chicagopcclcar Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 You should learn transit applications rather then launching personnel attacks. Otherwise, that would show you have nothing to base your arguments. If your concerns are with our 2600 series study the MTA New York City Transit R46, 700 plus, made not some 1980s but the 1970s, built by Pullman Standard. You have heard of them? Enjoy the video! Designation Unit Numbers Manufacturer Years R-46 5482-6207 (inclusive), 6208-6258 (even #s) Pullman 1974-1975 Stainless steel 75' long, 10' wide 5482-6205 in 4-car sets (A-B-B-A; even numbers have cabs; odd numbers "blind"); 6206-6207 is an A-B set, 6208-6258 (even numbers only) are A-A sets.Cars in sets are numbered in consecutive order. Lowest number usually divides only by two. Highest number is odd. Cars originally 500-1227 (all), 1228-1278 (even). The cars were not renumbered in order. See detailed roster below for the original numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDRNLZCMqpQ#t=319 The subway cars that are older than the CTA 2200 series, but unlike the CTA, these Budds still run in service. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zh1APvgQZU 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 All I can say on the subject is boy that blue line sure is depressing!! LOL!! I got to see the Clark/Division upgrade yesterday. i can only hope some of that makes it into the blue line station rehabs, but I'm not holding my breath. I'm just thankful they have the Milwaukee Avenue elevated stretch a little faster. It's a shame that such antiquities are still present there and the rest of the system has moved into the 2000's. It not just railcars, it's stations, track on the Forest Pk branch is terribly slow and it doesn't represent "Chicago I Will" instead it sounds like "Chicago, I ignore" LOL!! Just tell your friends from out of state that when they fly into Chicago if they are using transit to fly into Midway, they'll have about a 30-100 years newer experience. (30 years for railcars, 100 for stations) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 If you figure what's left for #2600's on Red, Purple lines and replace those with #5000's, that leaves 90 cars for the Orange line. I was noticing yesterday that Howard yard was really empty for a change, the whole east yard was empty south of the shop except for 4 cars and the rest of the yard looked to have about 30 cars, mostly #2600's. If they took the fleet total down to around 360 for Red and 90 for Purple that would give the Orange line another 20-30 cars. They could actually almost equip the Brownage fleet with #5000's, but they'll still be short a few trains. You know the Brown line could actually see #5000's in the form of Brownages, but that probably would happen anyway as soon as they do some construction and merge the lines unless they are going to say only the brown line equipment operates on those days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artthouwill Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 You should learn transit applications rather then launching personnel attacks. Otherwise, that would show you have nothing to base your arguments. If your concerns are with our 2600 series study the MTA New York City Transit R46, 700 plus, made not some 1980s but the 1970s, built by Pullman Standard. You have heard of them? Enjoy the video! Designation Unit Numbers Manufacturer Years R-46 5482-6207 (inclusive), 6208-6258 (even #s) Pullman 1974-1975 Stainless steel 75' long, 10' wide 5482-6205 in 4-car sets (A-B-B-A; even numbers have cabs; odd numbers "blind"); 6206-6207 is an A-B set, 6208-6258 (even numbers only) are A-A sets.Cars in sets are numbered in consecutive order. Lowest number usually divides only by two. Highest number is odd. Cars originally 500-1227 (all), 1228-1278 (even). The cars were not renumbered in order. See detailed roster below for the original numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDRNLZCMqpQ#t=27 While your point is very well taken, New York is not Chicago. Most NYC trains run majority underground while most Chicago trains are exposed to the elements. The R46 trains make up a small fraction of the subway fleet , while the 2600s in Chicago make up nearly half of Chicago's fleet of cars. As you are aware, the R46s were extensively REBUILT to a far greater degree than the midlifes the 2600s got. Right now the 2600s are assigned to the Blue Line and that's the way it is whether anyone likes it or not. The purpose of the bus analogies in above post was to prove that assigning all of the oldest equipment in one place could jeopardize service when that equipment is prone to frequent breakdowns. Would you want that on the city's decond busiest line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 ..The purpose of the bus analogies in above post was to prove that assigning all of the oldest equipment in one place could jeopardize service when that equipment is prone to frequent breakdowns. Would you want that on the city's decond busiest line? I think that someone would prefer runaway trains from the Ashland 63-terminal,* which i think is in itself adequate proof that what you describe is already the situation on the Blue Line. There sure doesn't seem to be justification to having stocked the Green Line with 5000s. While I'm pretty sure other demographic blocks would complain if the Red Line south didn't get any new equipment, 714 cars would have come darn close to covering the Blue and Red Lines. Certainly, a convincing case hasn't been presented for delaying deployment of 7000s by about 3 years. ______ *Provides more photo ops at 59th Jct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTRSP1900-CTA3200 Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 All I can say on the subject is boy that blue line sure is depressing!! LOL!! I got to see the Clark/Division upgrade yesterday. i can only hope some of that makes it into the blue line station rehabs, but I'm not holding my breath. I'm just thankful they have the Milwaukee Avenue elevated stretch a little faster. It's a shame that such antiquities are still present there and the rest of the system has moved into the 2000's. It not just railcars, it's stations, track on the Forest Pk branch is terribly slow and it doesn't represent "Chicago I Will" instead it sounds like "Chicago, I ignore" LOL!! Just tell your friends from out of state that when they fly into Chicago if they are using transit to fly into Midway, they'll have about a 30-100 years newer experience. (30 years for railcars, 100 for stations) I agree, starting with the Forest Park branch. Maybe the Blue Line needs its own thread. I took a ride last year from UIC Halsted to Oak Park to a friend's house, and it kind of gets annoying with those 15 MPH restrictions when there's no seats on the train too. When I'm occasionally stuck in traffic on the Eisenhower, the Blue Line trains I see aren't moving much faster. Of course we can't blame this on the 2600s, since they used to blast down this stretch of track at ease (back in the days of the 2200s and the wayside signals). As a kid, I'd always get irritated watching the trains passing my car, and I'd make my dad drive over to the Green Line tracks to get home instead, only to get passed by Green Line trains too. Good luck having your friends come into Midway if they're flying international though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 I agree, starting with the Forest Park branch. Maybe the Blue Line needs its own thread. I took a ride last year from UIC Halsted to Oak Park to a friend's house, and it kind of gets annoying with those 15 MPH restrictions when there's no seats on the train too. When I'm occasionally stuck in traffic on the Eisenhower, the Blue Line trains I see aren't moving much faster. Of course we can't blame this on the 2600s, since they used to blast down this stretch of track at ease (back in the days of the 2200s and the wayside signals). As a kid, I'd always get irritated watching the trains passing my car, and I'd make my dad drive over to the Green Line tracks to get home instead, only to get passed by Green Line trains too. Good luck having your friends come into Midway if they're flying international though. Probably when they do fix the Ike along with the Blue line, the Ike will most likely take away all the extra space the Blue line has no doubt having four lanes east and west. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 You should learn transit applications rather then launching personnel attacks. Otherwise, that would show you have nothing to base your arguments. If your concerns are with our 2600 series study the MTA New York City Transit R46, 700 plus, made not some 1980s but the 1970s, built by Pullman Standard. You have heard of them? Enjoy the video! Designation Unit Numbers Manufacturer Years R-46 5482-6207 (inclusive), 6208-6258 (even #s) Pullman 1974-1975 Stainless steel 75' long, 10' wide 5482-6205 in 4-car sets (A-B-B-A; even numbers have cabs; odd numbers "blind"); 6206-6207 is an A-B set, 6208-6258 (even numbers only) are A-A sets.Cars in sets are numbered in consecutive order. Lowest number usually divides only by two. Highest number is odd. Cars originally 500-1227 (all), 1228-1278 (even). The cars were not renumbered in order. See detailed roster below for the original numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDRNLZCMqpQ#t=27 This is NOT New York City Transit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artthouwill Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 This is NOT New York City Transit! Technically, the IND, I know, but the premise of my statement still stands.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 While your point is very well taken, New York is not Chicago. Most NYC trains run majority underground while most Chicago trains are exposed to the elements. The R46 trains make up a small fraction of the subway fleet , while the 2600s in Chicago make up nearly half of Chicago's fleet of cars. As you are aware, the R46s were extensively REBUILT to a far greater degree than the midlifes the 2600s got. Right now the 2600s are assigned to the Blue Line and that's the way it is whether anyone likes it or not. The purpose of the bus analogies in above post was to prove that assigning all of the oldest equipment in one place could jeopardize service when that equipment is prone to frequent breakdowns. Would you want that on the city's decond busiest line? According to what chicagopcc has to say, I guess NYCT runs CTA!!! LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joechicago Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 Can we stay on topic here? If you want to discuss equipment allocations, start a new thread for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTRSP1900-CTA3200 Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 So we are at car numbers 547X, maybe even 548X? I know BusHunter said 5471-5472 are on the Purple Line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artthouwill Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 Can we stay on topic here? If you want to discuss equipment allocations, start a new thread for it. We are on topic. The discussion was why it was decided that the Blue Line should be excluded from receiving any 5000s. Someone thought it was justified that the Blue Line not receive any 5000s and offered up a railcar series running in New York City to support his case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 So we are at car numbers 547X, maybe even 548X? I know BusHunter said 5471-5472 are on the Purple Line.looks like they are setting up for the arrival of #5473-76 on the purple line, but the #5460's are still on the red but maybe not for much longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTRSP1900-CTA3200 Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 We are on topic. The discussion was why it was decided that the Blue Line should be excluded from receiving any 5000s. Someone thought it was justified that the Blue Line not receive any 5000s and offered up a railcar series running in New York City to support his case. Can we stay on topic here? If you want to discuss equipment allocations, start a new thread for it. I wonder what Kevin has to say. I personally think at this point the Blue Line might deserve its own thread, but I'm no moderator. If there's enough support for such a thread, I'll create one for you guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ctafan630 Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 Probably when they do fix the Ike along with the Blue line, the Ike will most likely take away all the extra space the Blue line has no doubt having four lanes east and west. It is a shame the Kennedy isn't the one with the extra space. You would certainly have room for your express service to the airport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted July 2, 2014 Report Share Posted July 2, 2014 So we are at car numbers 547X, maybe even 548X? I know BusHunter said 5471-5472 are on the Purple Line. #5477-78 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 #5477-78 They both are. (#5471-72 and #5477-78) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garmon757 Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 They both are. (#5471-72 and #5477-78)I wonder how it's going to be (Red, Yellow, and Purple Lines) when they reach the 5500 mark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam92 Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 I wonder how it's going to be (Red, Yellow, and Purple Lines) when they reach the 5500 mark? Probably they way it is now at this point floating from line to line. What ever operator grabs what set its on that line for the day :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 I wonder how it's going to be (Red, Yellow, and Purple Lines) when they reach the 5500 mark? It's hard to say where they'd be. The Red line seems to be down to about 4 or 5 #2600 trains in service and the Purple line seems to actually have more #2600's in service now if you count the number of trains in service. Ratio is about 6 #2600 trains versus 3 #5000's. If they gave the purple line all cars to #5500, then that would just about be 2/3 's of their fleet. So it's possible to say they would be on the Purple line or the Red. It all depends on how important it is to complete the fleets per line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jajuan Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 While your point is very well taken, New York is not Chicago. Most NYC trains run majority underground while most Chicago trains are exposed to the elements. The R46 trains make up a small fraction of the subway fleet , while the 2600s in Chicago make up nearly half of Chicago's fleet of cars. As you are aware, the R46s were extensively REBUILT to a far greater degree than the midlifes the 2600s got. Right now the 2600s are assigned to the Blue Line and that's the way it is whether anyone likes it or not. The purpose of the bus analogies in above post was to prove that assigning all of the oldest equipment in one place could jeopardize service when that equipment is prone to frequent breakdowns. Would you want that on the city's decond busiest line? Hence my point about CTA for decades holding on to equipment for longer intervals than you see with other TAs and therefore getting new equipment less frequently being the real problem here when it comes to each part of the city having equipment in the best state of repair possible. The areas served by 74th suffered with this way of doing things when it was stocked with only 6000s when the 6000s were at retirement age. Most of the city had to contend with it because of NP, Kedzie, and 103rd having only retirement age 4400s and/or 5300s on their 40 footer rosters and the hand me down 7300s for artics (NP and 103rd) when the last Americana 4000s were taken from revenue service. But not getting newer cars from the 714 5000 series cars isn't the only way the Blue Line suffers. That whole line is a shambles and crumbling. The stations on the whole line are antiquated, and the Forest Park branch tracks run along tracks overrun by weeds every year making that side of the Blue Line look even more run down and neglected. But thinking on it though, maybe the reason the Blue Line isn't getting 5000s and has to wait for the 7000s to come five years down the road due to part of the same line of reasoning they used to sell the south side on a complete shutdown of the Dan Ryan leg of the Red Line to complete that project, not wanting to have run newer equipment on infrastructure scheduled for some rehab project. They kind of ran that reasoning through a few cycles though with the Blue Line (if they even are using the same thinking in this situation) in that knowing the 7000s are going to take at least five years to acquire they went with the four year weekend only schedule for rehabbing the O'Hare Blue Line branch in addition to the decision wait for the 7000s to place new cars and replace 2600s on the Blue Line. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 ...They kind of ran that reasoning through a few cycles though with the Blue Line (if they even are using the same thinking in this situation) in that knowing the 7000s are going to take at least five years to acquire they went with the four year weekend only schedule for rehabbing the O'Hare Blue Line branch in addition to the decision wait for the 7000s to place new cars and replace 2600s on the Blue Line. Aside from the flaming of me over CTA going back on its rationale for the Red Line project, given that the O'Hare branch project is just scattered band aids for the next four years, and apparently nothing gets done on the Forest Park segment until IDOT says so, if this is the real rationale, 5750 has a reason to get inflamed. Maybe whoever runs for mayor in 2019 will be on a platform of "suddenly I discovered slow operations on the Blue Line." Anyway, the 5000s were tested on all lines, so theoretically they should be able to run on them. Also, the Blue Line got new signals south of Jefferson Park, for what we suppose was also to enable running any cars there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagopcclcar Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hence my point about CTA . ........They kind of ran that reasoning through a few cycles though with the Blue Line (if they even are using the same thinking in this situation) in that knowing the 7000s are going to take at least five years to acquire they went with the four year weekend only schedule for rehabbing the O'Hare Blue Line branch in addition to the decision wait for the 7000s to place new cars and replace 2600s on the Blue Line. Several points you have made. Others should note. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagopcclcar Posted July 3, 2014 Report Share Posted July 3, 2014 Aside from the flaming of me over CTA ............. 5750 has a reason to get inflamed. Still stirring up discontent. When will you learn? "I think that someone would prefer runaway trains from the Ashland 63-terminal,*" said Busjack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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