CTA Service Adjustments

[Busjack]

I will give him credit to standing up to Emanuel.

Since Emanuel doesn't live that far away.They should organize a protest in front of his house.

I had noted (probably elsewhere), that for a change they were sticking it to people on the north side. However, since Claypool lives just off of Clark, he didn't cancel the 22 bus.

I don't think Emanuel would care if they picketed his house, even though, due to the "residency" litigation, everyone knows where it is.

At least they would have to make sure that television media were out there first.

[mkohut]

I don't think it would take that much of a effort to get Tv Media there.

But,it also shows Claypool can't fix Bus Bunching by where he lives.

[BUSANGEL#1]

"Slight crowding with standees" doesn't come within the rationale of buses packed over the yellow line during rush hours, which was the tenor of the public meeting Powerpoint display. It certainly does not justify cutting all service on mid-Lincoln.

So, if this is the case, CTA was engaged again in a sham.

It also doesn't justify several things such as cutting all the X routes and hours from all routes instead of only cutting low ridership routes back in 2010. After all this time the north side will understand the pain of the south side. There are plenty of other options near Lincoln, but not many for third-shift workers headed south after work late nights. All we have is the Red Line and we lose that for 5 months.

[Busjack]

It also doesn't justify several things such as cutting all the X routes and hours from all routes instead of only cutting low ridership routes back in 2010. After all this time the north side will understand the pain of the south side. There are plenty of other options near Lincoln, but not many for third-shift workers headed south after work late nights. All we have is the Red Line and we lose that for 5 months.

If you have some proof that CTA is revisiting the 2010 Rodriguez cuts, post a source.

Up to now, the official line about this has been:

• This is to reduce crowding, such as the pdf saying "The additions to service will reduce the time between trains and buses and lower peak crowd loads by between 10 percent and 15 percent in most cases," "Adds service to 48 routes, including the busiest and most crowded bus routes, by increasing service during peak times on congested routes and extending two other routes," "Today: 70 passengers in a bus. Target: 45 ‐ 55 passengers per bus [i assume 40 foot one]."
• The Red Line is supposed to be covered by 100 additional buses and 400 additional drivers on shuttles, to be paid out of state construction money--not on the backs of north side commuters.

So, if the official line is a lie, provide the substantiation, which shouldn't be difficult.

[mkohut]

If they are revisiting the cuts.Where are they getting the money to reinstate then.

[Busjack]

If they are revisiting the cuts.Where are they getting the money to reinstate then.

I stated this hypothetically, in rebuttal to BusAngel, since, again, the official line was that CTA was moving resources, not claiming to be adding them. Maybe I was asking whether they were moving resources for the purposes stated in the presentation, or for others, the one being implied by BusAngel to placate the south side.

[mkohut]

I stated this hypothetically, in rebuttal to BusAngel, since, again, the official line was that CTA was moving resources, not claiming to be adding them. Maybe I was asking whether they were moving resources for the purposes stated in the presentation, or for others, the one being implied by BusAngel to placate the south side.

They did claim to add more service to other routes when the Red Line is out of service.

Not only the shuffle buses.

[Busjack]

They did claim to add more service to other routes when the Red Line is out of service.

Not only the shuffle buses.

While I might have been underinclusive, my point still is that they should be paid out of the state construction money, not the shifted resources.

[mkohut]

While I might have been underinclusive, my point still is that they should be paid out of the state construction money, not the shifted resources.

True

I'm still waiting for a source of all the the added evening service.

[qwantae]

True

I'm still waiting for a source of all the the added evening service.

They should reinstate #29=State back to OWL service, then adding evening service on #24-Wentworth, maybe add later evening service to 1AM on #3 ML King Dr. Both for Red Line Shutdown.

[MetroShadow]

Still a system pick out (or two) away. For now, let's just see how this "adjustment" holds over...

[renardo870]

#4 is already an owl route but #146 will get an extra hour of later service ending at 11:30p.m. I forgot to mention that.

Im sorry I meant to say the #4 Cottage Grove owl south of 63rd st?

[BUSANGEL#1]

Im sorry I meant to say the #4 Cottage Grove owl south of 63rd st?

A while ago they wanted to extend owl service to 79th but that went no where.

[BUSANGEL#1]

If you have some proof that CTA is revisiting the 2010 Rodriguez cuts, post a source.

Up to now, the official line about this has been:

• This is to reduce crowding, such as the pdf saying "The additions to service will reduce the time between trains and buses and lower peak crowd loads by between 10 percent and 15 percent in most cases," "Adds service to 48 routes, including the busiest and most crowded bus routes, by increasing service during peak times on congested routes and extending two other routes," "Today: 70 passengers in a bus. Target: 45 ‐ 55 passengers per bus [i assume 40 foot one]."
• The Red Line is supposed to be covered by 100 additional buses and 400 additional drivers on shuttles, to be paid out of state construction money--not on the backs of north side commuters.

So, if the official line is a lie, provide the substantiation, which shouldn't be difficult.

Actually that wasn't what I was saying. I only used the 2010 cuts as an example to your argument about Lincoln and my earlier explanation of the new later service planned for 12/16. I agree that no service justifies cuts, especially when customers are now forced to pay higher fares for the same or less service. However if Lincoln is cut because of low ridership, then all low ridership routes such as 55A, 55N, 88, 86, 100, 165 and others should be cut. Since Lipinski's area (southwest) has political patronage they are saved from 12/16 which is unfair. In regards to your request (and others) for a source, CTA is not releasing scheduling details publicly until probably next week.

[Guest]

Actually that wasn't what I was saying. I only used the 2010 cuts as an example to your argument about Lincoln and my earlier explanation of the new later service planned for 12/16. I agree that no service justifies cuts, especially when customers are now forced to pay higher fares for the same or less service. However if Lincoln is cut because of low ridership, then all low ridership routes such as 55A, 55N, 88, 86, 100, 165 and others should be cut. Since Lipinski's area (southwest) has political patronage they are saved from 12/16 which is unfair. In regards to your request (and others) for a source, CTA is not releasing scheduling details publicly until probably next week.

Correction, #86 Narragnsett is not a low ridership route. It was on the hit list a while back but it was retained because of the two high schools and one college it serves. Usage on that route has increased significantly with the extension to Milwaukee/Devon.

[BusHunter]

If you have some proof that CTA is revisiting the 2010 Rodriguez cuts, post a source.

Up to now, the official line about this has been:

• This is to reduce crowding, such as the pdf saying "The additions to service will reduce the time between trains and buses and lower peak crowd loads by between 10 percent and 15 percent in most cases," "Adds service to 48 routes, including the busiest and most crowded bus routes, by increasing service during peak times on congested routes and extending two other routes," "Today: 70 passengers in a bus. Target: 45 ‐ 55 passengers per bus [i assume 40 foot one]."
• The Red Line is supposed to be covered by 100 additional buses and 400 additional drivers on shuttles, to be paid out of state construction money--not on the backs of north side commuters.

So, if the official line is a lie, provide the substantiation, which shouldn't be difficult.

By increasing the target to 45-55 riders per bus versus 70, they are saying they intend to have 1/3 to 1/4 more buses on the 48 routes in the rush. I don't see each route getting more than 1 bus, which in most cases is a 10 percent change. If they really wanted to cut the service that bad like they did in 2010, they should have just ordered 100 percent artics. At least people wouldn't be neck and neck from 3-7 PM. The problem with the service of today is it is slow, bunched up, and overcrowded. With more artics at least riders would be more comfortable. Running express buses when their late, like NYC would take care of the other two. On the rail side, I notice the Red line is terribly overcrowded and the trains don't seem to have the frequency they used to have. (the cause) I don't know if this is from the excessive slow zones or the overcrowding slowing down the trains. The blue line has better frequency in the rush, and it appears to be less crowded. Hopefully when they do implement extra trains they can do it in a strategic fashion. Like the Green line seems overcrowded heading to/from Harlem but there doesn't appear to be overcrowding heading to/from South 63rd/Cottage or Ashland/63rd. Why add service there? The same could be done with blue line turning trains at Morgan middle. At least it attacks the problem better, putting the service where it's needed.

[Busjack]

... In regards to your request (and others) for a source, CTA is not releasing scheduling details publicly until probably next week.

So, why are you purporting to do so?

[Busjack]

By increasing the target to 45-55 riders per bus versus 70, they are saying they intend to have 1/3 to 1/4 more buses on the 48 routes in the rush. I don't see each route getting more than 1 bus, which in most cases is a 10 percent change.

When you analyze it that way, I agree that the numbers don't add up. Maybe only some lines are running 70 passengers.

Like the Green line seems overcrowded heading to/from Harlem but there doesn't appear to be overcrowding heading to/from South 63rd/Cottage or Ashland/63rd. Why add service there? The same could be done with blue line turning trains at Morgan middle. At least it attacks the problem better, putting the service where it's needed.

David H indicated the latter for weekends, but, except for the political promise made that disconnecting the Pink Line would add service on the Forest Park branch, I don't see why not during off daytime hours, either.

The Red Line interim plan indicates some short turns of Green Line trains in the Loop. The question is, though, with the schedule on the branches indicating about every 20 minutes daytime on the branches,* is it really rapid transit worth having if they cut it back from that?

__________

* Cottage Grove schedule

Ashland/63 schedule

[BUSANGEL#1]

So, why are you purporting to do so?

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking, but the only reason I bought up the later service was because somebody had asked which routes were going to receive it on 12/16. Then others jumped in curiously wanting to know details.

[mkohut]

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking, but the only reason I bought up the later service was because somebody had asked which routes were going to receive it on 12/16. Then others jumped in curiously wanting to know details.

Why don't you want to reveal your source?

[renardo870]

What other routes will be moved to what garages for this pick?

[busfan2847]

The Red Line interim plan indicates some short turns of Green Line trains in the Loop. The question is, though, with the schedule on the branches indicating about every 20 minutes daytime on the branches,* is it really rapid transit worth having if they cut it back from that?

__________

* Cottage Grove schedule

Ashland/63 schedule

All Red Line trains will be routed onto the Green Line at the 13th St Incline and will all go to Ashland/63, All South Side Green line trains will go to Cottage Grove. If they turn every second Green Line train from Harlem in the loop the service to Cottage Grove will be maintained at every 20min. Service to Ashland 63rd will be better than that as the Red Line runs every 8-9min daytime.

[jajuan]

What other routes will be moved to what garages for this pick?

No one knows yet except maybe those who reportedly have inside connections to the source of that info. And spreading out to something else I saw in this thread, what's with degrading the discussion to a North side vs. South side thing and taking certain glee in the perception that "the North side is finally getting stiffed too"? That's a nonsense stance. I may currently live on the North side but I still work on the West side and still use routes that serve the West and South sides, both areas that yes have at times seen cuts first. And the north side wasn't exactly spared the last round of cuts. The north side did lose the X9, X49 and X80 (remember X9 and X49 served the north side too), and the North Lake Shore Express routes did get cut back to 10:30PM at the latest for those that run in the evenings while the 6 still operates up to 12:30AM. So North siders know about cuts too. And need I mention 78, 92 and a few other north side routes only operating till 10:30 at the latest? It's not a North side vs. South side thing. It's a CHICAGO thing. Routes across the system have been seeing cutbacks in recent times while say the routes in Lipinski land have not been touched. I think it's fair to say there's plenty of areas where cutbacks make little or no sense at the expense of keeping service in spots for politically clout heavy politicians' constituents where some adjustment is more justified to keep the system as a whole efficient.

Edited December 2, 2012 by jajuan

[CURRENTZ_09]

All Red Line trains will be routed onto the Green Line at the 13th St Incline and will all go to Ashland/63, All South Side Green line trains will go to Cottage Grove. If they turn every second Green Line train from Harlem in the loop the service to Cottage Grove will be maintained at every 20min. Service to Ashland 63rd will be better than that as the Red Line runs every 8-9min daytime.

Exactly & The South Side Elevated can handle the load of traffic because it did it before the line switches in 1993, so Expect more Red Line's, Less Green Lines for 5 months from Roosevelt to 59th. Also, expect a 24 Hour Shuttle between Roosevelt & Cermak-Chinatown. This was discussed on the July 14th, 2012 Red Line South Community Meeting and seems to have been included in the plan. Looks like all other details of the plan won't be revealed until 2013, with another set of community meetings coming after the holiday season, Most likely between Late January-March to explain and sell this plan

[renardo870]

There will be a lot of bus routes affected directly and indirectly by the Red Line Shutdown coming out of 4 garages.

K Kedzie: 1, 21, 35, 39 and Cermak/Chinatown Shuttle.

6 74th St Garage: 8, 9/N9, 44, 47, 48, 51, 55/N55, 59, 63/N63, 67, 75

7 77th Garage: 2, 3, 4/N4, 8A, 24, 29, 30, 43, 71, 79/N79, 87/N87

1 103rd St Garage: N5, 6, 14, 26, 28, 29, 30, 34/N34, 71, 95E, 95W, 100, 103, 106, 108, 111, 112, 115, 119

1/6/7 will provide Local and Express Shuttles from 95th/87th/79th/69th to 63rd St and Garfield Green/Red Station.

Pace South/Southwest is discussing plans to take riders to either 95th to connect to the shuttles, Harvey/Blue Island Metra Stations or Express to downtown Chicago.