Busjack Posted March 7, 2014 Report Share Posted March 7, 2014 ...When are the times of day that a busy route sees its heaviest crowds? Is it along almost the whole route or just certain stretches? That gets back to the prior debate a while back on short turning both ends of a route. Also, the tendency has been for CTA to run an artic route full time except in the case of a snow threat, which I suppose can be questioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 That gets back to the prior debate a while back on short turning both ends of a route. Also, the tendency has been for CTA to run an artic route full time except in the case of a snow threat, which I suppose can be questioned. To clarify, the exception tends to be forecasts of a weekend snow threat when it's easier to run routes with less or no artics. It can be questioned from opposite ends. One thing that can be questioned is if those snow days where the snow isn't to the degree to effect the riderships numbers too much show that some of the usual routes that get full artic coverage don't get overwhelmed by using less or no artics, is it really efficient on those no or light snow weekends keeping a lot of artics tied up on those routes when some can be freed up to help out on, though not necessarily completely cover, routes that see higher passenger volumes (notice I said volumes and not counts) due to such things as that route's weekend scheduling, passengers' riding patterns, and nearby routes in some cases only running on weekdays or having a much shorter service day than on weekdays? The other side of it is the more obvious is it smart to park so many artics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Not sure what's your point, as the Blue Line has 100s and 200s. Maybe it is early, or maybe it is something other than a block run? I was trying to say why the Blue Line had one of it's run number (130) during the morning. I find that very unusual and the last time I've seen run numbers in the X30s-higher in the morning when the Blue Line had some of it's run numbers in the 250s (I used to ride run number 254 from Racine to Forest Park a lot during my sophomore year in high school (2005-2006). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoungBusLover Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6882 is broken down from overheating which is odd because it is really cold and snowing hard down here in Brainerd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 I was trying to say why the Blue Line had one of it's run number (130) during the morning. I find that very unusual and the last time I've seen run numbers in the X30s-higher in the morning when the Blue Line had some of it's run numbers in the 250s (I used to ride run number 254 from Racine to Forest Park a lot during my sophomore year in high school (2005-2006). Your confusion (at least in the post) appears to be based on that each yard (reporting point) has its own set of run numbers. According to chicago-l.org 100s start at O'Hare, 200s start at Forest Park. If you look at the Train Tracker map, both are operating simultaneously in both directions. As I indicated earlier, you question might be why they were up to 130 instead of maybe 125, but note that chicago-l.org says that the numbers are based on when the run ends, not when it begins. Thus, for whatever reason, 130 was ending later in the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6414 and 6417 showing up on the 67, and 6416 on the 9. So it looks like they've continued on with snatching NFs from 74th now in place of 77th's junk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6414 and 6414 showing up on the 67, and 6416 on the 9. So it looks like they've continued on with snatching NFs from 74th now in place of 77th's junk. ...which apparently will be gone in 2 months. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 ...which apparently will be gone in 2 months. Not true. Deliver start is in two months so nothing significant among the old Novas will be gone in two months. And even if 74th were chosen first for 7900s which isn't necessarily a guarantee even if the prototype was shown to the media at 74th, it could take up to six months to get most of the junk out assuming the 50 new buses over two months timeframe is true and also assuming the second batch of 7900s continue delivery at 74th behind the first batch which again isn't guaranteed as far as the latter is concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6423 shows up on the 55 also. As for what 77th got from 74th, so far 1103 and 1160 show up on the 87, 1088 shows up on the 53A (it was the 9 a few days ago I believe), 1105 shows up on the 8A, and 1106 shows up on the 4. It also appears what remaining NFs at FG have made their way down to 77th as was the expectation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Yeah, you can really notice the difference in the loop with all these bus swaps, most of the buses look new now and it wasn't like that before. I think one of CTA motivations for what's happening to 74th and FG is simply those garages don't have much routes that run in the loop just the #62 and #56. A curious thing I noticed last week, there was a run on Central that was running one of last 6 NF's, saw it for two or three days straight. A garage will usually accommodate an operator if they say they prefer NF's for instance. In this case though it would probably take someone of higher seniority to have that request granted. Also there is a Blue line train that always seems to run express from Jeff Pk. To Logan Sq. around 5pm. I was on this train for two straight days and it's the same run the third day it passed me as I was a victim of it's skip stop express service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6423 shows up on the 55 also. As for what 77th got from 74th, so far 1103 and 1160 show up on the 87, 1088 shows up on the 53A (it was the 9 a few days ago I believe), 1105 shows up on the 8A, and 1106 shows up on the 4. It also appears what remaining NFs at FG have made their way down to 77th as was the expectation. So it does look like for sure the #1100's are going to 77th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 So it does look like for sure the #1100's are going to 77th. Yeah, that or most of them depending on what point they decide to stop pulling in NFs for Novas. At any rate, it's looking more like they plan to house 7900s at three garages instead of four. It is interesting that for the first time in 20 plus years of bus deliveries that it's looking more like 77th won't be on the list for new buses as it always managed to be. If we look at the deliveries of 6000s and 6400s, some garages weren't on one list and others weren't on the other. And FG wasn't on the list of garages that got new 1000s. 74th only got some because a number of 6000s kept dying and leaving a shortage. But 77th always managed to be on the new bus list going all the way back to at least the Americanas now that I think about it and take into consideration buses from the 1980s. In the case of the Americanas those were given up after 103rd opened to replace Beverly and 103rd took on a lot of routes that originally were 77th's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Yeah, that or most of them depending on what point they decide to stop pulling in NFs for Novas. At any rate, it's looking more like they plan to house 7900s at three garages instead of four. What's the third garage? BTW, I updated the roster to reflect #1083 - #1109 to 77th, #6470- #6476 to FG, #6412- #6419 to 74th (may be a few more) If 74th takes the last 50 novas at 77th, then maybe Fg will most likely gain the Chicago Novas it loses that now run the 76. If 74th transfers some of remaining NF's to C then, 74th will still have a few NF's left maybe around 40-50. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Yeah 74th did get a few more Novas #6423 and #6425 are on the #55. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted March 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 6882 is broken down from overheating which is odd because it is really cold and snowing hard down here in Brainerd. That's not impossible... if the bus has no coolant or not enough, it'll overheat regardless of ambient temp. If it's due to low oil or lack of oil it can overheat too, but also runs the risk of the bus becoming a paperweight if ran continuously like that. One known Band-Aid to fix this problem just until you can safely pull off the road is turn the heat on high in the vehicle. It might just be a leaking coolant hose, oil line or radiator. But if it's lack of coolant/oil and everything is good with the hoses, radiator and lines, then whoever serviced #6882 has a lot of explaining to do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 That's not impossible... if the bus has no coolant or not enough, it'll overheat regardless of ambient temp. If it's due to low oil or lack of oil it can overheat too, but also runs the risk of the bus becoming a paperweight if ran continuously like that. One known Band-Aid to fix this problem just until you can safely pull off the road is turn the heat on high in the vehicle. It might just be a leaking coolant hose, oil line or radiator. But if it's lack of coolant/oil and everything is good with the hoses, radiator and lines, then whoever serviced #6882 has a lot of explaining to do... And why would that person have a lot of explaining? Things can and still do fail on a bus even if serviced properly. It's still a machine after all and one thing they teach you from any engineering or automotive standpoint is no machine is 100% foolproof. All you can do is get it as close to 100% as is physically possible. Your last comment in your post is pretty much saying a bus should never break down or have anything fail even though the buses get maintenance over their service lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 What's the third garage? BTW, I updated the roster to reflect #1083 - #1109 to 77th, #6470- #6476 to FG, #6412- #6419 to 74th (may be a few more) If 74th takes the last 50 novas at 77th, then maybe Fg will most likely gain the Chicago Novas it loses that now run the 76. If 74th transfers some of remaining NF's to C then, 74th will still have a few NF's left maybe around 40-50. Chicago. Or did those 61 that are there disappear to another garage all of a sudden? Yeah they are moving things around to prep 74th and FG for possible first goes for 7900s but let's not forget Chicago does have Novas still. Even if they try to replace those with NFs from somewhere else, 81 is still big a gap to try doing that with only buses already here. So the only way I see them having 7900s at only two garages is if they only get 300 instead of 450 or if 74th loses more than just 1100s. And it really would be nice not to hear or see as many "Why can't my route/neighborhood have any of the new buses?' complaints as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Yeah some of these nova buses out here are I hate to say taped together. One operator was showing me the tape they used to keep a component attached to the bus, and I already saw the masking tape on the window of I believe #6703. They just need to keep them running a little longer and they'll be history but it's not going to be too pretty in the meantime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Plus one has to remember that even though 6882 is among the younger 6400s, it still spent years at 77th and saw some heavy service on the likes of the 2,3 4, and 79 to name a few and therefore got ran hard. And now that it's at 74th it gets a lot of mileage put on it since it occasional gets placed on the 9, CTA's longest bus route currently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artthouwill Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Chicago. Or did those 61 that are there disappear to another garage all of a sudden? Yeah they are moving things around to prep 74th and FG for possible first goes for 7900s but let's not forget Chicago does have Novas still. Even if they try to replace those with NFs from somewhere else, 81 is still big a gap to try doing that with only buses already here. So the only way I see them having 7900s at only two garages is if they only get 300 instead of 450 or if 74th loses more than just 1100s. And it really would be nice not to hear or see as many "Why can't my route/neighborhood have any of the new buses?' complaints as possible. For now I will stick with my 100 buses each for FG, 74th, and 77th, though 75 for eachof them plus 75 for Chicago is not out of the realm of possibilities. I do wonder if CTA will wait for "BRT" funding before it orders more artics. Theoretically they could still order 50 more artics, then order 100 for BRT later. Though I am not a fan of the new Novas just like I'm not a fan of the current Novas, it would be interesting if CTA wound up getting Nova artics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 For now I will stick with my 100 buses each for FG, 74th, and 77th, though 75 for eachof them plus 75 for Chicago is not out of the realm of possibilities. I do wonder if CTA will wait for "BRT" funding before it orders more artics. Theoretically they could still order 50 more artics, then order 100 for BRT later. Though I am not a fan of the new Novas just like I'm not a fan of the current Novas, it would be interesting if CTA wound up getting Nova artics. With 77th continuing to fork off its current Novas to other garages for their NFs it's looking less likely that 77th will be in contention, while Chicago has made no moves to give up Novas.That's why I say for now it's looking like they'll put 7900s at three garages instead of four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 The only way 77th would get new buses now would be to deal off the nf's which contradicts the last month. If 74th transfers 20 buses a week, they could possibly trade the #1500's to chicago, the #1100's in my opinion are already gone. They could keep the #1700's and at least they would have something. We don't know the future. Possibly in time fg could get back the #1500's from 103rd which may be done in a few months. I really have a hard time believing fg will be getting all new (241 -260) buses anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 The only way 77th would get new buses now would be to deal off the nf's which contradicts the last month. If 74th transfers 20 buses a week, they could possibly trade the #1500's to chicago, the #1100's in my opinion are already gone. They could keep the #1700's and at least they would have something. We don't know the future. Possibly in time fg could get back the #1500's from 103rd which may be done in a few months. I really have a hard time believing fg will be getting all new (241 -260) buses anyway. I would hold off on predicting whether anything leaves 74th beyond the 1100s, IF all of them are set to go. At the present rate of things, after the Novas are gone from 77th, it should be about time for the 7900s to start deliveries. The timetable for delivery start is late April to early May. Plus we still have to get through whatever changes hands among the garages for the changeover into spring pick. So things are already complicated enough on the bus swapping front. I think if Chicago were going to lose current Novas, things would have already started moving to initiate that change. One other thing, we can't be sure that 74th gave up about 13 NFs for 30 more Novas due to the gaps in sightings on both sides. That's just too big a differential in what was swapped between those two. I can agree in a way with what you were saying about FG. Just as you find it had to believe that FG is being set up to replace 241-260 buses with completely new ones, I find it hard to believe that they would be setting up 74th to get close 200 if the 1100s all get traded off. Plus if they want to keep 74th out of a position of running older model Novas 24 hours (collectively and not individually of course) a day like FG now does, they'll have to leave some NFs there. Not only that they'd need to keep enough there that those 24 hour routes can have some NFs in place from the day and evening hours to cover the owl periods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 I never said the #1700's were leaving. And if CTA is obsessed with having one bus manufacturer per garage then it only stands to reason that they would do that with chicago garage too. The next few weeks should reveal what's up with chicago garage for sure but they are most likely dealing novas to fg for the 76. I think there just not involving chicago yet cause it's too confusing. Now that fg is out of the picture let's see what happens next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 One other thing, we can't be sure that 74th gave up about 13 NFs for 30 more Novas due to the gaps in sightings on both sides. That's just too big a differential in what was swapped between those two. I can agree in a way with what you were saying about FG. Just as you find it had to believe that FG is being set up to replace 241-260 buses with completely new ones, I find it hard to believe that they would be setting up 74th to get close 200 if the 1100s all get traded off. Plus if they want to keep 74th out of a position of running older model Novas 24 hours (collectively and not individually of course) a day like FG now does, they'll have to leave some NFs there. Not only that they'd need to keep enough there that those 24 hour routes can have some NFs in place from the day and evening hours to cover the owl periods. I don't know, the transferring seems balanced to me #6412- #6425 minus #6420 for #1109-#1100, #1089, #1088. 14 novas for 12 NF's. If anything I'm looking for #1110 and #1111 to be at 77th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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