Spring Pick 2016

[renardo870]

Well, it might be a little early to talk about this but there is a rumor that 74th might be sharing the 9/X9 Ashland and Ashland Express with Kedzie. It would be cool to see Artics on Ashland. Kedzie also be giving up 120, 121 and 157 routes to garages TBA. I heard this today from a Kedzie operator while I was at Belmont. 

[ajm522]

56 minutes ago, renardo870 said:

Well, it might be a little early to talk about this but there is a rumor that 74th might be sharing the 9/X9 Ashland and Ashland Express with Kedzie. It would be cool to see Artics on Ashland. Kedzie also be giving up 120, 121 and 157 routes to garages TBA. I heard this today from a Kedzie operator while I was at Belmont. 

I also heard 120, 121 and 125 being sent to another garage.  The 157 wasn't mentioned though. 

[BusHunter]

What ever happened to 77th doing the #X9/9? I wonder why the urge all of a sudden to purge buses from 74th? Are they overcrowded? I know Kedzie is overcrowded. I don't know what they would gain by putting part of the Ashland service to be ran out of Kedzie. Still Kedzie is overcrowded. Really what serves all those crosstown routes best is a north and south garage. They had that on the #8 with Limits and now it's gone. It's nutty to see 77th pullins at Belmont/Lake Shore Drive. NP could fill in some of those north side pullins and you could get artics that way on Ashland. I already see a few on the #49. 

[Busjack]

3 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

I don't know what they would gain by putting part of the Ashland service to be ran out of Kedzie.

It would remove the imbalance that everything that ends at Irving Park has to go back to 74th.* The question, implied by renardo's post is what 74th gets in return.

________

*As opposed to 49 X49 being pretty balanced between 79th and Berwyn terminals.

[orionbuslover]

All of these routes changing garages sounds like a system pick.

[BusHunter]

16 hours ago, Busjack said:

It would remove the imbalance that everything that ends at Irving Park has to go back to 74th.* The question, implied by renardo's post is what 74th gets in return.

________

*As opposed to 49 X49 being pretty balanced between 79th and Berwyn terminals.

Probably something on the south boundaries of Kedzie. Could be maybe the #39 or #62. 

[wordguy]

The #62 is already assigned to 74th.   

Ashland did once operate as a split route between Kedzie & 69th,  from the mid-fifties until the early sixties.  But that was back in a day when the CTA had several more garages with a great deal more storage space.   I can't figure out how such a split would be doable now.   As many other posters have noted,  K is already well beyond capacity.  So are the other garages north of Madison Street.

It seems to me that the reason that both Halsted and Ashland are each assigned to only one South Side garage is that neither Kedzie nor North Park have any room.   What the CTA really needs is another garage at least somewhat north.   An ideal location would be the central supply shop at 901 W.  Division.   If the size of the property is limited,  the garage itself could be bi-level.   (New York's MTA has at least two such facilities in Manhattan;  one is bi-level,  the other is several stories high).   The surrounding area is industrial and it's a great location.

Also,  if Kedzie was to give up any routes,  where would they go?   I suppose the #120 & #121 could be interlined,  but that's only a few buses.   I guess the #52 could be reassigned to 74th,  but that would create more unbalanced barn runs like Halsted's and Ashland's.

If the CTA is really planning to follow through with the rumored changes for the spring pick,   I'm just not sure they'd make sense.

Then again,  maybe splitting the #9 and the #52 between 74th & Kedzie might work.

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, wordguy said:

Ashland did once operate as a split route between Kedzie & 69th,  from the mid-fifties until the early sixties.

To my personal knowledge, at least in the late 60s into the 80s, it was split between Limits and 69th. Halsted was split between Limits and 77th. According to Chicago Transit and Railfan, those bus routes were assigned to Limits in 1952m but K had 9 from 1957 to 1964, when it went back to Limits.

1 hour ago, wordguy said:

What the CTA really needs is another garage at least somewhat north.

.That gets back to the discussion of the Fisk Garage, apparently another empty promise from Claypool.

 

[BusHunter]

Wordguy might be on to something with the #52 to 74th and Kedzie. If they interlined it with the #52A, (74th buses only and somehow make #52A a 74th route.) they could do all their reliefs out south although I don't know why they just couldn't relieve at the Orange line as you have the link with #94 not far away. Then you could leave the #52A alone. I still don't quite get why they are doing #53A and #52A to 77th unless it's because of reliefs can't get to 74th that easy.

[Sam92]

11 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Wordguy might be on to something with the #52 to 74th and Kedzie. If they interlined it with the #52A, (74th buses only and somehow make #52A a 74th route.) they could do all their reliefs out south although I don't know why they just couldn't relieve at the Orange line as you have the link with #94 not far away. Then you could leave the #52A alone. I still don't quite get why they are doing #53A and #52A to 77th unless it's because of reliefs can't get to 74th that easy.

My guess is that from 77th one could take the 79 bus straight down to their respective points vs 74th which doesn't really have a route from the area that goes that far west without having to take a second ride cause the closet route I know that goes that far west would be 67.

[artthouwill]

22 hours ago, Busjack said:

To my personal knowledge, at least in the late 60s into the 80s, it was split between Limits and 69th. Halsted was split between Limits and 77th. According to Chicago Transit and Railfan, those bus routes were assigned to Limits in 1952m but K had 9 from 1957 to 1964, when it went back to Limits.

.That gets back to the discussion of the Fisk Garage, apparently another empty promise from Claypool.

 

Until Fisk is built,  I suppose Kedzie will have to do.   Perhaps CTA will revisit splitting the 8 between 77th and Kedzie.   As far as trades, I would expect 74th to gain 35th and 39 Pershing  

[jajuan]

And if Kedzie were to share 9/X9, in order to get some artics on there they'd have to give up a current route that makes a heavier use of artics since its artics are virtually all eaten up by 125, 134, 143, 151 and 156 on weekdays during the rush periods with very few to spare. So unless one of those was getting given up, any theoretical gain of part of the 9/X9 coverage wouldn't see very many artics from Kedzie's end if at all. And moving 120/121 would necessitate uncoupling the current interline Kedzie currently has in place between those, 125, 134 and 156. 

[ajm522]

10 hours ago, Sam92 said:

My guess is that from 77th one could take the 79 bus straight down to their respective points vs 74th which doesn't really have a route from the area that goes that far west without having to take a second ride cause the closet route I know that goes that far west would be 67.

Yeah in picks past (probably still is) the relief point was 79th and Kedzie for the 52A

[wordguy]

4 hours ago, jajuan said:

And if Kedzie were to share 9/X9, in order to get some artics on there they'd have to give up a current route that makes a heavier use of artics since its artics are virtually all eaten up by 125, 134, 143, 151 and 156 on weekdays during the rush periods with very few to spare. So unless one of those was getting given up, any theoretical gain of part of the 9/X9 coverage wouldn't see very many artics from Kedzie's end if at all. And moving 120/121 would necessitate uncoupling the current interline Kedzie currently has in place between those, 125, 134 and 156. 

Does Ashland really need artics to begin with?   If my memory serves me,  you've expressed your doubts about that in the past,  Jajuan.   You're probably right.  And as you say,  K's artics are already well spoken for during peak travel periods.

I had forgotten that the 120 & 121 were already interlined with other Kedzie routes.   So there's really no garage space available for any transferred K routes,  unless as Artthouwill suggested,  the 35 &  39 migrate to 74th.   Then again,  as I mentioned earlier,  maybe a 52 split --- possibly even 94 (S. California) as well --- might make sense.

[jajuan]

1 minute ago, wordguy said:

Does Ashland really need artics to begin with?   If my memory serves me,  you've expressed your doubts about that in the past,  Jajuan.   You're probably right.  And as you say,  K's artics are already well spoken for during peak travel periods.

I had forgotten that the 120 & 121 were already interlined with other Kedzie routes.   So there's really no garage space available for any transferred K routes,  unless as Artthouwill suggested,  the 35 &  39 migrate to 74th.   Then again,  as I mentioned earlier,  maybe a 52 split --- possibly even 94 (S. California) as well --- might make sense.

At this point with the return of X9, I doubt it now even more than I did when I first made the argument that it doesn't. This past month even with school back in session, the X9 seems to have stabilized things and evened things out among passengers. I see a much smaller number of buses during the rush periods with a lot of standees on board. I see routes at other garages that probably need artics on the road along with the 40 foot standards already there far more than Ashland does. 

[TaylorTank1229]

Any word on any route changes to schedules and/or routing, or new routes or something? 

[andrethebusman]

Only definite route shift is that some Ashland school trippers will be going to Kedzie. Other planned changes (but NOT being implemented as of 3/16 according to run sheets) are return of 11 as far south as Fullerton, return of 31st Street, and possible discontinuance of 170-UofC/Midway.

As far as Ashland is concerned, for years there were several morning runs from Limits that worked up to Lakeview HS at Irving Park, then went into 153 or 156 service. I imagine Lakeview still needs some trippers that would probably come across Jackson to Ashland, go up to Irving Park, then go over to Irving Park/Clarendon and the 135.

170's fate seems to be based on the idea that since Hyde Park Exp (not subsidized) runs on 60th in what is at UofC's rush direction, why bother with a separate shuttle that UofC has to pay for?

[Busjack]

14 minutes ago, andrethebusman said:

Only definite route shift is that some Ashland school trippers will be going to Kedzie.

Probably means that supposed major shifts will not happen.

[Mr.cta85]

As far as the pick is concerned I will be taking my talents to 74st Garage at the start of the spring pick lol. Once I get there I'll keep you guys posted concerning the routes and buses just like I do at 103rd ?

[Busjack]

4 minutes ago, Mr.cta85 said:

As far as the pick is concerned I will be taking my talents to 74st Garage at the start of the spring pick lol. Once I get there I'll keep you guys posted concerning the routes and buses just like I do at 103rd ?

Any reason for the move? You really want to be a block from Derrick Rose's boyhood home where someone got shot yesterday?

[Mr.cta85]

7 hours ago, Busjack said:

Any reason for the move? You really want to be a block from Derrick Rose's boyhood home where someone got shot yesterday?

Im from Englewood as well lol so im familiar with the routes. And plus I've always wanted to work out of 74th, as a kid I always wanted to one-day drive the bus routes I grew up riding like the 9 Ashland and the 63rd street route. I'm not worried about any shootings or anything of the Englewood activities lol. This Chicago, you can get shot anywhere I this city ??

[BusHunter]

45 minutes ago, Mr.cta85 said:

Im from Englewood as well lol so im familiar with the routes. And plus I've always wanted to work out of 74th, as a kid I always wanted to one-day drive the bus routes I grew up riding like the 9 Ashland and the 63rd street route. I'm not worried about any shootings or anything of the Englewood activities lol. This Chicago, you can get shot anywhere I this city ??

It's probably no worse than the wild #100's at 103rd as far as shootings. Blair Holt was killed in 103rd territory. At least now you'll have a tank sneeze guard!! 74th though doesn't have as many feeders and has more main lines, so you'll work harder there. There are some less crowded routes there like the #59 or those around Midway. But 77th is the hardest working place to go, that's why they go through buses so fast. Now you can see what's it's like to drive the longest CTA route Ashland or try out the #49 or X service. The only thing I don't like about 74th is that the reliefs make it harder to get to the garage. It's definitely probably one of the places you would use a car more to travel to/from the garage. I don't know what you do if you pullout though and don't pullin. I guess you walk from #67 or take a #94, #67 combo.  

[Mr.cta85]

45 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

It's probably no worse than the wild #100's at 103rd as far as shootings. Blair Holt was killed in 103rd territory. At least now you'll have a tank sneeze guard!! 74th though doesn't have as many feeders and has more main lines, so you'll work harder there. There are some less crowded routes there like the #59 or those around Midway. But 77th is the hardest working place to go, that's why they go through buses so fast. Now you can see what's it's like to drive the longest CTA route Ashland or try out the #49 or X service. The only thing I don't like about 74th is that the reliefs make it harder to get to the garage. It's definitely probably one of the places you would use a car more to travel to/from the garage. I don't know what you do if you pullout though and don't pullin. I guess you walk from #67 or take a #94, #67 combo.  

Yea you're right about the 9 and 49 im actually very excited to do both of those routes, I've actually did the 9 before last summer out of my garage believe it or not and I was in a 4300 too lol but definitely excited about the 49 too. As far as the relief points go I'll look into it once I get over there so I'll know which routes to pick and not pick lol. But you're absolutely right about the wild 00's comparison ?.

[Sam92]

46 minutes ago, Mr.cta85 said:

Yea you're right about the 9 and 49 im actually very excited to do both of those routes, I've actually did the 9 before last summer out of my garage believe it or not and I was in a 4300 too lol but definitely excited about the 49 too. As far as the relief points go I'll look into it once I get over there so I'll know which routes to pick and not pick lol. But you're absolutely right about the wild 00's comparison ?.

I can tell you off hand I see a lot of reliefs as well as pullins via Ashland for east/west routes like 55, 63, 59, 67, 47. Then north south lines of course use 74th and are pretty close to where you probably can walk from those streets or take the 75 74th/75th

[jajuan]

10 hours ago, Busjack said:

Any reason for the move? You really want to be a block from Derrick Rose's boyhood home where someone got shot yesterday?

It's likely no different than him driving for 103rd which as BH pointed out serves the Roseland area which is about just as rough. And as we can see CTA85 is still here and in one piece. And CTA5750 drove for Kedzie garage which also serves some rough areas, he too fortunately is still here. 74th country isn't the only place you can get shot. As a matter of fact how many operators have we heard of being shot? Not many if any at all.

58 minutes ago, Mr.cta85 said:

Yea you're right about the 9 and 49 im actually very excited to do both of those routes, I've actually did the 9 before last summer out of my garage believe it or not and I was in a 4300 too lol but definitely excited about the 49 too. As far as the relief points go I'll look into it once I get over there so I'll know which routes to pick and not pick lol. But you're absolutely right about the wild 00's comparison ?.

As Sam pointed out, east-west routes from 74th you're likely going to relieve at Ashland and north-south at 74th Street or 75th Street along the #75. #49 you might be relieving at the 79th Western terminal though. And of course for #94 right at the garage itself since the layover is done on the side of the garage from the training map Andre showed a scan of when that route first got extended to Damen/74th.