CTA New Bus Order 2020

[Tcmetro]

CTA has posted an RFP on their procurements page for an order of up to 600 diesel buses (100 base order and 5 100-bus options). The RFP was posted 2/19/2020 and responses are due 4/13/2020.

https://www.transitchicago.com/solicitation/details/?cta=Bg2Kaov023rGcoKigj6lTp5YpDqyz4EiJ%2F8BalJfw4E%3D

Quote

Solicitation Information

C20FT102342998

Request for Proposals (RFP) for the Manufacture and Delivery of a Base Order of One Hundred (100) Diesel Engine Transit Buses

Issue Date: 02/19/2020

 

 

[cta5658]

TBH, I wouldn't be surprised if New Flyer won the contract.

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

3 hours ago, cta5658 said:

TBH, I wouldn't be surprised if New Flyer won the contract.

bye 6400’s have a great life at the boneyard lmao welcome new flyer

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

3 hours ago, cta5658 said:

TBH, I wouldn't be surprised if New Flyer won the contract.

if new flyer wins is then they will deliver em asap and probably won’t need training since every driver already knows how to operate a flyer lol 

[WCR]

15 minutes ago, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

bye 6400’s have a great life at the boneyard lmao welcome new flyer

And bye bye oldest ~500 D40LFs!

Jokes aside, I as well hope New Flyer gets the contract. They're capable of a speedy delivery and it'll be nice to see something new on the road. The XD40 platform probably shares a lot of components with existing equipment too. But whatever we end up with it'll bring some welcome variety.

[artthouwill]

5 hours ago, Tcmetro said:

CTA has posted an RFP on their procurements page for an order of up to 600 diesel buses (100 base order and 5 100-bus options). The RFP was posted 2/19/2020 and responses are due 4/13/2020.

https://www.transitchicago.com/solicitation/details/?cta=Bg2Kaov023rGcoKigj6lTp5YpDqyz4EiJ%2F8BalJfw4E%3D

 

This will be interesting.   If New Flyer wins, Pace and CTA will have a similar model at the same time 

  This hasn't happened since CTA purchased some used Orions from Pace around 2003.  

Training should not be an issue unless a company like Gillig or Eldorado wins.

[mikeymc77]

Gillig makes a great product. We have them here in Tucson but I dont see them getting a huge order in Chicago. Nova is a far better product than New Flyer, case in point you have nearly 20 year old Novas still alive and kicking

 

[sw4400]

It'll come down to one of these two, most likely.

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

19 hours ago, Tcmetro said:

CTA has posted an RFP on their procurements page for an order of up to 600 diesel buses (100 base order and 5 100-bus options). The RFP was posted 2/19/2020 and responses are due 4/13/2020.

https://www.transitchicago.com/solicitation/details/?cta=Bg2Kaov023rGcoKigj6lTp5YpDqyz4EiJ%2F8BalJfw4E%3D

 

also just noticed the 6400’s will depart service this year since CTA has 100 buses (most likely new flyer) base order which is going to replace 6400’s 

[YoungBusLover]

1 hour ago, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

also just noticed the 6400’s will depart service this year since CTA has 100 buses (most likely new flyer) base order which is going to replace 6400’s 

What I don't understand is what will happen to the 100 Artic surplus CTA currently has with the 4300's, I would assume some of the oldest #4000's would get retired as well along with #1000s and the last #6400s.

[artthouwill]

2 hours ago, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

also just noticed the 6400’s will depart service this year since CTA has 100 buses (most likely new flyer) base order which is going to replace 6400’s 

Depends on when CTA  actually orders the buses and when they are delivered.   The bid closes in April.  The other question is whether CTA has the funding.   

[Anthony Devera]

26 minutes ago, YoungBusLover said:

What I don't understand is what will happen to the 100 Artic surplus CTA currently has with the 4300's, I would assume some of the oldest #4000's would get retired as well along with #1000s and the last #6400s.

I can imagine CTA would keep those artics for a while, and they could maybe replace some of the older 4000s when those get retired. Those surplus artics probably have less mileage on them, so they are probably in better condition. It doesn't look like CTA will be ordering new artics any time soon.

[NewFlyerMCI]

1 hour ago, YoungBusLover said:

What I don't understand is what will happen to the 100 Artic surplus CTA currently has with the 4300's, I would assume some of the oldest #4000's would get retired as well along with #1000s and the last #6400s.

 

1 hour ago, Anthony Devera said:

I can imagine CTA would keep those artics for a while, and they could maybe replace some of the older 4000s when those get retired. Those surplus artics probably have less mileage on them, so they are probably in better condition. It doesn't look like CTA will be ordering new artics any time soon.

Is there a possibility of CTA selling them? I know for instance, WMATA has needed more artics for a minute, but has currently run into garage capacity restrictions, especially since one of the garages is currently out of commission.

[YoungBusLover]

5 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

 

Is there a possibility of CTA selling them? I know for instance, WMATA has needed more artics for a minute, but has currently run into garage capacity restrictions, especially since one of the garages is currently out of commission.

I doubt WMATA would buy 2008 Artics from CTA unless they would get a considerable amount of cash in return, I wouldn't know the full extinct of how a deal would come about but seeing how Baltimore MTA has started retiring some of our backlogged leased artics that were given to them I don't think the WMATA would wanna waste a lot of money on them to begin with. 

[artthouwill]

5 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

 

Is there a possibility of CTA selling them? I know for instance, WMATA has needed more artics for a minute, but has currently run into garage capacity restrictions, especially since one of the garages is currently out of commission.

I'm not sure if CTA has to wait until the 12 year FTA life period expires.  I suppose after that they could sell the non leased buses.  I think it would be better to just keep the artics until they wear out.  CTA can always shuffle the higher mileage artics to K or P, where the buses may get to sit for a few days. 

[YoungBusLover]

6 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

I'm not sure if CTA has to wait until the 12 year FTA life period expires.  I suppose after that they could sell the non leased buses.  I think it would be better to just keep the artics until they wear out.  CTA can always shuffle the higher mileage artics to K or P, where the buses may get to sit for a few days. 

Well they have another 3 or 4 years left in them if they can be maintained properly but judging by the amount I've that have been dormant at south shops in the boneyard for several months can only make me wonder "How long do they really have?".

[artthouwill]

3 minutes ago, YoungBusLover said:

Well they have another 3 or 4 years left in them if they can be maintained properly but judging by the amount I've that have been dormant at south shops in the boneyard for several months can only make me wonder "How long do they really have?".

The dormancy may be due to legal holds due to injury or fatal accidents.   Some may be in long term holds where the amount of damage makes it not worth repairing, but close enough to retirement eligibility that they just let the bus sit.  Perhaps they rob parts from those buses to repair other buses (assuming they are not in a legal hold).

[YoungBusLover]

Just now, artthouwill said:

The dormancy may be due to legal holds due to injury or fatal accidents.   Some may be in long term holds where the amount of damage makes it not worth repairing, but close enough to retirement eligibility that they just let the bus sit.  Perhaps they rob parts from those buses to repair other buses (assuming they are not in a legal hold).

The thing is i've been back there and seen some driven and parked back there in the bast 5 or 6 months just to sit and collect dust. None showed signs of damage or have any markings or tape related to legal issues other than #4167 which was recently moved a couple weeks back. Not only that but a few early #4300's have been sitting back there as well. I take a look at the artics that do show up and leave South shops on daily during my runs and i'm curious as to why there still back there not getting any work done while other #4000's and #4300's come in and receive maintenance and they don't. 

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, YoungBusLover said:

The thing is i've been back there and seen some driven and parked back there in the bast 5 or 6 months just to sit and collect dust. None showed signs of damage or have any markings or tape related to legal issues other than #4167 which was recently moved a couple weeks back. Not only that but a few early #4300's have been sitting back there as well. I take a look at the artics that do show up and leave South shops on daily during my runs and i'm curious as to why there still back there not getting any work done while other #4000's and #4300's come in and receive maintenance and they don't. 

Could be a myriad of reasons.   There's the possibility of not having parts.  If it's a leased bus, they may have to get some sort of approval before proceeding with repairs.  Perhaps other bus work has a higher priority because CTA has the parts necessary while others don't.  Maybe some buses were stripped for parts and those parts need replacing.   They have more than enough artics so there's no rush to get them all up and running. 

These buses have no relation to CTA ordering new buses.   The first priority is retirement of the 6400s.  CTA has heavily invested in rebuilding the 1000s, so unless they start breaking down,  it may be awhile before CTA exercises options on this new order.

[NewFlyerMCI]

3 hours ago, YoungBusLover said:

I doubt WMATA would buy 2008 Artics from CTA unless they would get a considerable amount of cash in return, I wouldn't know the full extinct of how a deal would come about but seeing how Baltimore MTA has started retiring some of our backlogged leased artics that were given to them I don't think the WMATA would wanna waste a lot of money on them to begin with. 

To be clear, I was provided an example, not saying WMATA should buy artics from CTA, especially ones that don't run on CNG

[Mr.cta85]

11 hours ago, sw4400 said:

It'll come down to one of these two, most likely.

I agree with this 100%. If I was to take a guess I would say New Flyer get the contract for the 600 since we got 450 New Novas. CTA seems to favor New Flyers more and us operators are more familiar with those buses and like em more than Novas for the most part lol. Me personally would love to see more new Flyers as well but I dont have a problem with the Novas neither tho.

[geneking7320]

Between New Flyer and Nova I hope New Flyer wins the bid. As I rider I find the New Flyers to be  more comfortable.

 

[BusHunter]

Yeah I was just thinking today why does almost every other city have Xcelsiors and we dont have any except the 2 700s. I think I'm going to be sick if nova wins the bid. If nova did win I definitely would be seeking a new ac manufacturer as part of the contract. 

As a driver myself, I have mixed emotions. I drive a cab forward bus. The minute I got in I told my trainer I love the sightlines on this bus it makes it easy to drive. Nova would seem easier to drive but your going to sweat to death doing it. One thing I've picked up about the xcelsiors as a passenger is that they seem floaty. Floaty buses like to push in the wind. It's really amazing how the buses change characteristics with a load.  Would you want to drive a heavy floaty bus? They are modern buses. It would be wild if Eldorado won the contract. Now they are cab forward and the ac is great on those. Pace did good on that purchase. Buses seem to hold up well. Out of the 3 xcelsior is most likely, but nova has been winning the bids lately. Eldorado is the sleeper hit though. Well have to see who wins.....

[Tcmetro]

Eldorado did pick up a 295-bus order for Los Angeles County a few years ago, their biggest order besides Pace. Could be a contender.

But it's likely New Flyer or Nova. Clearly either works for CTA, it's just gonna come down to price between the two. If they do go with Nova, I hope the AC systems are improved. 

[Mr.cta85]

17 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah I was just thinking today why does almost every other city have Xcelsiors and we dont have any except the 2 700s. I think I'm going to be sick if nova wins the bid. If nova did win I definitely would be seeking a new ac manufacturer as part of the contract. 

As a driver myself, I have mixed emotions. I drive a cab forward bus. The minute I got in I told my trainer I love the sightlines on this bus it makes it easy to drive. Nova would seem easier to drive but your going to sweat to death doing it. One thing I've picked up about the xcelsiors as a passenger is that they seem floaty. Floaty buses like to push in the wind. It's really amazing how the buses change characteristics with a load.  Would you want to drive a heavy floaty bus? They are modern buses. It would be wild if Eldorado won the contract. Now they are cab forward and the ac is great on those. Pace did good on that purchase. Buses seem to hold up well. Out of the 3 xcelsior is most likely, but nova has been winning the bids lately. Eldorado is the sleeper hit though. Well have to see who wins.....

Me personally I want cta to get the flyers cause I favor those more than the novas. But I also like the Eldorado's as well I noticed Pace has 3 different models of those buses 1 with the dark tinted windows like the latter novas then the other bus with the high blue battery on top which I'm really not a fan of as far as looks then lastly you have regular 1 if you will with the not so noticable white ac system on top. The 3rd is the 1 I hope CTA goes with if they in fact do go with Eldorado's for the next new buses. But I will say about the blue battery top version is I love the way the bus leans the opposite way when it makes a turn. It reminds me of those flixibles buses ????by the way I wish they never went out of business as well as the orion manufacturer.