said it was the worst in the city. Ok I respect your opinions about this but anyway it goes all garages are going to deal with some troubled neighborhoods no matter what the circumstances are. You mentioned the Austin neighborhood but it's not just Kedzie and Chicago operators can be leery. Some operators from Forest Glen (#85 and #91) can be leery also. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to get personal with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Ok I respect your opinions about this but anyway it goes all garages are going to deal with some troubled neighborhoods no matter what the circumstances are. You mentioned the Austin neighborhood but it's not just Kedzie and Chicago operators can be leery. Some operators from Forest Glen (#85 and #91) can be leery also. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to get personal with you. True and FG now has practically no buses with a shield for the time being, but the whole the thing was never even a west side vs south side thing as you took it to be is my point. Mr. Cta85 made a point that 74th would appreciate the upgraded shields since he thinks they're first for 7900s they do have rougher routes to drive to which Busjack mentioned he thought K probably had a rougher time in light of the operator who got attacked last year. And for the reasons I now clarified for you my response was no 74th probably still has it rougher than K. So you were a bit quick to get upset and make assumptions about what you thought my point was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 True and FG now has practically no buses with a shield for the time being, but the whole the thing was never even a west side vs south side thing as you took it to be is my point. Mr. Cta85 made a point that 74th would appreciate the upgraded shields since he thinks they're first for 7900s they do have rougher routes to drive to which Busjack mentioned he thought K probably had a rougher time in light of the operator who got attacked last year. And for the reasons I now clarified for you my response was no 74th probably still has it rougher than K. So you were a bit quick to get upset and make assumptions about what you thought my point was. And I will indeed not deny that I did went out of myself by jumping to conclusions. My apology. I wasn't trying to make it as a south/west side story but it's all good. No big deal. My concern is, what if 74th don't get the 7900s? I like all of y'all hypothesis about them but were they ordered for safety concerns or to reduce the aging fleet? Down this road, the intensity about them is going to be extremely high in which I'm cool with it but let's not get too hasty about them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 And I will indeed not deny that I did went out of myself by jumping to conclusions. My apology. I wasn't trying to make it as a south/west side story but it's all good. No big deal. My concern is, what if 74th don't get the 7900s? I like all of y'all hypothesis about them but were they ordered for safety concerns or to reduce the aging fleet? Down this road, the intensity about them is going to be extremely high in which I'm cool with it but let's not get too hasty about them. To be honest my thought is more let's wait and see, but some of the moves fit what others have postulated. I agree with you though that they shouldn't get too crazy going after 74th's NFs because it brings up the same thoughts as when they stacked that garage with nothing but 6000s, namely why are the 74th service areas being served by the older raggedy buses when other areas' buses are in better condition. As is even before this past weekend's swaps, the 44, 48, 75 and 94 got run with all or mostly Novas during weekdays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 More Novas for 74th and FG this morning. #6411 is on the #55A. and #6489 is on I believe the #78. Also the #78 has a few #1080's, so Fg still has NF's barely. Still trying to figure out what happened to #1090 or #6471-76. #6470 is still at 77th. Fg is still short about 7 buses, so I wouldn't doubt they turn up there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 More Novas for 74th and FG this morning. #6411 is on the #55A. and #6489 is on I believe the #78. Also the #78 has a few #1080's, so Fg still has NF's barely. Still trying to figure out what happened to #1090 or #6471-76. #6470 is still at 77th. Fg is still short about 7 buses, so I wouldn't doubt they turn up there. You can add #6853 to Forest Glen. It's operating on #81 right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 To be honest my thought is more let's wait and see, but some of the moves fit what others have postulated. I agree with you though that they shouldn't get too crazy going after 74th's NFs because it brings up the same thoughts as when they stacked that garage with nothing but 6000s, namely why are the 74th service areas being served by the older raggedy buses when other areas' buses are in better condition. As is even before this past weekend's swaps, the 44, 48, 75 and 94 got run with all or mostly Novas during weekdays. That's true. I couldn't say it any better than you did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 Maybe is because 77th doesn't want the oldest New Flyers. I don't think that the garage gets any choice; some suit at 567 does. Also, the way Claypool is quoted in press releases, a rehabbed bus is a new bus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 And I will indeed not deny that I did went out of myself by jumping to conclusions. My apology. I wasn't trying to make it as a south/west side story but it's all good. No big deal. My concern is, what if 74th don't get the 7900s? I like all of y'all hypothesis about them but were they ordered for safety concerns or to reduce the aging fleet? Down this road, the intensity about them is going to be extremely high in which I'm cool with it but let's not get too hasty about them. I'm going to add my two cents on just the part I highlighted.... garmon, when the CTA first installed the protective screens on the New Flyers, that was done in-house either by CTA directly or a third-party company, so those screens were not part of the bus to begin with. New Flyer installed what I call "shoulder guards" starting with the 1760's(I doubt their bases still exist... I put a photo up somewhere on the forum... maybe I can find it sometime and upload it here). The 4000's continued with the third-party screens... I haven't rode the 4300's or 4333's, so I can't say what they have. This is a protective screen that Nova offers for their buses, I'm sure that is made by them and looks way more advanced and protective than the third-party ones on the New Flyers. The only thing I honestly dislike about those protective guards is what if a driver has a medical emergency? Yeah, I know... I'm going back into "Speed" scenario here... but if a quick thinking passenger can get to the controls, get the driver's foot off the accelerator and use the brake to stop the bus or steer it away from any possible dangers(like say a viaduct support beam) that could save the lives of the driver and passengers. There's always pros and cons to everything... there isn't many cons for the protective guards on any bus, but this con is a rather big one, IMO... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 What's kind of strange about this whole order is the Novas come with these tank like security doors and shields yet they will most likely being going to Fg, one of the safest garages in the system. Now they will be served well by 74th, but alot of other garages could use the extra security, so if no shields worked all this long at FG, maybe the NF's at Fg would have been the better choice. Really the buses need to go in more places than 2 or 3 garages because once again you have new equipment sitting at the garage while the higher mileage buses are working hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted March 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 What's kind of strange about this whole order is the Novas come with these tank like security doors and shields yet they will most likely being going to Fg, one of the safest garages in the system. Now they will be served well by 74th, but alot of other garages could use the extra security, so if no shields worked all this long at FG, maybe the NF's at Fg would have been the better choice. Really the buses need to go in more places than 2 or 3 garages because once again you have new equipment sitting at the garage while the higher mileage buses are working hard. What's wrong with the New Flyer screens? They were installed for that purpose and the only thing I heard is the drivers dislike using any screens, Nova or otherwise and now they must or face disciplinary action. The screens installed by Nova probably come included with the price of the bus. If the CTA were to omit them just to install the screens seen on the New Flyers, they would have to outsource to that same third-party company to supply the parts or do the installation of them, which means additional contract and $$. You're forgetting that these engines are getting rehabbed/rebuilt... the New Flyers are becoming a "Like New" Bus Fleet. Do they still have high miles, yes... but major components have been replaced/rebuilt to extend the life of the bus powertrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 What's wrong with the New Flyer screens? They were installed for that purpose and the only thing I heard is the drivers dislike using any screens, Nova or otherwise and now they must or face disciplinary action. You're forgetting that these engines are getting rehabbed/rebuilt... the New Flyers are becoming a "Like New" Bus Fleet. Do they still have high miles, yes... but major components have been replaced to lengthen the life of the bus powertrain. One driver told me it makes them claustrophobic to use the shield, they they prefer novas as there bus of choice, plus they make the point of it's hard to communicate with riders behind a screen which is true. I have to admit I'm less likely to talk to an operator behind a shield, it's just less friendly. Maybe that's what CTA wants though. In the case of an emergency if you need to stop a bus you can always pull the cherry, it will stop the bus. They wouldn't have that except they had people trapped in the streetcar fire in the 50's and people died from that. That was the positive that came out of that tragedy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 3, 2014 Report Share Posted March 3, 2014 I'm going to add my two cents on just the part I highlighted.... garmon, when the CTA first installed the protective screens on the New Flyers, that was done in-house either by CTA directly or a third-party company, so those screens were not part of the bus to begin with. New Flyer installed what I call "shoulder guards" starting with the 1760's(I doubt their bases still exist... I put a photo up somewhere on the forum... maybe I can find it sometime and upload it here). The 4000's continued with the third-party screens... I haven't rode the 4300's or 4333's, so I can't say what they have. This is a protective screen that Nova offers for their buses, I'm sure that is made by them and looks way more advanced and protective than the third-party ones on the New Flyers. The only thing I honestly dislike about those protective guards is what if a driver has a medical emergency? Yeah, I know... I'm going back into "Speed" scenario here... but if a quick thinking passenger can get to the controls, get the driver's foot off the accelerator and use the brake to stop the bus or steer it away from any possible dangers(like say a viaduct support beam) that could save the lives of the driver and passengers. There's always pros and cons to everything... there isn't many cons for the protective guards on any bus, but this con is a rather big one, IMO... Back up a little. Those shoulder guards as you call them, started with 1630 if I'm not mistaken. It was one of the other features besides the bluish internal lighting, ISL engines, and lighter body frame that distinguished 1630-2029 from 1000-1429 and 1430-1629. Of course in 1930-2029, the other distinguishable features are the bowling alley seating and Alllison transmissions. I think you're confusing the fact that originally NP's first buses among the 1630s began with 1760s-odd with meaning the built in small guards started in the 1760s. They started lower. But you are correct that the shields were installed on top of those guards to make these higher number buses conform with what CTA had already begun installing on the lower numbered NFs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimball401 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I'm going to add my two cents on just the part I highlighted.... garmon, when the CTA first installed the protective screens on the New Flyers, that was done in-house either by CTA directly or a third-party company, so those screens were not part of the bus to begin with. New Flyer installed what I call "shoulder guards" starting with the 1760's(I doubt their bases still exist... I put a photo up somewhere on the forum... maybe I can find it sometime and upload it here). The 4000's continued with the third-party screens... I haven't rode the 4300's or 4333's, so I can't say what they have. This is a protective screen that Nova offers for their buses, I'm sure that is made by them and looks way more advanced and protective than the third-party ones on the New Flyers. The only thing I honestly dislike about those protective guards is what if a driver has a medical emergency? Yeah, I know... I'm going back into "Speed" scenario here... but if a quick thinking passenger can get to the controls, get the driver's foot off the accelerator and use the brake to stop the bus or steer it away from any possible dangers(like say a viaduct support beam) that could save the lives of the driver and passengers. There's always pros and cons to everything... there isn't many cons for the protective guards on any bus, but this con is a rather big one, IMO. Hold on a second (*puts on turn signal to jump in convo*) you're right about the speedo situation because everyone lifes falls in the hands of our fellow operators. Now to highlight my belief, I think Cta Might make a modification to the shields or this would be a first on record for Cta. Now i've personally played "ride along" bus fan on most routes ,made friends,talked about rolling stock,etc. I've been put in this situation once on 47th Street on night card run @ 47th Redline. Our operator said he was early by 2minutes so everyone's sitting waiting and he nodded and took his foot off the brake<<<< . As that bus rolled back, I walked up to look and i had to step on the brake. I reach around and applied the parking brake. He lep up when he heard the air brakes discharged. He said he was terribly sorry and was so tired. he flew down to Cottage Grove where he got intercepted by a Supervisor. (I don't know if the bus had live recording going or if someone called in on him but they(Supervisor+Police Officer) made me ride down to Lake Park to (I stay on 45th and Drexel) Explain myself . I felt salty having to tell on what i consider "brothern" but with my return to cta in the balance i had to explain to save me from any jail/charges. Now I did something wrong that night as well . (i sat down instead of standing ) and now I stand somewhere on a bus ever since. but i'm gonna bet that cta would modify or consider a new shield. If not imma treat you out to lunch and tell somemore about that night lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I've decided to take some better shots of various busses while it was still daylight and some after sunset. 1. and 3. #6568 2. #6738 4. GM New Look #9701 yet to be scrapped. 5. Unknown stripped Nova 6. and 7. Stripped New Flyer 5800s. 8. #6531 indicating no brakes on the windshield. 9. Some GM New Looks (1962 and 1972) and a Flxible (1969) in the back #301 #1251 and #3706 10. #6531 with the wheelchair ramp left open (weird). 11. A work bus Flxible (3300s???(1966???)). 12. A damn well lucky shot of various buses on the top of a iced snow hill by the fence (Two Flxibles 6000s (6043 and 6227), a couple of Flxibles 5300s, a lime-green GM New Look, a narrow TMC RTS 4900s, and a couple of New Flyers 1000s). All yet to be scrapped except for the New Flyers. 13. A 77th New Flyer at the cleaning station. 14. #1160 on it's way to the garage while dealing with a flat tire. 15. and 16. Police activity involving the bus driver on #4355 (I don't know why). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bus fanatic30 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Great shots!!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 I've decided to take some better shots of various busses while it was still daylight and some after sunset. 1. and 3. #6568 2. #6738 4. GM New Look #9701 yet to be scrapped. 5. 6. and 7. 2 stripped New Flyer 5800s. 8. #6531 indicating no brakes on the windshield. 9. Some GM New Looks (1962 and 1972) and a Flxible (1969) in the back #301 #1251 and #3706 10. #6531 with the wheelchair ramp left open (weird). 11. A work bus Flxible (3300s???(1966???)). 12. A damn well lucky shot of various buses on the top of a iced snow hill by the fence (Two Flxibles 6000s (6043 and 6227), a couple of Flxibles 5300s, a lime-green GM New Look, a narrow TMC RTS 4900s, and a couple of New Flyers 1000s). All yet to be scrapped except for the New Flyers. 13. A 77th New Flyer at the cleaning station. 14. #1160 on it's way to the garage while dealing with a flat tire. 15. and 16. Police activity involving the bus driver on #4355 (I don't know why). Besides a couple of Novas that are definitely written off, one has to wonder why CTA still has the apparent training and work buses (9701 and BW57) still around. Time to send in the maid. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Great shots!!!!!! Thanks!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 Besides a couple of Novas that are definitely written off, one has to wonder why CTA still has the apparent training and work buses (9701 and BW57) still around. Time to send in the maid. LOL!!! I don't know man but hey, I'll take some history with me while I have a chance I miss them 9600s. I used to enjoy riding those buses with my mom on #49 and #94 when I was a kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTRSP1900-CTA3200 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 On Sunday I was returning home from dinner in the city, and I passed a CTA 2000-2002 Nova on the Eisenhower. I did a double take when I realized it was missing its red and blue stripes. I also noticed its number didn't look right (I think it had a letter in it). Aside from that, it looked like a regular Nova. I don't have any pictures of it since I was hauling a## compared to the bus and it was dark out. Also, the Blue Line was running 8 car sets. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 On Sunday I was returning home from dinner in the city, and I passed a CTA 2000-2002 Nova on the Eisenhower. I did a double take when I realized it was missing its red and blue stripes. I also noticed its number didn't look right (I think it had a letter in it). Aside from that, it looked like a regular Nova. I don't have any pictures of it since I was hauling a## compared to the bus and it was dark out. Also, the Blue Line was running 8 car sets. Probably converted to work or instruction bus, although not enough said whether those were the buses previously pictured here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 4, 2014 Report Share Posted March 4, 2014 On Sunday I was returning home from dinner in the city, and I passed a CTA 2000-2002 Nova on the Eisenhower. I did a double take when I realized it was missing its red and blue stripes. I also noticed its number didn't look right (I think it had a letter in it). Aside from that, it looked like a regular Nova. I don't have any pictures of it since I was hauling a## compared to the bus and it was dark out. Also, the Blue Line was running 8 car sets. Probably converted to work or instruction bus, although not enough said whether those were the buses previously pictured here. I'm going to assume that it was Nova WB-2. Nova WB-1 is currently parked at 77th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.