Return of the X, Rapid, BRT-Lite, Limited Stop Routes (was X9, X49) Thread

[garmon757]

You should wait until they actually are reinstated.

I was thinking that maybe it was worthy for a News Brief on the home page, except that feature isn't there any more.

Agreed.

[Komplex]

Ashland and Western routes!

 

I would put link to it but my phone being dumb lol

 

Edited August 19, 2015 by MetroShadow
Title has changed

[BusHunter]

The CTA Press Release didn't say anything about the routing, but where TSP would be installed, As sw pointed out, apparently not south of 79th, so the now useless portion of X49 to nonexistent Evergreen Plaza isn't coming back. The Press Release left the ambiguity whether the Western Express would overlap 49B, as it said TSP to Howard.

I suppose one will have to await the meaningless community meetings to get the final word.

Question is, is 79th/Western too busy of a terminal to handle it? They could always run it somewhere else nearby like link it with the #48's south terminal.

[MetroShadow]

From the following articles:

DNA

ABC7

Streetsblog

All things and thoughts considered...

[BusHunter]

From the following articles:

DNA

ABC7

Streetsblog

All things and thoughts considered...

Interesting the CTA press release (see link below) says they will be cutting local stops based on ridership. So does that mean they will cut stops that are close together on #9, (it goes on to state so buses won't have to constantly merge into traffic) or unpopular stops like south of cermak in the industrial corridor hardly anyone boards. What really slows down the bus is the double stops per intersection. i hate those, they should just pick the most popular of the two. (example Cicero/Irving on the EB #80 or Damen/Milwaukee on the SB #50.)

http://www.transitchicago.com/news/default.aspx?ArticleId=3449

[Busjack]

Question is, is 79th/Western too busy of a terminal to handle it? They could always run it somewhere else nearby like link it with the #48's south terminal.

Although the former terminal was Evergreen Plaza, the former bus had to run into the 79th terminal, so that shouldn't be a problem. That terminal has the overhead canopies and the like, sort of like a scaled back Jefferson Park.

Interesting the CTA press release (see link below) says they will be cutting local stops based on ridership. So does that mean they will cut stops that are close together on #9, (it goes on to state so buses won't have to constantly merge into traffic) or unpopular stops like south of cermak in the industrial corridor hardly anyone boards. What really slows down the bus is the double stops per intersection. i hate those, they should just pick the most popular of the two. (example Cicero/Irving on the EB #80 or Damen/Milwaukee on the SB #50.)

http://www.transitchicago.com/news/default.aspx?ArticleId=3449

Won't know until the "community input" process, but my bet  based on the "community input" process would be the unpopular ones. However, the local and express stops at major streets might be consolidated. Supposedly far side stops work better with TSP (trip the signal, go through, and then stop, as opposed to stopping and then tripping the signal).

[BusHunter]

Although the former terminal was Evergreen Plaza, the former bus had to run into the 79th terminal, so that shouldn't be a problem. That terminal has the overhead canopies and the like, sort of like a scaled back Jefferson Park.

Won't know until the "community input" process, but my bet  based on the "community input" process would be the unpopular ones. However, the local and express stops at major streets might be consolidated. Supposedly far side stops work better with TSP (trip the signal, go through, and then stop, as opposed to stopping and then tripping the signal).

As long as it's safe to do so. Where would a sb #9 stop at Cermak? Can't stop on a railroad crossing? Also a good question is how far will the tsp transponder reach? Will it put a burden then on cross traffic because it's like having to wait at a railroad grade crossing. While it may improve Ashland and Western traffic what does it do to other traffic especially at six cornered intersections. (thinking also of Elston/Diversey/Western intersection)

Edited August 19, 2015 by BusHunter

[Busjack]

As long as it's safe to do so. Where would a sb #9 stop at Cermak? Can't stop on a railroad crossing? Also a good question is how far will the tsp transponder reach? Will it put a burden then on cross traffic because it's like having to wait at a railroad grade crossing. While it may improve Ashland and Western traffic what does it do to other traffic especially at six cornered intersections. (thinking also of Elston/Diversey/Western intersection)

Probably depends on whether it is like the Pace one, which only activates if the bus is behind schedule.

[sw4400]

You should wait until they actually are reinstated.

I was thinking that maybe it was worthy for a News Brief on the home page, except that feature isn't there any more.

Wait, agreed.... but I would all but presume that 74th will run both, being they run #9 by themselves and seem to run most of the #49 runs. NP does run #49 too, but probably one in every four or five runs, and probably only during peak travel periods(or when Lane Tech is in session, like with #152). It would be a long relief point for Bus Operators as the typical relief point for NP is Foster. FG is Central..... 74th might be Madison??? I don't know about Kedzie, Chicago 77th and 103rd. But garages have relief points on a certain arterial street.

[Busjack]

Wait, agreed.... but I would all but presume that 74th will run both, being they run #9 by themselves and seem to run most of the #49 runs. NP does run #49 too, but probably one in every four or five runs, and probably only during peak travel periods(or when Lane Tech is in session, like with #152). It would be a long relief point for Bus Operators as the typical relief point for NP is Foster. FG is Central..... 74th might be Madison??? I don't know about Kedzie, Chicago 77th and 103rd. But garages have relief points on a certain arterial street.

Only relief points for 74th would be 79th and Western* or 74th and Ashland. The relief point has to intersect with some street on the grid with the garage. Hence, Jackson (for instance) would make sense only if it runs out of K.

I'm assuming that CTA has not adopted the Pace practice of sending out relief drivers in supervisors' cars, but most Pace routes are not on a grid.

 

*Update: I forgot the rerouting 94 makes a relief point at 69th and Western feasible.

Edited August 20, 2015 by Busjack

[Busjack]

Sun-Times changed its article at 9:54. It says "transportation commissioner Rebekah Scheinfeld said the Ashland BRT project is proceeding but “is still in the planning stages,” while the return of express buses is a way to offer immediate benefits to commuters." It also mentions, this time around, that TSP is part of this project.

Somehow, the paper version of the article (I saw at a Dairy Queen), and what's currently on the website is more like the original, that BRT is dead. I searched through what I quoted above, and it isn't in the current web version. I guess one has to keep screen shots of anything on suntimes.com after this. Here's one of the current headline on the website:

[sw4400]

Only problem with Express route service is that the Bus Operators need to run it as express route service, and the passengers need to have enough common sense to read the signs!!! Example coming up(pardon the shouting, this is just to show what I mean)....

Passenger boards X9 after #9 leapfrogs stop at Addison. Passenger wants to get off at Barry, but next stop after Belmont is Diversey(there may be one in-between, but that's the next big stop according to BusTracker)

"Excuse me, sir. I wanted Barry."

"This is an Express Bus. Next stop is Diversey."

"I don't care.... I asked you to stop at Barry. Stop the bus!!!"

"I can't make a stop until Diversey, sir. That's my next stop."

"PULL THE M***********G BUS OVER, GOD D****T!!!" *Driver finally lets passenger off at Ashland and Wellington, but not before more berating and passenger taking down Bus Operator's number, Bus Number and giving him a parting shot..... something along the lines of "Dumb M**********r!!!" In the meantime, you got more local passengers trying to board thinking you make all stops since you stopped at a non-Express stop.

Apologies for the "shouting", forum.... I was just illustrating a point of what Express Bus service will be like(those that have taken it know, I'm sure). I've seen this a lot on the X80.

[Busjack]

Only problem with Express route service is that the Bus Operators need to run it as express route service, and the passengers need to have enough common sense to read the signs!!! Example coming up(pardon the shouting, this is just to show what I mean)....

Passenger boards X9 after #9 leapfrogs stop at Addison. Passenger wants to get off at Barry, but next stop after Belmont is Diversey(there may be one in-between, but that's the next big stop according to BusTracker)

"Excuse me, sir. I wanted Barry."

"This is an Express Bus. Next stop is Diversey."

"I don't care.... I asked you to stop at Barry. Stop the bus!!!"

"I can't make a stop until Diversey, sir. That's my next stop."

"PULL THE M***********G BUS OVER, GOD D****T!!!" *Driver finally lets passenger off at Ashland and Wellington, but not before more berating and passenger taking down Bus Operator's number, Bus Number and giving him a parting shot..... something along the lines of "Dumb M**********r!!!"

Apologies for the "shouting", forum.... I was just illustrating a point of what Express Bus service will be like(those that have taken it know, I'm sure). I've seen this a lot on the X80.

1. The number of these incidents is probably related to how many local buses got cut due to lack of demand. Someone having to wait 12-15 minutes for the next local might try to pull something like this.* Note: Since you said that 9 local missed a stop it was supposed to make, sure the passenger would be irate.

2. I wonder how many of the Clever Devices said that "This is an Express Bus." The ones that have an express segment do, but this isn't like "Express to Foster and Marine."** However, I also wonder how many of these passengers have auditory comprehension problems.

3. I wonder what the response was after the passenger reported it. Some autotext about "thank you for your concerns about the CTA?"

__________

*Not much different than my comment at the Pulse meeting about "do you really expect someone will wait 25 minutes to save walking two blocks," my point being there wasn't much point to saving the local, and rely instead on community transit for the "last mile," as Pace put it.

**Transit authorities have never been able to get people to understand express zones on local streets. That's basically why 134-136 were taken off LaSalle between North and Wacker and put on LSD.

[sw4400]

1. The number of these incidents is probably related to how many local buses got cut due to lack of demand. Someone having to wait 12-15 minutes for the next local might try to pull something like this.* Note: Since you said that 9 local missed a stop it was supposed to make, sure the passenger would be irate.

2. I wonder how many of the Clever Devices said that "This is an Express Bus." The ones that have an express segment do, but this isn't like "Express to Foster and Marine."** However, I also wonder how many of these passengers have auditory comprehension problems.

3. I wonder what the response was after the passenger reported it. Some autotext about "thank you for your concerns about the CTA?"

__________

*Not much different than my comment at the Pulse meeting about "do you really expect someone will wait 25 minutes to save walking two blocks," my point being there wasn't much point to saving the local, and rely instead on community transit for the "last mile," as Pace put it.

**Transit authorities have never been able to get people to understand express zones on local streets. That's basically why 134-136 were taken off LaSalle between North and Wacker and put on LSD.

Clever Devices did make auditory announcements when the door was opened "Route X80 Irving Park Express to O-Hare Blue Line(or Harlem)". But many people don't pay no attention.... I've had people fighting in the checkout line because someone has a few more than 15 items. Two almost came to blows over it.... many people don't read or listen... they just do what they want to do. I had a lady complain about a price of an item once and while waiting for it to be checked, she said I should just give it to her because she has a Master's Degree in Business. Turns out she was wrong, long story short.... but this shows 1) How people always want everything for themselves and 2) how people like to flaunt their education at times to try to get their way.... basically saying "I'm better than you!!!"

[Busjack]

Clever Devices did make auditory announcements when the door was opened "Route X80 Irving Park Express to O-Hare Blue Line(or Harlem)". But many people don't pay no attention.... I've had people fighting in the checkout line because someone has a few more than 15 items. Two almost came to blows over it.... many people don't read or listen... they just do what they want to do.

Probably has to make a stronger one, such as "This bus only stops every half mile" or "This bus only stops at major cross streets and train stations." That might make a little difference. I doubt that many comprehend the difference between the announcement you quoted and "Route 80 Irving Park to Harlem."

[MetroShadow]

Probably has to make a stronger one, such as "This bus only stops every half mile" or "This bus only stops at major cross streets and train stations." That might make a little difference. I doubt that many comprehend the difference between the announcement you quoted and "Route 80 Irving Park to Harlem."

True, although the CD should read the next stop. It's really enforcement by the drivers at this point. Same thing with the Purple/Brown confusion when entering the loop: riders would freak out that their train went clockwise through Lake, and not down Wells.

Clever Devices did make auditory announcements when the door was opened "Route X80 Irving Park Express to O-Hare Blue Line(or Harlem)". But many people don't pay no attention.... I've had people fighting in the checkout line because someone has a few more than 15 items. Two almost came to blows over it.... many people don't read or listen... they just do what they want to do. I had a lady complain about a price of an item once and while waiting for it to be checked, she said I should just give it to her because she has a Master's Degree in Business. Turns out she was wrong, long story short.... but this shows 1) How people always want everything for themselves and 2) how people like to flaunt their education at times to try to get their way.... basically saying "I'm better than you!!!"

People feel entitled to things because of human nature. I have a Masters and I sure as heck don't feel entitled to things (maybe good weather and transit, but that's it). How that relays to the X service…I don't think this will jibe unless you have drivers who would stick to the limited-stop rule.

Edited August 20, 2015 by MetroShadow

[Busjack]

...

People feel entitled to things because of human nature. I have a Masters and I sure as heck don't feel entitled to things (maybe good weather and transit, but that's it). How that relays to the X service…I don't think this will jibe unless you have drivers who would stick to the limited-stop rule.

But it gets down to how much cr-- a driver wants to take at $33.00/hour. Especially if someone is recording it for Random CTA.

[sw4400]

People feel entitled to things because of human nature. I have a Masters and I sure as heck don't feel entitled to things (maybe good weather and transit, but that's it). How that relays to the X service…I don't think this will jibe unless you have drivers who would stick to the limited-stop rule.

Not saying everyone does(and I thank you for that, MetroShadow, that's how it should be), it's those that do like to flaunt it that get to me....

[Brandon93]

I'll have to wait to reinstate X9 and X49 on Chicagobus.org until I get details on garage assignments.

More than likely the X9 and X49 will be out of 74th and will share the same set of run numbers since the 9 runs out of 74th only and the 49 also runs out of 74th and North Park and I wouldn't be surprised if North Park got a few trips on the X49.

[artthouwill]

With the high ridership, here is an opportunity for artic service on the 49/X49.  Obviously those artics would come from NP most likely.  It would be interesting to see where the artics could come from.  Would K or 103rd have to give up some or would NP pull some from other routes?

[BusHunter]

Did you guys see on CTA facebook they have destination signs on the buses in the rahm press conference. The #X49 says 95/the plaza. They wouldn't still be in the cta program for signs from what has it been 5-6 years ago? This would seem to say where they intend to send the buses. Just scroll on the link about four stories down. I can't seem to link that story directly.

https://www.facebook.com/search/str/chicago transit authority/keywords_top

[Rahm's denim shirt]

[sw4400]

Did you guys see on CTA facebook they have destination signs on the buses in the rahm press conference. The #X49 says 95/the plaza. They wouldn't still be in the cta program for signs from what has it been 5-6 years ago? This would seem to say where they intend to send the buses. Just scroll on the link about four stories down. I can't seem to link that story directly.

https://www.facebook.com/search/str/chicago transit authority/keywords_top

It would make no sense whatsoever as there's really no mall to speak of there..... all stores closed for business in the mall 5/31/13.... maybe they're just using the old signage for display purposes, otherwise this is a stupid, useless ending point for the X49. What other point does it serve to go 16 blocks further south than 79th???

[Busjack]

Did you guys see on CTA facebook they have destination signs on the buses in the rahm press conference. The #X49 says 95/the plaza. They wouldn't still be in the cta program for signs from what has it been 5-6 years ago? This would seem to say where they intend to send the buses. Just scroll on the link about four stories down. I can't seem to link that story directly.

https://www.facebook.com/search/str/chicago transit authority/keywords_top

Apparently this does not work if one is not a member, so I can't assess if it is just a meaningless mockup.

[BusHunter]

It would make no sense whatsoever as there's really no mall to speak of there..... all stores closed for business in the mall 5/31/13.... maybe they're just using the old signage for display purposes, otherwise this is a stupid, useless ending point for the X49. What other point does it serve to go 16 blocks further south than 79th???

If this is true why then send the #48 to 87th/Damen? I can only think that there's still considerable shopping there in the version of big box retailers, Wal-mart, Sams Club and Meijer, but where would it's terminal be or how will it turn around?