More Bus Moves

[jajuan]

That would make sense if the consensus now is to have buses with more seats/non longitudinal. They could send those over to FG as they have a little weaker ridership, but the #77 could use the extra standing space on those if it's never going to get artics. It does make sense too to send the #7900's to 77th first as the NF transfer was related to problems there with operator safety. Maybe when they did the transfer before the thinking was that they would be getting Novas by May so the NF's could go back to FG. It's really surprising to me that they have let the oldest buses run at FG especially for the ball games because that reflects on the city. But maybe running alot of NP #1000's is trying to compensate and also you have the few #4300's, but mostly those are used on school trips.

You keep mentioning how certain bus and rail placements reflect on the city, but I don't think TAs in any city assign their equipment based on what model of what looks nice and pretty for some tourist. Their larger concern is having something available to provide adequate service for all parties concerned, period, which is how it is supposed to be as long as that equipment is being maintained well as best as can be. On that note, I've been looking at FG's roster of buses since the big trade and the start of spring pick a few weeks after the start of that trade (as I live a practical a few steps off the 84 Peterson route), and was actually thinking to myself that a good number of the former 77th Novas now at FG look shinier and in better condition than when they were assigned at 77th. That frankly says a lot about FG's maintenance crews given that garage's entire bus roster is now filled with the system's oldest bus model. I give them a lot of credit for those buses looking so good relatively speaking despite my not being all that much a fan of the 6400 series overall.

[BusHunter]

I really don't see a difference in maintenance. If anything maintenance is worse because they have to maintain all these old buses. I have yet to ride a bus with good AC at FG and that was a common occurance not that long ago. The seat inserts are still pretty pathetic on 77th's fleet of novas. I've been seeing alot of stranded buses on the side of the road but what can we expect. The maintenance at FG are not miracle workers. i think they are one good heatwave from having a serious problem, but they are lucky I think the next 30 days don't have a 90 plus degree day yet. They could probably make it unscathed if some NF's came over pretty quickly, but I bet if they are worried about safety, 74th probably could use the shields ahead of FG, but I don't see a reason why FG couldn't get back what they lost about 50-60 NF buses.

[jajuan]

I really don't see a difference in maintenance. If anything maintenance is worse because they have to maintain all these old buses. I have yet to ride a bus with good AC at FG and that was a common occurance not that long ago. The seat inserts are still pretty pathetic on 77th's fleet of novas. I've been seeing alot of stranded buses on the side of the road but what can we expect. The maintenance at FG are not miracle workers. i think they are one good heatwave from having a serious problem, but they are lucky I think the next 30 days don't have a 90 plus degree day yet. They could probably make it unscathed if some NF's came over pretty quickly, but I bet if they are worried about safety, 74th probably could use the shields ahead of FG, but I don't see a reason why FG couldn't get back what they lost about 50-60 NF buses.

Well I can't speak for what might be happening on other FG routes. I'm telling you what I observe on the one FG route I'm located closest to, and I don't see the huge turn to worst you're talking about. What I'm seeing on the 84 are still put together pretty good with no shot AC systems, and those include what former 77th Novas get assigned to that route. So the maintenance crews at FG are keeping up pretty good and doing something right considering what they have to work on with that garage's entire roster being made up with a model set for retirement in some form. And if the smallest bit of what you're saying is true, I'd say that's an argument for FG being the first to get 7900s, and as everyone else said or implied, 77th being dead last to get any 7900s if in fact it does get them. Saying it makes sense for 77th, which as has been observed has all NF D40LFs on its 40 foot roster and has a good number of them rehabbed meaning relatively fewer maintenance problems, to be first for 7900s while jumping to say the 6400s at FG are falling apart just doesn't jibe or make much sense. You can't have it both ways on those arguments even if you state that the part of the result of giving 77th 7900s first might force a return of NFs to FG, which isn't necessarily the guaranteed result. For all you know those displaced Novas could just as likely get steered back to Chicago or 74th. But let's say for a second things were to occur along the lines you're stating. Why get back seven to eight year buses right away, even if that model is being rehabbed, when your garage has the chance to get brand new ones right away instead? Weren't you the one going right along with 5750 in making the argument that FG has been getting ignored in favor of the south side in getting new 40 foot buses? Although I disagree with that particular argument as far as past bus deliveries and assignments go, what you're saying about 77th getting 7900s making sense doesn't jibe with that and actually works in the opposite direction of what you were saying previous while making that big stink that FG getting short changed on bus deliveries. Again you're trying to have it both ways whether you recognized it or not. If FG has been getting shortchanged as you said previously, would it make more sense for it to get NFs back after it got 7900s and not before?

[artthouwill]

You keep mentioning how certain bus and rail placements reflect on the city, but I don't think TAs in any city assign their equipment based on what model of what looks nice and pretty for some tourist. Their larger concern is having something available to provide adequate service for all parties concerned, period, which is how it is supposed to be as long as that equipment is being maintained well as best as can be. On that note, I've been looking at FG's roster of buses since the big trade and the start of spring pick a few weeks after the start of that trade (as I live a practical a few steps off the 84 Peterson route), and was actually thinking to myself that a good number of the former 77th Novas now at FG look shinier and in better condition than when they were assigned at 77th. That frankly says a lot about FG's maintenance crews given that garage's entire bus roster is now filled with the system's oldest bus model. I give them a lot of credit for those buses looking so good relatively speaking despite my not being all that much a fan of the 6400 series overall.

One could argue that you are saying that 77th's maintenance is shoddy, but I would subscribe to the fact that 77th' buses take the most abuse. Basically most routes run 20 hours a day. Besideds PM, it probably is interested in getting the buses back on the road ASAP. When I say abuse, not only am I talking about the horrible roadways (79th St is Pothole Ave), but passenger abuse as well. I suppose that when 77th gets new equipment, it usually doesn't stay long in order to preserve the life of the bus,,

[jajuan]

One could argue that you are saying that 77th's maintenance is shoddy, but I would subscribe to the fact that 77th' buses take the most abuse. Basically most routes run 20 hours a day. Besideds PM, it probably is interested in getting the buses back on the road ASAP. When I say abuse, not only am I talking about the horrible roadways (79th St is Pothole Ave), but passenger abuse as well. I suppose that when 77th gets new equipment, it usually doesn't stay long in order to preserve the life of the bus,,

One probably could argue that, but I'm glad to see that you recognize that I wasn't and pretty much for the reason that FG has more routes than 77th that are running less than 20 hours daily.

[sw4400]

Tribune reporter decides to go freelance and see how durable and tough a "L" train window is, I guess.... not as durable as he thought, and now he has a court date because of it...

Story

[BusHunter]

if the smallest bit of what you're saying is true, I'd say that's an argument for FG being the first to get 7900s, and as everyone else said or implied, 77th being dead last to get any 7900s if in fact it does get them. Saying it makes sense for 77th, which as has been observed has all NF D40LFs on its 40 foot roster and has a good number of them rehabbed meaning relatively fewer maintenance problems, to be first for 7900s while jumping to say the 6400s at FG are falling apart just doesn't jibe or make much sense. You can't have it both ways on those arguments even if you state that the part of the result of giving 77th 7900s first might force a return of NFs to FG, which isn't necessarily the guaranteed result. For all you know those displaced Novas could just as likely get steered back to Chicago or 74th. But let's say for a second things were to occur along the lines you're stating. Why get back seven to eight year buses right away, even if that model is being rehabbed, when your garage has the chance to get brand new ones right away instead? Weren't you the one going right along with 5750 in making the argument that FG has been getting ignored in favor of the south side in getting new 40 foot buses? Although I disagree with that particular argument as far as past bus deliveries and assignments go, what you're saying about 77th getting 7900s making sense doesn't jibe with that and actually works in the opposite direction of what you were saying previous while making that big stink that FG getting short changed on bus deliveries. Again you're trying to have it both ways whether you recognized it or not. If FG has been getting shortchanged as you said previously, would it make more sense for it to get NFs back after it gets them and not before

Well Jajuan it's complicated. When I say it makes sense that 77th get smart buses, I'm looking at it as a safety issue. If operators are being attacked at 77th it no longer makes sense to put the newest buses at the safest place FG. That is why the NF's left FG in the first place. If you had been reading my posts, instead of arguing against them for the sake of argument you would see that. FG has the newest #6400's, so why would you replace those already? The #1900's to Fg makes sense also in the sense that those will not be rehabbed too soon in any great number, so if again the issue is a long trip to South Shops for rehab that's null. There's no cause for panic though, FG will get smart buses eventually, probably last.

Since you are attacking my point of view I feel it's fair for me to ask you. What makes you such an expert on Fg buses when all you ride is the #84. Each week i'm spending 20 hrs or greater on FG's equipment, so I should have some idea what's going on there. You make it sound like I'm talking about buses at Septa which I know nothing about.

[geneking7320]

Tribune reporter decides to go freelance and see how durable and tough a "L" train window is, I guess.... not as durable as he thought, and now he has a court date because of it...

Story

The address in the story appears to be a non-revenue area[the yards maybe?]. If indeed he was on the train south of the 95th street station what was the reason?

[ctrabs74]

The address in the story appears to be a non-revenue area[the yards maybe?]. If indeed he was on the train south of the 95th street station what was the reason?

Not to speculate, but it sounds like he was trying to get off at 95th and got stuck in the train after it pulled out of the station. That's the only logical reason I can think of off the top of my head.

[Busjack]

Well Jajuan it's complicated. When I say it makes sense that 77th get smart buses, I'm looking at it as a safety issue. If operators are being attacked at 77th it no longer makes sense to put the newest buses at the safest place FG. ,,,

If that's the case, it would be cheaper to put the new style shields on the buses 77th already has.

In that there is that extensive of a NEW BUS MOVES topic, with unexplainable moves like taking a certain number of hybrids out of NP, indicates that if there is a rationale, CTA is sure not stating it.

That's basically why I have given up either tracking or rationalizing this.

[Busjack]

The address in the story appears to be a non-revenue area[the yards maybe?]. If indeed he was on the train south of the 95th street station what was the reason?

Not to speculate, but it sounds like he was trying to get off at 95th and got stuck in the train after it pulled out of the station. That's the only logical reason I can think of off the top of my head.

The only reasonable explanation is that the official address of the yards is 98th and the yard crew turned him in. Maybe, in his lawbreaking escapade he stayed on the train until it went into the yard, but that's not a necessary condition. Somehow he would have had to figure out that the train was going into the yard as opposed to reversing back to Howard, but he didn't want to kick out a window in a station full of passengers. Or maybe the yard crew identified that he did it elsewhere after reviewing the video (as indicated by the statement that it was a "southbound" train.

Maybe he is just another mental defective who can't figure out that the trains have surveillance cameras, even though (1) Claypool had a press conference of it and (2) the accused sexual assaulter just turned himself in because of the camera images, both very recently.

[strictures]

The only reasonable explanation is that the official address of the yards is 98th and the yard crew turned him in. Maybe, in his lawbreaking escapade he stayed on the train until it went into the yard, but that's not a necessary condition. Somehow he would have had to figure out that the train was going into the yard as opposed to reversing back to Howard, but he didn't want to kick out a window in a station full of passengers. Or maybe the yard crew identified that he did it elsewhere after reviewing the video (as indicated by the statement that it was a "southbound" train.

Maybe he is just another mental defective who can't figure out that the trains have surveillance cameras, even though (1) Claypool had a press conference of it and (2) the accused sexual assaulter just turned himself in because of the camera images, both very recently.

More likely, he was just drunk!

[Busjack]

More likely, he was just drunk!

Depends, though, if he really was doing an "investigation" for the Tribune. He wouldn't comment to the Sun-Times on that.

[BusHunter]

CTA's not worried about 20 miles for a bus transfer when some of those buses have logged over 500,000 miles. Like See Tea Uh said, it all depends on the politics or what someone is deciding at a higher level which decides who gets what. This kind of goes with the last president wanting to put #5000's on the blue line. Suddenly he was no longer president and his ideas changed because he was no longer deciding them, but it could have also been the flop of the airport express that was the cause. I don't know if Claypool has any influence or say in what buses go where. He might just let the managers decide. Putting a full shield on the #1000's is probably not possible anyway. They do already have half a shield on the important parts of the body. Then they would have to do all the buses.

[Busjack]

... Putting a full shield on the #1000's is probably not possible anyway. They do already have half a shield on the important parts of the body. Then they would have to do all the buses.

Since they are being hauled in for rehab, they could have done that too, if it were a priority.

[Busjack]

Depends, though, if he really was doing an "investigation" for the Tribune. He wouldn't comment to the Sun-Times on that.

Doing a search on ChicagoTribune.com shows that they did report on it.

That story clarifies the yard crew at 98th reporting the crime theory, as well as the "arrest report ... does not indicate exactly where or when the damage took place."

It also says that he lives in Oak Park, which seems to negate a drunken joy ride to 95th.

[strictures]

Doing a search on ChicagoTribune.com shows that they did report on it.

That story clarifies the yard crew at 98th reporting the crime theory, as well as the "arrest report ... does not indicate exactly where or when the damage took place."

It also says that he lives in Oak Park, which seems to negate a drunken joy ride to 95th.

Maybe he got on the wrong train while drunk?

[Busjack]

Maybe he got on the wrong train while drunk?

Maybe it was nowhere near 98th.

[jajuan]

Well Jajuan it's complicated. When I say it makes sense that 77th get smart buses, I'm looking at it as a safety issue. If operators are being attacked at 77th it no longer makes sense to put the newest buses at the safest place FG. That is why the NF's left FG in the first place. If you had been reading my posts, instead of arguing against them for the sake of argument you would see that. FG has the newest #6400's, so why would you replace those already? The #1900's to Fg makes sense also in the sense that those will not be rehabbed too soon in any great number, so if again the issue is a long trip to South Shops for rehab that's null. There's no cause for panic though, FG will get smart buses eventually, probably last.

Since you are attacking my point of view I feel it's fair for me to ask you. What makes you such an expert on Fg buses when all you ride is the #84. Each week i'm spending 20 hrs or greater on FG's equipment, so I should have some idea what's going on there. You make it sound like I'm talking about buses at Septa which I know nothing about.

Number one I'm not attacking you. I just disagree with part of your point. Number two, I said I live near the 84. Not once did I ever say that's the only FG route I ride. I have read your other posts before I put my latest response, and my answer is still the same in light of the fact that 77th already has 40 foot buses with shields. FG may have the youngest 6400s, but it still has a sizeable number from the oldest. So sorry I still don't see 77th being first making sense when (1) all its 40 footers have shields already and (2) 77th has the among the youngest NFs in the fleet and a fair number of its older ones rehabbed.

[garmon757]

Can we all just wait until some of the 7900s get here! My goodness guys they're just buses not some fantasy draft! It doesn't matter where they land first just be damn grateful we're getting some new 40-foot buses for the first time in 7 years!!! It's been too damn long man!!!

[BusHunter]

Can we all just wait until some of the 7900s get here! My goodness guys they're just buses not some fantasy draft! It doesn't matter where they land first just be damn grateful we're getting some new 40-foot buses for the first time in 7 years!!! It's been too damn long man!!!

That's what happens when you order a 1,000 40 foot buses at one time. You go from years of deliveries to no deliveries. Soon like maybe in four years they will once again be delivering three years of buses unless they do a dual order like in 1991. Anyway we have been getting 60 foot buses pretty regular so it's not like we haven't had nothing unless you're at a garage where the artics don't go. This will probably be their chance to finally upgrade some buses.

It's been nice getting new "L" cars. I just hope all this hoopla with the #7000's doesn't cause a major delay thinking about the #3500's, later to become #5000's order. Just think in the last 10 years CTA has acquired over 1,700 pieces of new equipment bus and rail. I never thought I'd see them replace the entire rail fleet in a period of 10 years in my life.

[garmon757]

That's what happens when you order a 1,000 40 foot buses at one time. You go from years of deliveries to no deliveries. Soon like maybe in four years they will once again be delivering three years of buses unless they do a dual order like in 1991. Anyway we have been getting 60 foot buses pretty regular so it's not like we haven't had nothing unless you're at a garage where the artics don't go. This will probably be their chance to finally upgrade some buses.

It's been nice getting new "L" cars. I just hope all this hoopla with the #7000's doesn't cause a major delay thinking about the #3500's, later to become #5000's order. Just think in the last 10 years CTA has acquired over 1,700 pieces of new equipment bus and rail. I never thought I'd see them replace the entire rail fleet in a period of 10 years in my life.

I feel you on that but you have to think about it though; it's a hell of difference from 20-30 years ago (well before and after I was born in 1990) because of technology and production. At least it wasn't that much of a hassle with deliveries back then in which I miss the old days. Two factors if the 7000s were delayed: 1. The damn bidding and 2. Productions that lead to flaws.

[Busjack]

I feel you on that but you have to think about it though; it's a hell of difference from 20-30 years ago (well before and after I was born in 1990) because of technology and production. At least it wasn't that much of a hassle with deliveries back then in which I miss the old days. Two factors if the 7000s were delayed: 1. The damn bidding and 2. Productions that lead to flaws.

The only difference from the old days is essentially that a T8H 5307A was basically the same bus no matter to whom GM sold it. Trivial things like paint and seats differed, but that was about it.

Now, even though there are standard procurement guidelines, most orders are still custom.

[jajuan]

Don't discount the possibility that last winter's heavy snows across the Midwest putting a crimp in the production schedule. Plus I don't remember them saying anything about when the buses would start coming while the bidding stage was still ongoing except to say they hoped to have deliveries start some time in 2014. I think they only narrowed it down once they announced they announced they were going with Nova this time instead of NF.

[sw4400]

Can we all just wait until some of the 7900s get here! My goodness guys they're just buses not some fantasy draft! It doesn't matter where they land first just be damn grateful we're getting some new 40-foot buses for the first time in 7 years!!! It's been too damn long man!!!

Actually, I didn't want to leak it, but FG is trading approximately 40 Nova LFS(6400's) in the next six weeks for a series to be named later from a garage to be named later...