Pace/CTA North Shore Coordination Plan

[artthouwill]

18 minutes ago, Busjack said:

IMO, the 2003 plan was a mistake.

Something must have finally kicked CTA in the head to stop competing with Pace. Maybe the Crowd Reduction Plan was the first step in that direction, although CTA wouldn't admit it at first.

Nothing like dwindling resources to make people get creative.

[artthouwill]

2 hours ago, Busjack said:

The bus ridership reports are consistently preceded by that ridership is down something like 2-4% from the same month the prior year. If one wants to take a broader view (5 years) bus ridership is down from an average weekday of 973,000 in March 2013 to 785,000 in March 2018, or about 20%. One could argue that instead of the fantasy new routes, another round of cutting is necessary. It would take acquiring a huge amount of passengers just to make up for the 3700 lost on 4 Cottage Grove, or 4250 lost on 77 Belmont in the last 5 years.

The Trib has been running a sort of series chronicling the exodus of Illinoisans to neighboring states  and beyond.  One of the fastest growing cities is  Nashville.   Interesting is the fact there is a building  boom of residential buildings  downtown such as the 76 story apartment building  at Roosevelt and  Indiana.  The Trib also has reported  an alarming  exodus of  African Americans  from the South and West  Sides of the city.    Obviously  African Americans  aren't the only ones  leaving.   Illinois is poised to  lose a couple of congressional seats this coming midterm election.  Chicago and  Illinois  have been  consistently  losing population which is reflected in  your stats of dwindling  bus ridership, Uber and Lyft notwithstanding.  In the next couple of  years  I expect Houston to become the  nation's third largest city and Chicago to possibly  fall  behind Philadelphia which currently  sits at number 5.  CTA better prepare for a  lot more cutting.   A dwindling  tax base  paying higher taxes is a  recipe for  disaster.

These things  certainly aren't  helping  Chicago's bid to be HQ2 for Amazon.

[Tcmetro]

I would imagine that a deeper look at ridership patterns would be that peak ridership is consistent and off peak ridership is falling. This creates a situation where the same capital budget is needed for fewer riders. 

 

CTA/CDOT really need to focus on bus improvements like off-board payment, bus lanes, signal priority, and consolidated stops to keep up with the traffic that has been getting really bad with Uber/Lyft and having more wealthy people in the city. 

[andrethebusman]

I just hope they don't make the same mistake as last time. Any more cuts in span of service would be disastrous. Increasing headways non-rush would be much better. Waiting longer is one thing,  nothing coming is another

 

[MetroShadow]

In case anyone is inquiring about the equipment used on 206

 4163 is also included, but after I took the screenshot. 

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, MetroShadow said:

In case anyone is inquiring about the equipment used on 206

 4163 is also included, but after I took the screenshot. 

Guessing that the  40 ft buses are from F and the artics are P.  The North Park buses st probably school trippers.  Once done, I would  guess they turn into 22s?

[Busjack]

40 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

Guessing that the  40 ft buses are from F and the artics are P.  The North Park buses st probably school trippers.  Once done, I would  guess they turn into 22s?

I guess ethan won  his bet that  artics would be used, but only because they interlined with 22 and not because they were suitable.

[artthouwill]

On 8/28/2018 at 9:59 PM, ethan2226 said:

Will Route #206 Evanston Circulator via Chicago Ave use Articulated Buses? (4000 and 4300 series)

Based on the above posts, I guess that's a yes.  At least for today.

[chgofan78]

They've officially given the #213 a permanent loading berth at Howard station.  It's the former #205 berth.  Before  this, the buses were just using the #215 bus stop.

[NewFlyerMCI]

19 hours ago, MetroShadow said:

In case anyone is inquiring about the equipment used on 206

 4163 is also included, but after I took the screenshot. 

What app is this?

[strictures]

On 9/5/2018 at 9:13 AM, Busjack said:

It would take acquiring a huge amount of passengers just to make up for the 3700 lost on 4 Cottage Grove.

I'm not surprised that Cottage Grove that lost riders.   Where the actual losses are would be interesting.   3 King Dr. has too many buses & 4 Cottage Grove has too few.   On top of that, More people are using the 4 to get to the University of Chicago Hospital & clinics than before.   But the real problem for both of these routes are they are way too long & get totally screwed up by being on hopelessly overcrowded Michigan from 18th north to Randolph for the 4 & Chicago for the 3.  

I would break the 4 with it going SB to 63rd & NB to 55th, so both sections cover the University Hospitals.

[Sam92]

On 9/7/2018 at 6:32 PM, strictures said:

I'm not surprised that Cottage Grove that lost riders.   Where the actual losses are would be interesting.   3 King Dr. has too many buses & 4 Cottage Grove has too few.   On top of that, More people are using the 4 to get to the University of Chicago Hospital & clinics than before.   But the real problem for both of these routes are they are way too long & get totally screwed up by being on hopelessly overcrowded Michigan from 18th north to Randolph for the 4 & Chicago for the 3.  

I would break the 4 with it going SB to 63rd & NB to 55th, so both sections cover the University Hospitals.

@Busjack could chime in on this.  The better solution would probably encourage more green line rides. Michigan is a crap shoot especially as a tourist/shopping street. If it were up to me I'd make a 3A/4A south king bus, coordinate the schedules to where you have frequent service south of 63rd to feed the green line but north of that the green line would be the encouraged mode of travel to downtown unless on lives in say bronzeville or so where a bus ride wouldnt be so irritating. 

[NewFlyerMCI]

2 hours ago, Sam92 said:

@Busjack could chime in on this.  The better solution would probably encourage more green line rides. Michigan is a crap shoot especially as a tourist/shopping street. If it were up to me I'd make a 3A/4A south king bus, coordinate the schedules to where you have frequent service south of 63rd to feed the green line but north of that the green line would be the encouraged mode of travel to downtown unless on lives in say bronzeville or so where a bus ride wouldnt be so irritating. 

Mods, is it possible to get this moved so we aren't off topic?

[Busjack]

On 9/19/2018 at 7:49 AM, Sam92 said:

@Busjack could chime in on this.

Sorry, one because of my new policy, and second for the reason @NewFlyerMCI said.This belongs in the Random CTA  thread. Heck, I should not have replied to Andre here, and have deleted it.

[renardo870]

Has there been any feedback about not having the direct connection to the Cook County Courthouse or not having service since the 205 has been discontinued and the 208 was rerouted, respectively?

[NewFlyerMCI]

2 hours ago, renardo870 said:

Has there been any feedback about not having the direct connection to the Cook County Courthouse or not having service since the 205 has been discontinued and the 208 was rerouted, respectively?

I haven't found anything online, but in terms of a solution...

On 7/23/2018 at 7:55 AM, strictures said:

Kill it & let the incompetent county run a really small shuttle bus from Old Orchard to the courthouse, like the ones Niles used years ago for its free shuttle.  It's the county that put the courthouse in such a stupid location & then had to completely tear down & rebuild the parking garage, because the incompetent builder did such a rotten job, it fell apart in about 15 years.  The courthouse should've been near the Dempster Swift station, there was a bankrupt & vacant car dealer just west of it then.

 

On 7/23/2018 at 3:34 PM, Busjack said:

Disregarding the intervening irrelevant comment, the last Board Meeting video had someone ask that,so that you can check if that person got a response.

In any event, present or future route 422 will serve it once an hour.I bet Pace's answer will be the same as it was when the routing of 208 via the courthouse was changed to straight via Golf--transfer at Old Orchard.

 

On 7/23/2018 at 9:29 PM, jajuan said:

From the sounds of things so far, outside of @Busjack's point about the 422 still serving it, CTA will still provide service during weekday rush periods through the 54A until such time that route is replaced by Pace's future 641 Edens BOS route. 

If you're looking for something from Evanston/Skokie, they could always extend the 97, but giving the route changes in the report a cursory glance, I don't think that'll happen.

[Busjack]

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

 Question is where is pace getting the buses for all those new routes they'll have?

The North Shore plan was supposed to be resource neutral for Pace, although after the ETHS complaints, changing 213 from every 20 minutes to 15 increased the need by 1 or 2 buses and staff said increased  the cost by $125,000.

As for other routes, there is the outstanding solicitation   for 78 40 ft. buses and 164 30 foot buses that may be awarded exactly one week from now. I don't know if that's straight replacement or something like Dempster Pulse gets new buses and some buses go from NW to W, but most plans for new routes other than the coordination plans are for Pulse, and as the hearing materials for Milwaukee Pulse indicate, not much more need for buses, with 270 running local once an hour.

[CircleSeven]

Anyone who were looking forward for implementation of Phase 2, might have to wait a bit longer.

I was reading the minutes of June's Pace Planning Committe meeting. And it mentioned that they're planning to implement Phase 2 this coming August of next year.

[NewFlyerMCI]

13 hours ago, CircleSeven said:

Anyone who were looking forward for implementation of Phase 2, might have to wait a bit longer.

I was reading the minutes of June's Pace Planning Committe meeting. And it mentioned that they're planning to implement Phase 2 this coming August of next year.

What possible reason for a year long delay? My first guess was Edens BOS but they could either scrap that or move the 54A/641 to phase 3

[strictures]

37 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

What possible reason for a year long delay? My first guess was Edens BOS but they could either scrap that or move the 54A/641 to phase 3

Maybe they have polling results that show people want things to stay the same, such as the 215, Howard to Old Orchard.

[NewFlyerMCI]

3 hours ago, strictures said:

Maybe they have polling results that show people want things to stay the same, such as the 215, Howard to Old Orchard.

From my outsiders perspective, this seems fairly late in the process for polling specifically to be the reason, but I'm happy to be wrong.

[renardo870]

A whole year to implement Phase 2?? It must have been some revision or 2nd thoughts of the proposed routes changes, discontinuance and/or implementation of CTA / Pace 54A, 210, 215, 225, 226 and 641. 

[west towns]

dont they need to hold public hearings?

[Pace831]

2 hours ago, west towns said:

dont they need to hold public hearings?

They already did before they announced this plan. A delay in implementation does not require additional hearings.

[CircleSeven]

9 hours ago, Pace831 said:

They already did before they announced this plan. A delay in implementation does not require additional hearings.

They also had a public hearing regarding the Phase 1 changes, including the discontinuation of CTA #205. I'm sure they'll be doing another public hearing for Phase 2.