2012 40'/60' Procurement

[Busjack]

So this would be an engine fire?

Could be, but I would think a bit further toward the front (where the grille is in the gray section). Hence, probably more likely a brake fire.

But it is definitely not in the back unit. Nor is there a back access door evident in that picture.

[ChicagoNova]

So this would be an engine fire?

OMG!!!!

[BusHunter]

I think MAN high floor artics had an rear mounted auxiliary engine to handle the air-conditioning system.That might explain the vent

in the rear.

Yeah, it would have the condenser, vent and fan and be belt drivin'. Kind of like how the fishbowls had that vent at the top rear. If you can remember the MAN buses used to have a hum come out of the rear. In the early 90's when those were rebuilt, they added another vent on the rear decklid. They had said the ac had failed previously, I don't know if they were overheating and dying or not, but that's why they would add another vent. If you look at buses with no AC, like the #7300's they don't have that vent. Just like some fishbowls had a big rear window in the rear versus a small one in the ac version. What I'd like to know is wasn't there one in the front too, there is a vent under the driver. They wouldn't think the rear one could cool the whole bus could they? I remember alot of those buses were hot in one half of the bus and cold in the other half. A bus schematic would be nice right now.

[Busjack]

... A bus schematic would be nice right now.

That's certainly the case.

I sort of remember an exhaust pipe coming out the bottom side of the front unit. About the only good site I could find for MAN pictures was this site's 7300 gallery, which doesn't confirm that. But it is also quite clear that a tailpipe is not shown at the roof nor under the rear bumper.

A back panel is shown in the picture of 7324, but it looks like it is screwed or riveted, as opposed to the usual swing up type engine cover.

[BusHunter]

That's certainly the case.

I sort of remember an exhaust pipe coming out the bottom side of the front unit. About the only good site I could find for MAN pictures was this site's 7300 gallery, which doesn't confirm that. But it is also quite clear that a tailpipe is not shown at the roof nor under the rear bumper.

A back panel is shown in the picture of 7324, but it looks like it is screwed or riveted, as opposed to the usual swing up type engine cover.

I think the exhaust pipe you mention (which I remember) was coming off the engine itself. That front vent I mention is there on the #7300's, so that looks like it is a vent for the driver, probably has a heat setting and a vent setting but no ac.

[Busjack]

I think the exhaust pipe you mention (which I remember) was coming off the engine itself. That front vent I mention is there on the #7300's, so that looks like it is a vent for the driver, probably has a heat setting and a vent setting but no ac.

That's what I meant. And you may have meant one vent; the grille I mentioned here is on the outside. The left side shots (i.e. 7360) seem to show several access panels in about the same location.

Thanks for agreeing on recollections.

[See Tea Eh]

Could be, but I would think a bit further toward the front (where the grille is in the gray section). Hence, probably more likely a brake fire.

But it is definitely not in the back unit. Nor is there a back access door evident in that picture.

Well since we're speaking of artic fires (and possible brake fires), Seattle/Community Transit just had a DE60LFR burn down on I-5 a few days ago due to a brake fire. http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2020115035_busfire12m.html

[Busjack]

Well since we're speaking of artic fires (and possible brake fires), Seattle/Community Transit just had a DE60LFR burn down on I-5 a few days ago due to a brake fire. http://seattletimes....busfire12m.html

It also looked like the flames leaped and took out the battery box, probably causing the explosion.

I was wondering where the fire extinguishing system was, but it doesn't look like the fire involved the engine compartment.

[jajuan]

Put all-season tires on that bus in that video, and I can pretty much guarantee that NOVA wouldn't be making you "ooh and ahh" at it going through that residential street. If you were able to look at that demo bus parked, you would most likely see winter tires on it(we're talking Canada here, guys). Want an example of what I'm talking about... here you go...

BTW: Here's the law requiring snow tires in Quebec. CBC News article here

So again, you are looking at a NOVA LFS Artic with snow tires. In Chicago, snow tires are not required by law.

Here's an all-season vs. snow tire tread comparison and article

Alright we get it already. Sheesh. You can stop raining on NOVA's parade now. <_<

[BUSANGEL#1]

Im glad our celebrity buses from The Dark Knight and Meet The Browns films will still survive in Chicago. :D

[Kimball401]

I love that novabus got the contract although I'm partly happy that they sold Archer( I wanted to see them reopen it) but I guess ill do what I know how to best until the next buses come out: ride til the driver says I gotta pull in

[Kevin]

Based on the photo on Streetsblog Chicago, the new Novas will use Freedman/4One Gemini seats.

[RJL6000]

Knowing the CTA, unless something weird happens expect the new Novas to be equipped with the same Luminator Horizon amber LED destination signs as all of CTA's recent bus orders dating back to the infamous NABI artics of 2003.

[Busjack]

Knowing the CTA, unless something weird happens expect the new Novas to be equipped with the same Luminator Horizon amber LED destination signs as all of CTA's recent bus orders dating back to the infamous NABI artics of 2003.

In addendum 2, the Q&A indicated that CTA didn't care. However, since Luminator has acquired TwinVision, it probably doesn't matter.

[Busjack]

Based on the photo on Streetsblog Chicago, the new Novas will use Freedman/4One Gemini seats.

Isn't it notable that in an article where Emanuel says in about 25 meaningless ways "the consultant hasn't spent the $2 million grant yet," the bus enthusiast finds the one relevant item in the photo.

[sw4400]

Based on the photo on Streetsblog Chicago, the new Novas will use Freedman/4One Gemini seats.

I wonder if they'll also use these seats in the 1,030 New Flyer D40LF's for the upcoming "gut rehab".

[Busjack]

I wonder if they'll also use these seats in the 1,030 New Flyer D40LF's for the upcoming "gut rehab".

For the last time, Kevin said he looked at the specs and they aren't that gut.

[RJL6000]

For the last time, Kevin said he looked at the specs and they aren't that gut.

Only certain major components will be overhauled. And some buses that originally (and currently) have the old-style seats will be retrofit with the same American Seating InSight seats to match those in the higher-numbered 1000s.

By the way, the Freedman/4One seats will only be installed in the new Novas the CTA is ordering (and probably the next order of artics, if the CTA follows through with that order).

[sw4400]

For the last time, Kevin said he looked at the specs and they aren't that gut.

Only certain major components will be overhauled. And some buses that originally (and currently) have the old-style seats will be retrofit with the same American Seating InSight seats to match those in the higher-numbered 1000s.

By the way, the Freedman/4One seats will only be installed in the new Novas the CTA is ordering (and probably the next order of artics, if the CTA follows through with that order).

I'm going to go the "wait & see" route here. This line from this news article here makes me speculate new seats are a possibility.

"As part of the fleet-improvement project, 1,030 older buses that still have about six years of service life left will be completely overhauled, at an estimated cost of $165 million, officials said. New engines, transmissions, suspensions — everything except the steel frame — will be replaced on the buses, officials said."

I wonder if they'll still have the Cummins ISM(1000-1629) and ISL(1630-2029) setup with the ZF(1000-1929) and Allison(1930-2029) transmissions or will the CTA have one type of engine and transmission for all buses. I remember 5862-5864 on the old D40LF order had a different engine(Cummins model) and after rehab, these three had a Detroit Series-50 like 5800-5861 had.

[jajuan]

I'm going to go the "wait & see" route here. This line from this news article here makes me speculate new seats are a possibility.

"As part of the fleet-improvement project, 1,030 older buses that still have about six years of service life left will be completely overhauled, at an estimated cost of $165 million, officials said. New engines, transmissions, suspensions — everything except the steel frame — will be replaced on the buses, officials said."

I wonder if they'll still have the Cummins ISM(1000-1629) and ISL(1630-2029) setup with the ZF(1000-1929) and Allison(1930-2029) transmissions or will the CTA have one type of engine and transmission for all buses. I remember 5862-5864 on the old D40LF order had a different engine(Cummins model) and after rehab, these three had a Detroit Series-50 like 5800-5861 had.

As I understand things as far as changing seats go, is that 1000-1302 will be retrofitted to match the seats of those numbered higher as CTA officials said long ago and other members on the board have reported based on that word from CTA officials. As Busjack points out, Kevin looked at the specs and the 'gut rehab' appears to put most of the focus on rebuilding the buses' innards and replacing parts that contribute to their motion like the engines, transmissions, drive shafts. etc than the parts that more are more minor or cosmetic in nature. No disrespect to our mayor when he made that 'replace everything but the steelframe' comment, but he's a lawyer by profession not an engineer or bus mechanic. The degree of gut rehab he alludes to with that comment I'd imagine would take longer than the five bus per week rebuild time frame I remember seeing reported either from news sources discussion the rebuilds or the CTA's press releases on the topic.

[Mr.cta85]

As I understand things as far as changing seats go, is that 1000-1302 will be retrofitted to match the seats of those numbered higher as CTA officials said long ago and other members on the board have reported based on that word from CTA officials. As Busjack points out, Kevin looked at the specs and the 'gut rehab' appears to put most of the focus on rebuilding the buses' innards and replacing parts that contribute to their motion like the engines, transmissions, drive shafts. etc than the parts that more are more minor or cosmetic in nature. No disrespect to our mayor when he made that 'replace everything but the steelframe' comment, but he's a lawyer by profession not an engineer or bus mechanic. The degree of gut rehab he alludes to with that comment I'd imagine would take longer than the five bus per week rebuild time frame I remember seeing reported either from news sources discussion the rebuilds or the CTA's press releases on the topic.

Believe it or not NF bus # 1000 actually has the updated seats as the higher numbered New Flyers does. I only know because I drove that particular bus. Few months ago while doing the old 111 route. As far as 1001 and up those still have the same origins

Seats.

[jajuan]

Believe it or not NF bus # 1000 actually has the updated seats as the higher numbered New Flyers does. I only know because I drove that particular bus. Few months ago while doing the old 111 route. As far as 1001 and up those still have the same origins

Seats.

That's right. 1000 was used in the news conference with Kruesi and Mayor Daley a few months before we saw them in revenue service. I keep forgetting Kevin has the pics on the bus photos section and that bus had the updated seats and some other styles as I recall to showcase the seat choices for this model bus.

[Busjack]

... As Busjack points out, Kevin looked at the specs and the 'gut rehab' appears to put most of the focus on rebuilding the buses' innards and replacing parts that contribute to their motion like the engines, transmissions, drive shafts. etc than the parts that more are more minor or cosmetic in nature. No disrespect to our mayor when he made that 'replace everything but the steelframe' comment, but he's a lawyer by profession...

Which brings up the primary source rule, which I might have mentioned before. In this case, the primary source is the posted specifications. When Dante was foaming about them, I downloaded them again and part of the addendum supported him [i.e. the award could be split, which it was], but not much. Apparently CTA was not getting a BYD or American Seating bus, even though their representatives attended the prebid meeting. Apparently not even American Seating seats.

Here essentially one relying on the newspaper is dealing with double hearsay--the paper said Emanuel said something about which he didn't have personal knowledge.

So long as neither CTA nor Pace cares who registers for their downloads, may as well take it from the horse's mouth, or other end.

[pace2322]

But 1000s in not that same 1000s The 1000s now was make in 2007 the other 1000s was 2005.

[Busjack]

That's right. 1000 was used in the news conference with Kruesi and Mayor Daley a few months before we saw them in revenue service. I keep forgetting Kevin has the pics on the bus photos section and that bus had the updated seats and some other styles as I recall to showcase the seat choices for this model bus.

Good recall. Going through the 1000s gallery, apparently it had the old type seats in the front and the InSight seats in the back. Mrcta can tell us with his eloquent voice whether the 8 of one and a couple of dozen of another still persists.

But 1000s in not that same 1000s The 1000s now was make in 2007 the other 1000s was 2005.

And I guess there is that issue.