Dan Ryan Track Renewal Project

[CURRENTZ_09]

Well, no more fussing about this online, because now can ask all the tough questions in person

Chicago Transit Authority Announces Two Public Meetings on Red Line South Track Renewal Project on Tuesday June 12th, 2012

Additional Meeting Dates Coming Soon

The Chicago Transit Authority (CTA) today announced the dates for the first in a series of public meetings in advance of next year's Red Line South Track Renewal Project. CTA officials will explain the work, answer questions and receive feedback from customers who will be impacted by the project. This input will help CTA complete the project as effectively as possible.

"It's very important to us to have a dialogue with the community about our plans to improve the Dan Ryan branch of the Red Line," said Terry Peterson, Chairman of the Chicago Transit Board. "We want them to know that we are doing everything in our power to make their travel as smooth as possible during the five-month project, and it's important for us to hear their thoughts about what we can do to further aid in that process."

Two public meetings have been scheduled and several more will be announced in the coming weeks. The meetings will be held on the following dates:

Monday, June 18, 2012

South Shore Cultural Center*

7059 S. South Shore Drive

Chicago, IL 60649

Time: 6 p.m. until 8 p.m. (Doors Open at 5 p.m.)

Thursday, June 21, 2012

Kennedy-King College Gymnasium*

6343 S. Halsted

Chicago, IL 60621

Time: 6 p.m. until 8 p.m. (Doors Open at 5 p.m.)

*All facilities are accessible to people with disabilities.

"After years of neglect and patchwork improvements, the South Side of Chicago will finally have premium rail service with improved stations and a commute that is 20 minutes faster," said Forrest Claypool, CTA President. "We are also working with the Chicago Urban League and other organizations to ensure that everyone, especially South Siders, has access to information about the jobs and contracting opportunities this project will create."

Members of the public who are unable to attend these meetings can submit written correspondence via email at redlinesouth@transitchicago.com or mail it to Red Line South Project, CTA, 567 W. Lake Street, Chicago, IL, 60661.

Be there or be Square, if you want to voice your opinion, then be there because I will and am also willing to do a meet and greet with anyone, visit me on facebook.com/corey.k.ellison for contact information!!

[Mike Payne]

CTA plans to use “Shuttle Buses” (Express and Local) to replace the Red Line service — This plan however is fraught with possibilitys for disaster: A traffic accident, a fire, bad weather and/or storms — MANY things could easily disrupt such a service, and cause thousands to be late for (or miss) their jobs, or important events

At just about any large event – CTA can assign portable Fare Boxes (at the back door of busea, and/or additional spaces in an ‘L’ station, like at Addison on the Red Line).

Compensation and/or Distribution of Fares and Funds collected throught CTA, Metra, and Pace could be done at the Accounts Payable Accounts Receivable level - through the RTA - Riders would have to learn NO new Fare Procedure or Charges, other than what is presently used on the 'L' System.

With Minimal changes to the Metra Electric Infrastructure, you could assign TA Staff with portable Fareboxes (and a Cop) at the bottom of the MED station stairs (111th, 103rd, 95th, 87th, 83rd, 79th, 75th, etc., etc., etc…….), or in the station house — to control access to the platforms, and then just run the MED trains more frequently; there would be NO Frae Collection of any type on-board the trains.

This service would terminate at 111th St., so as not to interfere with Metra University Park and NICTD trains.

NO (or fewer) “Shuttle Buses” needed, and as an added benefit Far South riders would not have to ride down to 95th t. to transfer to a “Shuttle”, to transfer to the Green Line at Garfield, to finally get where their going (3 vehicle changes, no matter what the fare situation).

CTA and Pace bus routes from the Far South (#’s 34, 103, 106, 108, 111, 112, 352, 353, etc., etc…) could Terminate at 111th & Cottage Grove instead of 95th & State — GREATLY reducing travel times and fuel usage.

CTA and Metra should consider this idea, because once the PUBLIC gets ahold of the possibilty of a R A I L alternative, I don’t think they will be satisfied with “Shuttle Buses”!

I will be at ALL of those CTA Town Hall meetings to distribute Gray Line literature, hope to see you there.

[CURRENTZ_09]

CTA plans to use “Shuttle Buses” (Express and Local) to replace the Red Line service — This plan however is fraught with possibilitys for disaster: A traffic accident, a fire, bad weather and/or storms — MANY things could easily disrupt such a service, and cause thousands to be late for (or miss) their jobs, or important events

At just about any large event – CTA can assign portable Fare Boxes (at the back door of busea, and/or additional spaces in an ‘L’ station, like at Addison on the Red Line).

Compensation and/or Distribution of Fares and Funds collected throught CTA, Metra, and Pace could be done at the Accounts Payable Accounts Receivable level - through the RTA - Riders would have to learn NO new Fare Procedure or Charges, other than what is presently used on the 'L' System.

With Minimal changes to the Metra Electric Infrastructure, you could assign TA Staff with portable Fareboxes (and a Cop) at the bottom of the MED station stairs (111th, 103rd, 95th, 87th, 83rd, 79th, 75th, etc., etc., etc…….), or in the station house — to control access to the platforms, and then just run the MED trains more frequently; there would be NO Frae Collection of any type on-board the trains.

This service would terminate at 111th St., so as not to interfere with Metra University Park and NICTD trains.

NO (or fewer) “Shuttle Buses” needed, and as an added benefit Far South riders would not have to ride down to 95th t. to transfer to a “Shuttle”, to transfer to the Green Line at Garfield, to finally get where their going (3 vehicle changes, no matter what the fare situation).

CTA and Pace bus routes from the Far South (#’s 34, 103, 106, 108, 111, 112, 352, 353, etc., etc…) could Terminate at 111th & Cottage Grove instead of 95th & State — GREATLY reducing travel times and fuel usage.

CTA and Metra should consider this idea, because once the PUBLIC gets ahold of the possibilty of a R A I L alternative, I don’t think they will be satisfied with “Shuttle Buses”!

I will be at ALL of those CTA Town Hall meetings to distribute Gray Line literature, hope to see you there.

I will be attending the Thursday June 21st meeting, how will i know where to get the Grey Line literature?

[Busjack]

....

With Minimal changes to the Metra Electric Infrastructure, you could assign TA Staff with portable Fareboxes (and a Cop) at the bottom of the MED station stairs (111th, 103rd, 95th, 87th, 83rd, 79th, 75th, etc., etc., etc…….)...

I replied to Scooter Libby on the CTA Tattler, and I will give you essentially the same reply here.

You are all hung up on the manner of fare collection, and trying to impose on Metra all sorts of additional costs for CAs just because you have a strange belief in an controlled paid area system, which was eliminated from the ME.

The issue is a simple one, which I raised in my response to art: Is CTA willing to give some of its Build Illinois money to Metra to honor CTA passes, or is it going to spend it on free shuttle buses? That's it.

I also responded to your "be at the cultural center" point on the Tattler. At least CurrentZ is honest enough that all he wants is the handouts.

[CURRENTZ_09]

I replied to Scooter Libby on the CTA Tattler, and I will give you essentially the same reply here.

You are all hung up on the manner of fare collection, and trying to impose on Metra all sorts of additional costs for CAs just because you have a strange belief in an controlled paid area system, which was eliminated from the ME.

The issue is a simple one, which I raised in my response to art: Is CTA willing to give some of its Build Illinois money to Metra to honor CTA passes, or is it going to spend it on free shuttle buses? That's it.

I also responded to your "be at the cultural center" point on the Tattler. At least CurrentZ is honest enough that all he wants is the handouts.

I mean i heard about the project, so to be able to learn more about the Gray line, why not have documentation and let it sink into my head so i can understand it

[Busjack]

I mean i heard about the project, so to be able to learn more about the Gray line, why not have documentation and let it sink into my head so i can understand it

He's had (for about 10 years) a website explaining it. You can rest assured that he hasn't changed in his position.

[Mike Payne]

I replied to Scooter Libby on the CTA Tattler, and I will give you essentially the same reply here.

You are all hung up on the manner of fare collection, and trying to impose on Metra all sorts of additional costs for CAs just because you have a strange belief in an controlled paid area system, which was eliminated from the ME.

The issue is a simple one, which I raised in my response to art: Is CTA willing to give some of its Build Illinois money to Metra to honor CTA passes, or is it going to spend it on free shuttle buses? That's it.

I also responded to your "be at the cultural center" point on the Tattler. At least CurrentZ is honest enough that all he wants is the handouts.

The Barrier method of fare collection is to keep non-riders off the platforms and trains; we have problems on the 'L' right now - even WITH barrier controls, how would it be with open-access platforms like Metra:

http://www.chicagotr...-on-me-20120613,0,2965145.story

Also - busjack, you certainly have (just as I do) the right to submit any plan you like (or not) to CTA, Metra, RTA, and/or Pace.

I will submit the plan I created - as I choose.

[Busjack]

The Barrier method of fare collection is to keep non-riders off the platforms and trains; we have problems on the 'L' right now - even WITH barrier controls, how would it be with open-access platforms like Metra:

http://www.chicagotr...-on-me-20120613,0,2965145.story

Also - busjack, you certainly have (just as I do) the right to submit any plan you like (or not) to CTA, Metra, RTA, and/or Pace.

I will submit the plan I created - as I choose.

Whatever your rationale, you sure don't get the point.

Which is why you have been spectacularly unsuccessful.

[Mike Payne]

Whatever your rationale, you sure don't get the point.

Which is why you have been spectacularly unsuccessful.

What point is it I don't get?

[MetroShadow]

The Barrier method of fare collection is to keep non-riders off the platforms and trains; we have problems on the 'L' right now - even WITH barrier controls, how would it be with open-access platforms like Metra:

http://www.chicagotr...-on-me-20120613,0,2965145.story

Not sure where the correlation is with this.

If you're finding issues with security, Metra does (for the most part) enforce security for drunkards and fare-beaters alike (maybe the former). These are punk teenagers and I'm certain they have no idea that Metra doesn't allow for it.

If you're asking about the response to fare-beating, then that would be Metra's discern since they already got dinged for a lack of enforcement and working to fix that. Even if you have the masses shifting to the Rock and Electric (and even with Grey Line implementation to make a stretch), you'd better make sure that the powers that be enforce fare collection (or accomodate those who have no idea what to do).

[Busjack]

What point is it I don't get?

The one that I put in bold. Maybe I should have used 72 point type.

[Sam92]

The one that I put in bold. Maybe I should have used 72 point type.

In other words Mike, do you think CTA is going to pay a competing agency to help provide service during the project. Keep in mind before you answer that, that cta has already stolen a substantial amount of metra service from that line through routes 6 and 14 and the riders dont seem to keen about going back to metra anytime soon. in fact, according to a handout CTA plans on beefing up the 14,.26, 30 and 71 during the project.

[Busjack]

In other words Mike, do you think CTA is going to pay a competing agency to help provide service during the project. Keep in mind before you answer that, that cta has already stolen a substantial amount of metra service from that line through routes 6 and 14 and the riders dont seem to keen about going back to metra anytime soon. in fact, according to a handout CTA plans on beefing up the 14,.26, 30 and 71 during the project.

CTA might do it for the 5 months they claim that the project will take, but not as a permanent matter. And, as you point out, not on the South Chicago branch, but maybe on the Kensington local and RI.

Essentially you raise the same point I raised about 8 years ago, shortly after the CTA south lakeshore restructuring was done, i.e. people had voted with their feet, and the only way that at least the South Chicago branch would work is if CTA canceled the express buses and forced riders to transfer at 71st and Jeffery, where there doesn't seem to be a place to build a multimodal center to transfer to a train in the median.

In that CTA got the money for the Jeffery BRT, you know CTA isn't going to subsidize the South Chicago branch.

[Mike Payne]

Not sure where the correlation is with this.

If you're finding issues with security, Metra does (for the most part) enforce security for drunkards and fare-beaters alike (maybe the former). These are punk teenagers and I'm certain they have no idea that Metra doesn't allow for it.

If you're asking about the response to fare-beating, then that would be Metra's discern since they already got dinged for a lack of enforcement and working to fix that. Even if you have the masses shifting to the Rock and Electric (and even with Grey Line implementation to make a stretch), you'd better make sure that the powers that be enforce fare collection (or accomodate those who have no idea what to do).

That is the exact point of using the CTA barrier system and fare cards, no one has to learn any new procedures.

Fare payment would be the same as on any other 'L' line - using the same instruments - how would you collect fares on a huge crowded 4 car rush hour train making stops every 4 blocks, loading and unloading MANY at each stop?

Do you think the Red or Orange Line extension stations will have other than CTA TVM's and Turnstiles; why - and/or why not?

[Mike Payne]

Not sure where the correlation is with this.

If you're finding issues with security, Metra does (for the most part) enforce security for drunkards and fare-beaters alike (maybe the former). These are punk teenagers and I'm certain they have no idea that Metra doesn't allow for it.

If you're asking about the response to fare-beating, then that would be Metra's discern since they already got dinged for a lack of enforcement and working to fix that. Even if you have the masses shifting to the Rock and Electric (and even with Grey Line implementation to make a stretch), you'd better make sure that the powers that be enforce fare collection (or accomodate those who have no idea what to do).

That is the exact point of using the CTA barrier system and fare cards, no one has to learn any new procedures, or how to use new or different Fare instruments. Reconciliation of Fares collected, and distribution could be handled by the RTA

Fare payment would be the same as on any other 'L' line - using the same instruments - how would you collect fares on a huge crowded 4 car rush hour train making stops every 4 blocks, loading and unloading MANY at each stop?

Do you think the Red or Orange Line extension stations will have other than CTA TVM's and Turnstiles; why - and/or why not?

[Busjack]

That is the exact point of using the CTA barrier system and fare cards, no one has to learn any new procedures, or how to use new or different Fare instruments.

Sorry, Mike. You said on the CTA Tattler people from outside Chatham shouldn't talk about what's good for the potential nonpassengers, but you are living in 1998.

Because of the open fare media system, which is supposed to be on CTA and Pace in about 2014, even they will have to learn about new fare instruments and collection methods, unless they are using only the taxi access program. Not to mention how Metra will cope with the legislative mandate by 2015.

And BTW, did you do what I suggested on the CTA Tattler and look up how much CTA charged Skokie for the obsolete fare equipment for Oakton pursuant to an intergovernmental agreement? Then multiply that by how many station entrances will need barriers, plus the cost of how many new stations your consultant wants to build?

[MetroShadow]

That is the exact point of using the CTA barrier system and fare cards, no one has to learn any new procedures, or how to use new or different Fare instruments. Reconciliation of Fares collected, and distribution could be handled by the RTA

Fare payment would be the same as on any other 'L' line - using the same instruments - how would you collect fares on a huge crowded 4 car rush hour train making stops every 4 blocks, loading and unloading MANY at each stop?

Do you think the Red or Orange Line extension stations will have other than CTA TVM's and Turnstiles; why - and/or why not?

Are you referring (or proposing) to place barriers at every station along the Kensington/Blue Island/SoChi branches? I'm sure any cost and time savings/benefits would be instantly negated.

If you're asking on how to collect, you use the conductors, maybe hire an extra conductor for the 2 1/2 service corridors. If they've done it in the past and now, they'll likely step up for five months.

As for that last question: Do you think that people would just farebeat at Ford City, 115th or 107th for shiggles? It's not LA's or the Metro Light Rail with an honor system. The answer is pretty obvious. Because it's not prudent to exclude 4 or 5 stations out of a dozen for that purpose of a lack of TVM or Fare Machine period.

[CURRENTZ_09]

Here is an infomational Packet about the Dates, times and locations about the community meetings coming this week. I will put it like this really simple, if you don't go to the 2 meetings and ACTUALLY HEAR WHAT THEY SAY, then after the last one, you really shouldn't have too much of an input on this discussion, because we have all made educated guesses on how this is going to go down and now the CTA is finally giving us a platform to discuss all of our concerns.

Chicago Transit Authority Red South Track Renewal Community Meetings.pdf

[jajuan]

Here is an infomational Packet about the Dates, times and locations about the community meetings coming this week. I will put it like this really simple, if you don't go to the 2 meetings and ACTUALLY HEAR WHAT THEY SAY, then after the last one, you really shouldn't have too much of an input on this discussion, because we have all made educated guesses on how this is going to go down and now the CTA is finally giving us a platform to discuss all of our concerns.

Like it or not, you can't stop people from voicing their opinion on any given issue. You can only control whether you take in what it is they have to say.

[Busjack]

...and now the CTA is finally giving us a platform to discuss all of our concerns.

CTA has reportedly given slight indications that the board will listen, but only slight.

I'll leave it as that.

[Mike Payne]

Are you referring (or proposing) to place barriers at every station along the Kensington/Blue Island/SoChi branches? I'm sure any cost and time savings/benefits would be instantly negated.

If you're asking on how to collect, you use the conductors, maybe hire an extra conductor for the 2 1/2 service corridors. If they've done it in the past and now, they'll likely step up for five months.

As for that last question: Do you think that people would just farebeat at Ford City, 115th or 107th for shiggles? It's not LA's or the Metro Light Rail with an honor system. The answer is pretty obvious. Because it's not prudent to exclude 4 or 5 stations out of a dozen for that purpose of a lack of TVM or Fare Machine period.

Metro - could you translate that last paragraph to English? (what are "shiggles")

[Busjack]

... in fact, according to a handout CTA plans on beefing up the 14,.26, 30 and 71 during the project.

Which brings up another point. 30 has been routed to 69-Dan Ryan since the Dan Ryan station opened.

However, the current 71, since about 2003, supersedes the former 27-South Deering, which terminated essentially at the 63-King Dr. Green Line station, the rationale for the change being that the riders rather get to the Red Line.

So, was there any talk about, in effect, reinstating the old 27 routing?

[Mike Payne]

Are you referring (or proposing) to place barriers at every station along the Kensington/Blue Island/SoChi branches? I'm sure any cost and time savings/benefits would be instantly negated.

If you're asking on how to collect, you use the conductors, maybe hire an extra conductor for the 2 1/2 service corridors. If they've done it in the past and now, they'll likely step up for five months.

As for that last question: Do you think that people would just farebeat at Ford City, 115th or 107th for shiggles? It's not LA's or the Metro Light Rail with an honor system. The answer is pretty obvious. Because it's not prudent to exclude 4 or 5 stations out of a dozen for that purpose of a lack of TVM or Fare Machine period.

http://chicago.cbslo...-shutdown-plan/

CTA Turnstiles (Tim Boyle/Getty Images)

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construction, CTA, dan ryan,Public Hearings, Red Line,ShutdownUpdated 06/13/12 – 6:18 p.m.

CHICAGO (CBS) — CTA officials have been working hard behind the scenes to have some answers to placate South Side Red Line riders when two public hearings take place next week on the reconstruction project, and its scheduled five month shutdown.

"Folks from Altgeld Gardens could face three-hour trips to get to their jobs downtown," said rider Michael Payne, in comments to the CTA's board Wednesday.

He said a bus-dependent plan is fraught with problems in the event of accidents and the inevitable rush-hour traffic tie-ups.

LISTEN: WBBM Newsradio's Bob Roberts reports

CTA Chairman Terry Peterson said that has already been anticipated, and said Thursday that he has initiated talks at the highest level to minimize problems.

He said he has met with Acting Metra Chairman Larry Huggins and that CTA President Forrest Claypool and Metra CEO Alex Clifford also have spoken.

The focus is how Metra can adjust schedules on its Electric and Rock Island Districts to accommodate more riders.

The Electric District's lines, in particular, were built for far more riders than it carries today. Payne suggested setting up CTA fare equipment at Electric District stations and letting riders use either fare card.

Peterson asked Payne for a detailed proposal.

The first hearing of the hearings will occur 6-8 p.m. Monday at the South Shore Cultural Center, 7059 S. South Shore Dr. CTA will host a second hearing at the same time Thursday in the gymnasium of Kennedy-King College, at 6343 S. Halsted St.

CTA will reroute Red Line trains to the Green Line, and close the south Red Line stations from Cermak/Chinatown to 95th, for complete track reconstruction and other upgrades. The $425 million project is the second round of heavy overhaul on the line since 2004, although CTA officials say this will be the most complete renovation since the line opened in 1969.

Peterson said his goal is to operate trains, without slow zones, at a minimum of 55 miles an hour. The shutdown will allow the work to be completed in five months instead of an estimated four years if limited to off-peak and weekend hours. CTA expects train schedules to be shortened by 10 minutes once the work is completed in the fall of 2013.

The CTA will also provide shuttle buses to Green Line rail stations as an alternative during the Red Line project. The closures affect nine stations, between the 95th Street terminal and the Roosevelt 'L' station. (See map below)

Here is the tentative re-route plan for the CTA Red line. (Credit: CTA)

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[Sam92]

Which brings up another point. 30 has been routed to 69-Dan Ryan since the Dan Ryan station opened.

However, the current 71, since about 2003, supersedes the former 27-South Deering, which terminated essentially at the 63-King Dr. Green Line station, the rationale for the change being that the riders rather get to the Red Line.

So, was there any talk about, in effect, reinstating the old 27 routing?

Dont know if 71 is going to take the old south deering route. The handout just states that the 14 and 26 would get beefed up service for people going downtown along with the 30 and 71. Some other routes were mentioned too but I brought up those 4 in particular to explain how little influence the gray line would have compared to CTA routes in that area.

[Mike Payne]

Which brings up another point. 30 has been routed to 69-Dan Ryan since the Dan Ryan station opened.

However, the current 71, since about 2003, supersedes the former 27-South Deering, which terminated essentially at the 63-King Dr. Green Line station, the rationale for the change being that the riders rather get to the Red Line.

So, was there any talk about, in effect, reinstating the old 27 routing?

That is an excellent idea jack, route the #30 South Chicago there also.