More Bus Moves

[wordguy]

NFs 1188, 1189, and 1190 are at FG now (maybe 1187 and 1191 too). Anyone know if more Novas or Flxibles transferred out of FG in this newest swap?

Always expect the unexpected. It looks as if 1188-1191 were swapped for the low 1200s with the Titan display ads. Yep, after a very short stint at FG, 1200, 1201, 1204, & 1206 appear to have returned to Kedzie.

[sw4400]

These back and forth moves are kinda confusing.... Why couldn't 1188-1191 have been sent to FG in the beginning instead of 1200,1201,1204 and 1206? Both sets of four were at Kedzie the whole time.

[BusExpert32]

Ok. So the NF (50), Nova (122), and Flxible (74) counts at FG weren't affected by this swap.

[New Flyer]

1611 at 103rd

[jacksone44]

1611 at 103rd

Yes it is. along with 1605, 1607, 1609, 1613.

[jajuan]

Always expect the unexpected. It looks as if 1188-1191 were swapped for the low 1200s with the Titan display ads. Yep, after a very short stint at FG, 1200, 1201, 1204, & 1206 appear to have returned to Kedzie.

This is true. 1201 was on the 12 yesterday. I rode it. I noticed that FG wasted no time putting an 'F' sticker on it. It also has a 'K' sticker on the inner part of the windshield. Either FG never removed it or Kedzie reapplied it.

[artthouwill]

Ok the major shuffle will be coming up soon. The way I figure:

1. 74th would lose it retired Flxs and get the equivalent of Novas from Archer to replace them

2. FG would lose its retired Flxs and get the equivalent of Novas from Archer to replace them

3. K will lose its retired Flxs and get more Flyers by:

A. 103rd retiring Flxs and sending Flyers to K in exchange for comparable amount of Nova

B. C retiring Flxs and sending Flyers to K in exchange for comparable amount of Novas

Basically, I don't think K or NP will get any Novas. If things were done properly, each of the 7 remaining garages would have around 65 or so Novas, and who knows maybe the lawsuit alleging discrimination may make CTA go that route, but I will wait and see.

[Busjack]

Ok the major shuffle will be coming up soon. The way I figure:

1. 74th would lose it retired Flxs and get the equivalent of Novas from Archer to replace them

2. FG would lose its retired Flxs and get the equivalent of Novas from Archer to replace them

3. K will lose its retired Flxs and get more Flyers by:

A. 103rd retiring Flxs and sending Flyers to K in exchange for comparable amount of Nova

B. C retiring Flxs and sending Flyers to K in exchange for comparable amount of Novas

Basically, I don't think K or NP will get any Novas. If things were done properly, each of the 7 remaining garages would have around 65 or so Novas, and who knows maybe the lawsuit alleging discrimination may make CTA go that route, but I will wait and see.

Your conclusion doesn't work, because it would result in FG having about 80% Novas (the ones it has plus the ones you say it would get).

Anyway, this calculus has to take into account that the outdoor yards have to get equipment with the fast start capacitors. Of course, we don't know which ones are those.

[sw4400]

This is just speculation based on current D40LF number patterns at the garages and the CTA possibly organizing the garages numerically after the 6000's are retired:

After Feb. 7th, when the Flxibles are retired and Archer Garage closes*

North Park might get #1700-1750, #1798, #1799

Forest Glen might get #1100-1187

Chicago might get #1000-1030, #1088-1099, #1300-1317, #1366-1399, #1901-1925(odds), #1930-1980(evens)

Kedzie might get #1600-1605, #1607-1613(odds)

74th might get #1500-1529

77th might get #1200-1247

103rd might get #1850-1899

Any rolling stock losses at garages from number swaps that aren't replenished by other numbered New Flyer D40LF's will be replaced by NOVAs from Archer.

The 1400's and 1700's are too spread out to determine which garage might get them. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1700's, I'd say North Park based on how many are currently there as opposed to the other garages. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1400's, then Chicago would get them for the same reason... quantity at their garage.

*Unless CTA decides to keep Archer Garage open and/or not retire all the 6000's on Feb. 7th.

[Guest]

This is just speculation based on current D40LF number patterns at the garages and the CTA possibly organizing the garages numerically after the 6000's are retired:

After Feb. 7th, when the Flxibles are retired and Archer Garage closes*

North Park might get #1700-1750, #1798, #1799

Forest Glen might get #1100-1187

Chicago might get #1000-1030, #1088-1099, #1300-1317, #1366-1399, #1901-1925(odds), #1930-1980(evens)

Kedzie might get #1600-1605, #1607-1613(odds)

74th might get #1500-1529

77th might get #1200-1247

103rd might get #1850-1899

Any rolling stock losses at garages from number swaps that aren't replenished by other numbered New Flyer D40LF's will be replaced by NOVAs from Archer.

The 1400's and 1700's are too spread out to determine which garage might get them. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1700's, I'd say North Park based on how many are currently there as opposed to the other garages. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1400's, then Chicago would get them for the same reason... quantity at their garage.

*Unless CTA decides to keep Archer Garage open and/or not retire all the 6000's on Feb. 7th.

Where are the routes going now?

[sw4400]

Where are the routes going now?

I can't speculate on any but one... Western. Despite what some have said, I think 77th will get it. This garage is located on 79th street, and according to gooroo.com(link to results here. I don't know if this link will work, however). If not plan a trip in gooroo, you can see how far 77th St. Garage is from S. Western(the beginning of the route)

[artthouwill]

Your conclusion doesn't work, because it would result in FG having about 80% Novas (the ones it has plus the ones you say it would get).

Anyway, this calculus has to take into account that the outdoor yards have to get equipment with the fast start capacitors. Of course, we don't know which ones are those.

On your first point, that means nothing considering Archer has almost all Novas now (other than Optimas).

On your second point, FG already has Novas and it is an outdoor garage.

Again, I don't see K and NP getting Novas. Even if FG gets an increased share of NFs, it will come at 103rd or C, or both's expense and they will get a larger share of Novas.

[Busjack]

On your first point, that means nothing considering Archer has almost all Novas now (other than Optimas).

On your second point, FG already has Novas and it is an outdoor garage.

Even if FG gets an increased share of NFs, it will come at 103rd or C, or both's expense and they will get a larger share of Novas.

You basically missed the point.

Your original conclusion was " each of the 7 remaining garages would have around 65 or so Novas"

Now, if FG already has about 120 Novas, and gets Novas to replace its Flxs, then that garage will have about 215 Novas.* That doesn't come to 65 or so, unless you are saying that FG would lose 150 of the 215 you say it either has or will get.

_____

*Numbers approximate, as I don't have the roster, but estimating that FG has aboaut 255 buses minus about 15 Optimas and 25 NFs.

[qwantae]

You basically missed the point.

Your original conclusion was " each of the 7 remaining garages would have around 65 or so Novas"

Now, if FG already has about 120 Novas, and gets Novas to replace its Flxs, then that garage will have about 215 Novas.* That doesn't come to 65 or so, unless you are saying that FG would lose 150 of the 215 you say it either has or will get.

_____

*Numbers approximate, as I don't have the roster, but estimating that FG has aboaut 255 buses minus about 15 Optimas and 25 NFs.

So it means that Archer's 500s Optimas are going to 74th for Midway Routes #55N/A, 62H, 63W, and 170-173?

[Busjack]

So it means that Archer's 500s Optimas are going to 74th for Midway Routes #55N/A, 62H, 63W, and 170-173?

We don't know at the moment.

I think it is more likely that 55A/N or W,* and 63W get interlined with 55 or 63. Not on a formal basis, but that the sign on a 55, upon just pulling into 59th and whatever the side street is at the Midway Terminal, flips to 55N. Then there isn't a relief issue, as, at some point, the bus will cross Ashland.

The real concentration of 500s (other than the U of C routes) is on 39 and 43. Given speculation that 35, 39, and 43 would be assigned to 77th for relief via the Red Line, and the U of C is closer to 77th than 74th, my betting is that they go to 77th.

Of course, until we hear something from close to an official source, who can tell.

_____________

*BTW, we still haven't heard why the proposed consolidation of 55A and 55N didn't happen as scheduled.

[rmadisonwi]

*BTW, we still haven't heard why the proposed consolidation of 55A and 55N didn't happen as scheduled.

Because the alderman for that area bitched (on the basis of five complaints from people who didn't want to walk two blocks to the new 55W, or to the existing 63W) and, since the CTA presidency is just an extension of Mayor Daley's cabinet, the change (which would have saved half a million dollars in operating costs per year) was canceled at the last minute.

So, while the folks riding up and down Milwaukee Avenue will see their #56 stop running at 10:30 pm (after all, the Blue Line makes convenient stops every half mile or so), all of the both people who really need the 55A or 55N (and couldn't make the quarter-mile walk to a different bus stop) will still get their empty bus running up and down the street every so often, just in case they one day decide to actually use it.

Seriously, if you ever want to see CTA improve, you absolutely have to get these useless politicians voted out of office. CTA can't possibly thrive when the mayor just uses it as another place to stash his cronies.

[Busjack]

Because the alderman for that area bitched...

Seriously, if you ever want to see CTA improve, you absolutely have to get these useless politicians voted out of office. CTA can't possibly thrive when the mayor just uses it as another place to stash his cronies.

I'm glad someone else said it.

From the ward map, it looks like 23rd Ward Michael Zalewski. Doesn't hit me as a big name, like Lipinski trying to preserve the 99s and 164.

In any event, Booz-Allen proposed implementing a community transit solution 13 years ago, and that sure hasn't happened, either.

[trainman8119]

Seriously, if you ever want to see CTA improve, you absolutely have to get these useless politicians voted out of office. CTA can't possibly thrive when the mayor just uses it as another place to stash his cronies.

Bravo Bravo Bravo !!!!! Couldn't have sait it better myself. That was sort of my point way back, when at the time I was expressing that a true and independendt leader is one who will make decisions that would benefit the company as a whole and not a minute few. This applies to the nonsensical recent lawsuits, the poor decision made on service changes, the constant political management shuffle, bikes, station closures, equipment purchases, constant rants of poor...the list goes on and on.

Seriously, as long as the service boards are operated as political offices instead of businesses, they are destined to get worse and deteriorate worse than the infrastructure.

[Guest]

Because the alderman for that area bitched (on the basis of five complaints from people who didn't want to walk two blocks to the new 55W, or to the existing 63W) and, since the CTA presidency is just an extension of Mayor Daley's cabinet, the change (which would have saved half a million dollars in operating costs per year) was canceled at the last minute.

So, while the folks riding up and down Milwaukee Avenue will see their #56 stop running at 10:30 pm (after all, the Blue Line makes convenient stops every half mile or so), all of the both people who really need the 55A or 55N (and couldn't make the quarter-mile walk to a different bus stop) will still get their empty bus running up and down the street every so often, just in case they one day decide to actually use it.

Seriously, if you ever want to see CTA improve, you absolutely have to get these useless politicians voted out of office. CTA can't possibly thrive when the mayor just uses it as another place to stash his cronies.

Its a no win situation because the politicians eyeing to unseat Daley are just as useless. There wont be any good changes, in my opinion they are only going to get worse.

[jajuan]

This is just speculation based on current D40LF number patterns at the garages and the CTA possibly organizing the garages numerically after the 6000's are retired:

After Feb. 7th, when the Flxibles are retired and Archer Garage closes*

North Park might get #1700-1750, #1798, #1799

Forest Glen might get #1100-1187

Chicago might get #1000-1030, #1088-1099, #1300-1317, #1366-1399, #1901-1925(odds), #1930-1980(evens)

Kedzie might get #1600-1605, #1607-1613(odds)

74th might get #1500-1529

77th might get #1200-1247

103rd might get #1850-1899

Any rolling stock losses at garages from number swaps that aren't replenished by other numbered New Flyer D40LF's will be replaced by NOVAs from Archer.

The 1400's and 1700's are too spread out to determine which garage might get them. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1700's, I'd say North Park based on how many are currently there as opposed to the other garages. If I had to firmly speculate on the 1400's, then Chicago would get them for the same reason... quantity at their garage.

*Unless CTA decides to keep Archer Garage open and/or not retire all the 6000's on Feb. 7th.

Some monkey wrenches in your admitted speculation are 1200s from 77th's lower still seem to be still be siphoning up to FG, the latest odd 1600 moves went to 103rd rather than Kedzie, not mention what 1200s that went from Kedzie to FG went back Kedzie. And lower end 1500s actually seem to be concentrated at 103rd. Half of NF D40LFs on the 14 yesterday morning were from the range you speculate as heading to 74th. 74th's 1500s are actually of the higher end from what I've seen, the lowest ones I've been able to observe being in the 1550s. I really don't see much numerical sequencing in garage assignments given that the sequences are more out of whack in many respects under Rodriguez than under Huberman. Just taking the NOVAs, 6400s are split between Archer and 77th, 6700s are split even more between the current three NOVA garages, and 6800s are split betwween FG and 77th. With Archer biting the dust, there's no telling how they'll get scattered about since they will not only have to get new homes but also replace the 6000s that also bite the dust with Archer.

[artthouwill]

You basically missed the point.

Your original conclusion was " each of the 7 remaining garages would have around 65 or so Novas"

Now, if FG already has about 120 Novas, and gets Novas to replace its Flxs, then that garage will have about 215 Novas.* That doesn't come to 65 or so, unless you are saying that FG would lose 150 of the 215 you say it either has or will get.

_____

*Numbers approximate, as I don't have the roster, but estimating that FG has aboaut 255 buses minus about 15 Optimas and 25 NFs.

No. My original post said that if things were done properly, each garage should have about 65 Novas. I said however, that I thought that K and NP would not wind up with Novas.

[cta_44499_FG]

A few of Forest Glen Nova's found their way over to North Park today. I was driving 6758 on the 22 Clark and 155 Devon this evening.

Probably day loaners.

[rl12383]

A few of Forest Glen Nova's found their way over to North Park today. I was driving 6758 on the 22 Clark and 155 Devon this evening.

Probably day loaners.

Just saw nova 6487 on the ashland express... Looks like they are starting to move buses already

[BusHunter]

Just saw nova 6487 on the ashland express... Looks like they are starting to move buses already

#6497 is also out on the #9. Also yesterday and today a few #6090's are appearing at Chicago. Today #6097 is on the #76 and #6090 is on I think the #74. There was another one yesterday but I forgot which one.

[Busjack]

Just saw nova 6487 on the ashland express... Looks like they are starting to move buses already

#6497 is also out on the #9. ...

If this is more than a temporary fill in, one could come to the conclusion that CTA is again acting by indirection, since aren't these 77th buses? However, since Archer has to operate for another 4 days (inclusive of today), I think that the temporary fill in is more likely.