New Eldorados?

[busfan2847]

I was surprised to see an eldo (#2790) on the #606 yesterday. Never thought I'd see one there.

Northwest only sends out Eldorados on the weekend.

[BusHunter]

Northwest only sends out Eldorados on the weekend.

The other bus that day on #606 was an Orion. It was just weird to put an eldo on that route going to Woodfield. It gets way more ridership than the #208 over there. I guess after seeing them on #272 and #270 anything is possible. Haven't seen them on #290 yet. Maybe that's next.

[Busjack]

The other bus that day on #606 was an Orion. It was just weird to put an eldo on that route going to Woodfield. It gets way more ridership than the #208 over there. I guess after seeing them on #272 and #270 anything is possible. Haven't seen them on #290 yet. Maybe that's next.

Slightly off topic, but given what Pace says about their IBS analytics, including how it now enables them to cut specific trips without cutting the route, one could assume that they know how many passengers are riding on each trip in a typical situation, and also probably on a monthly basis. Hence, undoubtedly why NW is now running Eldos on 208, 250, and 606 on weekends.

While a few sightings, such as on 270 or that qwante reported, are undoubtedly the result of interlining, I doubt that Eldos are going to show up on the top 5 routes, which include 290. Also, as someone asked me on a Yahoo group--after I had said that Pace had charts showing the recovery ratio, ridership, and productivity on routes subject to restructuring in 2005--if they were correct, I responded "How am I supposed to challenge that?"

In fact, I am somewhat surprised that NW unloaded its existing ElDos when it got the stimulus ones.

[MetroShadow]

Northwest only sends out Eldorados on the weekend.

290 ran Orions all day Sunday.

[Busjack]

Northwest only sends out Eldorados on the weekend.

290 ran Orions all day Sunday.

Showing how stuff gets ambiguous real quickly.

The original reference was to route 606.

Pretty much, Orions on weekends are on 270, 272, and 290, and Eldos elsewhere where NW runs on weekends.

[Busjack]

This thread may not be entirely dead yet. The Agenda for the March 2, 2011 meeting includes "Ordinance authorizing a sole source contract for the purchase, manufacture, and delivery of four (4) thirty foot low floor diesel transit buses."

[Busjack]

The March board minutes confirm that they purchased the 4 from, you guessed it, ElDorado National.

No explanation why they were needed.

[BusHunter]

The March board minutes confirm that they purchased the 4 from, you guessed it, ElDorado National.

No explanation why they were needed.

Probably they'll be in a green livery. That seems to be the eco friendly look for pace.

[Busjack]

Probably they'll be in a green livery. That seems to be the eco friendly look for pace.

No, since they are diesels.

[Busjack]

Maybe the correct thread:

Physical sighting. And now that it's mentioned, it did look like that bus was a tad bit longer than the others. It's very different in the back too. I wish I had gotten a pic to show. If I see one on the COD route, I'll be sure to take it.

The "different back" gives me the thought: Could 2766 have been a prototype for 2826-2829? 2766 has the perforated back, and, according to Webwatch yesterday, was in the same 530-714 service as 2827-2828.

I should have counted seats when 2766 was up at Pace Headquarters as a photo backdrop, but didn't.

Maybe rjl has some insight on that.

[rotjohns]

2700 and 2701 appear to be on the move; routes 668 and 669 are using smaller paratransit buses to accommodate their passengers. Saw one yesterday while riding Metra and just noticed it this morning on Passenger Notices. This might be a trend coming soon on other routes in Dupage county, because I have seen several routes lately in the Darien/Westmont area that appear to not have very many passengers on it.

[Busjack]

2700 and 2701 appear to be on the move; routes 668 and 669 are using smaller paratransit buses to accommodate their passengers. Saw one yesterday while riding Metra and just noticed it this morning on Passenger Notices. This might be a trend coming soon on other routes in Dupage county, because I have seen several routes lately in the Darien/Westmont area that appear to not have very many passengers on it.

Would also include 2699, as that contract was assigned two buses and a spare (and I had seen 2699 there).

At the time I wouldn't have thought about it, but in retrospect, it seemed strange that (1) three buses were dedicated to those 2 routes, instead of coming out of the Westmont pool, and (2) while I was only rarely there, I didn't see more than a few passengers at either stop.

The only thing that is comparable (other than McHenry) is that 674 was running a paratransit between when the 2500s fell apart and the contract for Lombard-Wheaton was awarded to to MV, which also got 2727-2735.

As I figure it, that makes 9 Eldos to be reassigned--4 as a result of Aurora getting 2826-2829, 2 as a result of Highland Park getting 2830-2831, and these three. In the meantime, the Orion Is are becoming more scarce at NS, but it appears that is from 6600s showing up more often, as opposed to getting more 2600s. Maybe offsetting that is that Joliet might need a couple more for 755/855, but the only thing I saw on Webwatch is that 2765 is in Joliet.

[Busjack]

Checking sites for Orions, I came upon the CPTD board on Pace, which has a verifiable source (Metro Magazine) that 2826-2829 have Navistar MaxxForce 9 engines instead of the usual Cummins 6.7. Both confirm that those are 32' buses.

From Metro Magazine, apparently it has "stump pulling" torque (as C&D would put it)

Also, despite the comment I made about CPTD a couple of months ago, it appears that they have updated their Pace page. They point out that 2766 was at BusCon, but not why it is different from all the rest, i.e. the perforated back and always being the backdrop for photoshoots.

[MVTArider]

Checking sites for Orions, I came upon the CPTD board on Pace, which has a verifiable source (Metro Magazine) that 2826-2829 have Navistar MaxxForce 9 engines instead of the usual Cummins 6.7. Both confirm that those are 32' buses.

From Metro Magazine, apparently it has "stump pulling" torque (as C&D would put it)

Also, despite the comment I made about CPTD a couple of months ago, it appears that they have updated their Pace page. They point out that 2766 was at BusCon, but not why it is different from all the rest, i.e. the perforated back and always being the backdrop for photoshoots.

Thanks goes to Andre for sharing updated roster info. with us over at CPTDB.

Also the purpose of this post, Mr. Bernero posted this excellent shot of 2829: Pace 2829. I wanted to post the link for those who may not have seen them in person.* I do declare it looks like a tough little cookie for pulling a stump with

*Apologies if this was already shared elsewhere.

[Busjack]

...

Also the purpose of this post, Mr. Bernero posted this excellent shot of 2829: Pace 2829. I wanted to post the link for those who may not have seen them in person.* I do declare it looks like a tough little cookie for pulling a stump with

...

I hadn't felt like going out to Aurora to chase a couple of buses down.

However, the only thing that indicates that it is a 32' rather than 30' is the rather prominent "snout."

[andrethebusman]

Sopmething to chew on: El Dorados 2600-2828 all have the "descriptor" part of the VIN (digits 3 to 8) of MNAC6. 2829, by itself is MNAND. This would seem to indicate that while 2826-2828 are identical to earlier ones mechanically, 2829 is NOT. Any ideas??

[artthouwill]

It is almost time for those 40' Eldo buses to start arriving at the Pace Acceptance Facility in South Holland. I guess the question remains who will get them first, South or West? My understanding was that South would get them first to replace the 2400s, then replace the 6600s, and eventually move the 6162 NABIs to West. However with Pace slated to build a CNG fueling station at South and eventually receiving about 75 CNG buses afterward, does this shift Pace's thinking into providing West with the new Eldos first, moving the 40' NABIs southward to replace the aging 2400s and then 6600s. Either way it goes, eventually Pace will have to replace whatever is at South with CNG buses down the line anyway. The only thing that assigning the new buses at West first will accomplish (besides breaking a promise that South would get them first) is that those buses won't be shifted around and can stay at one garage for most (if not all) of their service life. Depending on how many Eldos are actually coming, perhaps they can either phase out the Orions at West or Northwest also.

As for the OTRs that will be coming, I assume either Heritage and/or South will get those.

[rotjohns]

It is almost time for those 40' Eldo buses to start arriving at the Pace Acceptance Facility in South Holland. I guess the question remains who will get them first, South or West? My understanding was that South would get them first to replace the 2400s, then replace the 6600s, and eventually move the 6162 NABIs to West. However with Pace slated to build a CNG fueling station at South and eventually receiving about 75 CNG buses afterward, does this shift Pace's thinking into providing West with the new Eldos first, moving the 40' NABIs southward to replace the aging 2400s and then 6600s. Either way it goes, eventually Pace will have to replace whatever is at South with CNG buses down the line anyway. The only thing that assigning the new buses at West first will accomplish (besides breaking a promise that South would get them first) is that those buses won't be shifted around and can stay at one garage for most (if not all) of their service life. Depending on how many Eldos are actually coming, perhaps they can either phase out the Orions at West or Northwest also.

As for the OTRs that will be coming, I assume either Heritage and/or South will get those.

There never was a lot of 2400s to begin with and there are very little of them now, especially South. Those will be the first to go. Now whether a handful of them end up at Waukegan for school trippers remains to be seen, but the 6600s should also head to Waukegan to remove the remaining 2400s in service. That leaves the Orions, some of them 12 years old now, some of them a bit younger. I'd have to think it's going to take a couple of years before all of the Orions are gone. I'm excited to see the new buses once they arrive.

[pace2322]

Looks like West will get the new 40 foots, 6325 is at West right now.

[MetroShadow]

Looks like West will get the new 40 foots, 6325 is at West right now.

I'll assert that the new buses start at 6323.

[RJL6000]

Looks like West will get the new 40 foots, 6325 is at West right now.

In this case, then expect some of West's existing 35- and 40-foot NABIs to be reassigned to the South and North Divisions in the coming months to retire the remaining 1993 Orions and most of the 1999 NABIs. The ElDorado Axxess buses at West could also replace all of West's remaining 2000-01 Orions (which would then be reassigned to either Northwest or Southwest).

[rotjohns]

In this case, then expect some of West's existing 35- and 40-foot NABIs to be reassigned to the South and North Divisions in the coming months to retire the remaining 1993 Orions and most of the 1999 NABIs. The ElDorado Axxess buses at West could also replace all of West's remaining 2000-01 Orions (which would then be reassigned to either Northwest or Southwest).

This is a stark contrast to those buses going to South. I'd wonder if the reason for it is because South really doesn't do a great job taking care of their buses, while West does. I'd also note that most of the time there are new 40-foot buses that come to Pace since I've lived in Chicago 12 years ago, they've been at West to start. Maybe South requested Nabis. Who knows....

[Busjack]

... The ElDorado Axxess buses at West could also replace all of West's remaining 2000-01 Orions (which would then be reassigned to either Northwest or Southwest).

While stranger things have happened, I wouldn't be betting on that because...

• All NW and SW have are Orion VIs and ARRA Eldorados, and hence have no need for more of the same buses.
• If we accept the September Minutes that this delivery is only 62 buses, that isn't enough to retire much more than the Orion Is and 1999 NABIs at S, N, and NS. If any more are coming, then the Orion VIs would be the next to be retired, so no point further shifting them around.

I'd also note that most of the time there are new 40-foot buses that come to Pace since I've lived in Chicago 12 years ago, they've been at West to start. Maybe South requested Nabis. Who knows....

That's definitely not true. South got the first 2401s. Also, while the Orion Vis (6000-6143) were originally spread evenly among the 4 big divisions (NW, W, SW, and S), S got the 6162 series NABIs first, and gave up their Orion VIs to mostly NW. Also, W had to rely on Elgin getting ElDos and shifting some of their 6600s to West (as well as W getting 6600s from other places) to retire the remaining Ikarus buses.

The only thing that probably can be said here, and is reflected in the Minutes, is that the strategy changed once Pace decided to get CNGs for S. Also, W might need a couple of more buses to take over 317 rush hour runs.

[BusHunter]

Most likely West will get all of these 62 Axess buses. It just seems a matter of what will they transfer. #6162's, the #6262's or even the #6600's. If Pace is getting more next year (Pace budget says 108 with 13 more possibly from another manufacturer) that would be enough to replace the NW Orions.

[Busjack]

Most likely West will get all of these 62 Axess buses. It just seems a matter of what will they transfer. #6162's, the #6262's or even the #6600's. If Pace is getting more next year (Pace budget says 108 with 13 more possibly from another manufacturer) that would be enough to replace the NW Orions.

If you go back to that budget, it is only 13 diesels; the rest are 75 CNGs and 20 OTRs.

As I noted earlier, the question is the 2012 budget, as amended 2 times, which called for 156 diesels and 15 OTRs. The September minutes indicate "Director Mitchell asked where the replacements for the leased coaches on I-55 are in the budget. Mr. Brannon said some of them are in the 2012 budget."