More Bus Moves

[jajuan]

So, NP's 1700s now end at #1798 (#1794, #1796 and #1798 were transferred from 103rd). K's 1100s now start at #1152 instead of #1160. And C's 1000s now end at #1087 instead of #1084.

Or put it this way, at least for this summer:

103rd: 1000-1037, 1248-1253, 1480, 1481, 1482, 1483-1527, 1598-1600, 1602, 1604, 1605-1613 (odds), 1799-1849

74th: 1092-1151, 1528-1584, 1721-1757

77th: 1270-1302, 1930-1963, 1965-1977 (odds)

C: 1038-1087, 1091, 1323-1344, 1430-1479, 1585-1591, 1856-1926 (evens), 1927-1929, 1972-1978 (evens), 1979-2029

FG: 1088-1090, 1189-1199, 1202, 1203, 1205-1209 (odds), 1214, 1215, 1218-1222, 1224, 1226-1247, 1254-1269

K: 1152-1188, 1200, 1201, 1204-1210 (evens), 1211-1213, 1216, 1217, 1223, 1225, 1345-1374, 1592-1597, 1601, 1603, 1606-1614 (evens), 1615-1720

NP: 1303-1322, 1375-1429, 1758-1798, 1850-1855, 1857-1925 (odds), 1964-1970 (evens)

They may have cut into the number of 1000's at 77th a bit more once again in favor of FG because 1272 is on the 84 Peterson this morning.

[RJL6000]

They may have cut into the number of 1000's at 77th a bit more once again in favor of FG because 1272 is on the 84 Peterson this morning.

Thanks, manual, for the correction.

The 1000 series assignments at 77th and FG are now as follows:

77th: 1273-1302, 1930-1963, 1965-1977 (odds)

FG: 1088-1090, 1189-1199, 1202, 1203, 1205-1209 (odds), 1214, 1215, 1218-1222, 1224, 1226-1247, 1254-1272

[pudgym29]

Buses #1930 & #1931 are now at Chicago Garage {from 77th St.}. I saw both of them on route #66 Chicago on Sunday, 24 June.

[artthouwill]

Buses #1930 & #1931 are now at Chicago Garage {from 77th St.}. I saw both of them on route #66 Chicago on Sunday, 24 June.

Again 77th gets the shaft. It constantly loses its newer busrs Notice that it doesn't lose Novas at the rate it loses NFs. What sense does 103rd losing buses to NP make when 103rd has to then borrow buses from another garage.

[BusHunter]

Again 77th gets the shaft. It constantly loses its newer busrs Notice that it doesn't lose Novas at the rate it loses NFs. What sense does 103rd losing buses to NP make when 103rd has to then borrow buses from another garage.

Don't worry about it, next year, they'll be taking care of the south side when the Ryan shuts down. 77th will probably get those 100 artics there ordering ahead of the latest 300 or 400. I don't know if they'll try to get all the newer buses out there. But with it being May and college will be out for the summer, places like Forest Glen may end up will all the Optimas. I just hope they don't end up with all novas again. BTW, I had a bit of a laugh when I boarded #1272 the other day. The bus had LED interior lights. I think that is a first for FG. (every other garage has had those for years)

[jajuan]

Don't worry about it, next year, they'll be taking care of the south side when the Ryan shuts down. 77th will probably get those 100 artics there ordering ahead of the latest 300 or 400. I don't know if they'll try to get all the newer buses out there. But with it being May and college will be out for the summer, places like Forest Glen may end up will all the Optimas. I just hope they don't end up with all novas again. BTW, I had a bit of a laugh when I boarded #1272 the other day. The bus had LED interior lights. I think that is a first for FG. (every other garage has had those for years)

That's assuming 77th alone gets assigned to run the shuttles. Given that the shuttles will run from 63rd/Dan Ryan or Garfield Green/temporary Red Line station at the north end of shuttle service to as far as 95th/Dan Ryan to the south, 103rd could also be a part of providing shuttle service and could also possibly get part of the 100 artic order.

[BusHunter]

That's assuming 77th alone gets assigned to run the shuttles. Given that the shuttles will run from 63rd/Dan Ryan or Garfield Green/temporary Red Line station at the north end of shuttle service to as far as 95th/Dan Ryan to the south, 103rd could also be a part of providing shuttle service and could also possibly get part of the 100 artic order.

103rd will get more artics ultimately, maybe 20 to 40 more, but 77th needs them more. From what I've seen so far it looks like there going to beef up the service from Ashland on the west to Cottage on the east, but they probably would add service to the quicker Jeffery corridor as well as the #X28 and #28's. So I think 74th, 77th and 103rd is going to add buses.

[jajuan]

103rd will get more artics ultimately, maybe 20 to 40 more, but 77th needs them more. From what I've seen so far it looks like there going to beef up the service from Ashland on the west to Cottage on the east, but they probably would add service to the quicker Jeffery corridor as well as the #X28 and #28's. So I think 74th, 77th and 103rd is going to add buses.

But remember 74th doesn't have the proper accommodations to handle an artic bus of today unless it were a 55 foot one which don't exist anywhere in the US I don't believe now that MAN no longer manufactures here and with the current manufacturers only producing such buses in 60 foot lenghths. And CTA doesn't always assign buses where they're needed more given 74th, 103rd and 77th have been transferring buses north and to the west side with 103rd ending up having the need to borrow buses from other garages mostly from 74th, which as stated has already given up buses elsewhere.

[jajuan]

Well Monday is the start of Wacker Reconstruction Phase 4, Part 2. This entails Van Buren closing going across Wacker while Adams gets reopened. Franklin between Harrison and Van Buren also reopens for this stage. So what will basically happen in a nutshell is westbound buses normally on Adams get fully restored back to Adams and SB 11 buses will operate on Adams instead of Van Buren to get to Clinton. It also means 134, 135, and 136 will have been fully restored in both directions to their normal pre-Wacker reconstruction route configurations.

[ArcherRider]

Maybe NP is short on bus because I saw Kedzie Bus #1639 on #22 on bustracker.

[BusHunter]

But remember 74th doesn't have the proper accommodations to handle an artic bus of today unless it were a 55 foot one which don't exist anywhere in the US I don't believe now that MAN no longer manufactures here and with the current manufacturers only producing such buses in 60 foot lenghths. And CTA doesn't always assign buses where they're needed more given 74th, 103rd and 77th have been transferring buses north and to the west side with 103rd ending up having the need to borrow buses from other garages mostly from 74th, which as stated has already given up buses elsewhere.

I never said 74th would get artics. But if some buses are shifted around then they would just get there 40 footers. It looks like service would just be beefed up from the Green line south anyway, so not a big gain in buses. I would expect to see something like what happens now on the north side in the summer months. Long term after the Dan Ryan is done, the LFR's will probably get sent to all the LSD routes that run artics now. With the CTA doing a lakefront BRT study, it looks like there trying to make the LSD corridor BRT. I think all these artics that are here now will become the supplemental service that normally runs 40 foot service like a #12 etc.

[sht6131]

Maybe NP is short on bus because I saw Kedzie Bus #1639 on #22 on bustracker.

Just a guess. Possabaly a NP bus broke down on 82 or 50 at the south end of the route. Kedzie replaced it and NP decided to use it when the operator turned it in. Also there was not a mention of the run#.

[Sam92]

103rd will get more artics ultimately, maybe 20 to 40 more, but 77th needs them more. From what I've seen so far it looks like there going to beef up the service from Ashland on the west to Cottage on the east, but they probably would add service to the quicker Jeffery corridor as well as the #X28 and #28's. So I think 74th, 77th and 103rd is going to add buses.

I wonder would any of the stimulus artics will end up south. I think 77th could possibly end up with 100 artics like NP. It has plenty of room for more and has some of the heaviest routes in the system. Also I see Chicago getting artics for the 66 and 72 and maybe Glen for Belmont and Addison

[jajuan]

I never said 74th would get artics. But if some buses are shifted around then they would just get there 40 footers. It looks like service would just be beefed up from the Green line south anyway, so not a big gain in buses. I would expect to see something like what happens now on the north side in the summer months. Long term after the Dan Ryan is done, the LFR's will probably get sent to all the LSD routes that run artics now. With the CTA doing a lakefront BRT study, it looks like there trying to make the LSD corridor BRT. I think all these artics that are here now will become the supplemental service that normally runs 40 foot service like a #12 etc.

I would hazard a guess that we'd more likely see artics, current or any acquired in the near future, helping to beef up capacity on busy bus routes across the system than doing any type of BRT beyond the 14 given Busjack's post in the BRT thread that the most recent legislation passed by Congress and signed into law before the July 4th recess is worded in such a way that the Western/Ashland corridor study and any other "BRT studies" in the works by CTA won't get beyond the study stage any time soon because CTA won't get federal funding to go any further with its ventures into BRT since they don't fit the definition of it far enough as stipulated by very specific guidelines of what the feds would consider BRT. And the 12 in particular already gets artics to help the 40 footers during rush periods outside of the weekend all artic use as needed through different periods of the year where it's warranted, primarily spring and summer months. Outside that its better to go with 40 ft buses. Now the 3, 4, 66, 77, and 79 for example would probably be better choices. And not all the LSD express routes warrant a heavy artic use or else there would be more of them kept at 103rd to get close to that arrangement now. Ridership patterns on the 26 and X28 don't seem to be high enough to see more than a few artics outside key times of the rush periods with the 1000s doing adequate coverage of the bulk of the runs overall. And even with NP being at 100 plus in artics we don't see full artic coverage of the LSD routes there. 144 rarely has them and the 148 in the AM rush, 145 NB runs before 8AM, and 136 AM runs leaving Devon before 6:30 as well as a decent number in the 8 AM hour are operated with 40 foot buses. Those extra artics basically facilitated the 22 and 151 getting heavy artic use for significant portions of their operating times.

[jajuan]

Well even though the CTA website posted that Part 2 of the recent phase of Wacker Drive begins tomorrow, namely the reopening of Adams among a few other changes, the opening of Wacker actually happened on Friday with the WB buses that should be there rerouted back there on Friday as well. The other street openings and closings though it seems will happen tomorrow as posted since only the change with Adams happened three days early.

[sw4400]

But remember 74th doesn't have the proper accommodations to handle an artic bus of today unless it were a 55 foot one which don't exist anywhere in the US I don't believe now that MAN no longer manufactures here and with the current manufacturers only producing such buses in 60 foot lenghths. And CTA doesn't always assign buses where they're needed more given 74th, 103rd and 77th have been transferring buses north and to the west side with 103rd ending up having the need to borrow buses from other garages mostly from 74th, which as stated has already given up buses elsewhere.

I never said 74th would get artics. But if some buses are shifted around then they would just get there 40 footers. It looks like service would just be beefed up from the Green line south anyway, so not a big gain in buses. I would expect to see something like what happens now on the north side in the summer months. Long term after the Dan Ryan is done, the LFR's will probably get sent to all the LSD routes that run artics now. With the CTA doing a lakefront BRT study, it looks like there trying to make the LSD corridor BRT. I think all these artics that are here now will become the supplemental service that normally runs 40 foot service like a #12 etc.

I think you both forgot that the CTA is ordering 325 New Flyer D40LFR's and 100 New Flyer Articulateds(a mix of DLFR and DELFR models)(Link). Some of those 325 could be going to 74th, 77th and/or 103rd.

[busfan2847]

I think you both forgot that the CTA is ordering 325 New Flyer D40LFR's and 100 New Flyer Articulateds(a mix of DLFR and DELFR models)(Link). Some of those 325 could be going to 74th, 77th and/or 103rd.

To be absolutely correct

100 New Flyer articulated buses are being acquired from the Seattle contract (33 hybrid, 67 diesel), due starting end 2012.

The rest is still out for bid with a due date of 8/22/2012. Realistically these will not start arriving until late next year at the earliest. The bid calls for up to "450 Low Floor, 40/60 Foot, Accessible, Air Conditioned, Conventional/Hybrid Diesel Transit Buses with a minimum of Three Hundred (300) and a Maximum of Four Hundred and Fifty (450) Low Floor, 40 Foot, Accessible, Air Conditioned, Diesel Transit Buses and a Minimum of Fifty (50) and a Maximum of One Hundred and Fifty (150) Low Floor, 60 Foot, Accessible, Air Conditioned, Diesel or Hybrid Diesel-Electric Articulated Transit Buses."

From the press release they would prefer it to be 325 40' clean diesel and 100 60' mix Hybrid/clean diesel.

Probably New Flyer but the bid process has not been completed. Interesting that all the 40' buses will be clean diesel.

[sw4400]

Interesting that all the 40' buses will be clean diesel.

That's what the current stock is, sans the NOVA buses... if you notice somewhere on the dash of the New Flyer D40LF, it says "Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel Fuel Only", hence, the clean diesel tag. The NOVA buses might have been retrofitted with a particulate filter sometime around the New Flyers' arrival in 2006, making them a more cleaner running diesel bus, but not a full clean diesel bus.

[sw4400]

Probably New Flyer but the bid process has not been completed. Interesting that all the 40' buses will be clean diesel.

It's probably all but in the bag that New Flyer will get this contract too... not much else out there for the CTA to pick from that can do 40' and 60' buses except NOVA, New Flyer and NABI(and we know the latter has a chance of getting this contract as a pubescent boy with a cracking voice has of winning "X-Factor" or "American Idol"). I don't think any other manufacturers can produce 40' and 60' buses, and the CTA may be a little hesitant on gambling on new manufacturers after the great NABI fiasco of 2003 that is still in litigation.

Photo copyrighted to T8H5307A

[Busjack]

I'm not discounting NOVA yet, especially since the stink about the proposed Bombardier single source contract on the 3200s.

But, obviously, the terms of the RFP I quoted earlier disqualify NABI.

[BusHunter]

I'm not discounting NOVA yet, especially since the stink about the proposed Bombardier single source contract on the 3200s.

But, obviously, the terms of the RFP I quoted earlier disqualify NABI.

I don't know about Nova. If the #6400's are any indication of what the buses will do long term, it's better to go with New Flyer if they can. Novas are really slow, especially when the AC comes on. Anyone remember how slow the NABI #7500's were before they canned them? The New Flyer's by contrast are aging quite well. In fact, I was sort of surprised when they announced the rehab of those buses. I was thinking what's wrong with them? As far as comparing same age buses the Orion VI's that Pace has seems to drive faster than the Novas, but they have issues with leaking AC/raining in the bus. That has me second guessing any bus that has a contained air system in the roof versus on the roof.

[Kimball401]

I don't know about Nova. If the #6400's are any indication of what the buses will do long term, it's better to go with New Flyer if they can. Novas are really slow, especially when the AC comes on. Anyone remember how slow the NABI #7500's were before they canned them? The New Flyer's by contrast are aging quite well. In fact, I was sort of surprised when they announced the rehab of those buses. I was thinking what's wrong with them? As far as comparing same age buses the Orion VI's that Pace has seems to drive faster than the Novas, but they have issues with leaking AC/raining in the bus. That has me second guessing any bus that has a contained air system in the roof versus on the roof.

True that some novas have ac leak issues and slow accerleration but only one can hope that nova improved over the years look at where it was to where it is now .

I threw in th tmc just as throwback photo

[artthouwill]

It's probably all but in the bag that New Flyer will get this contract too... not much else out there for the CTA to pick from that can do 40' and 60' buses except NOVA, New Flyer and NABI(and we know the latter has a chance of getting this contract as a pubescent boy with a cracking voice has of winning "X-Factor" or "American Idol"). I don't think any other manufacturers can produce 40' and 60' buses, and the CTA may be a little hesitant on gambling on new manufacturers after the great NABI fiasco of 2003 that is still in litigation.

Photo copyrighted to T8H5307A

New Flyer should be the favorite,especially if CTA goes with one manufacturer for both 40' and 60' models. Like I've said earlier, if the bid can be packaged, only NF and Nova would be eligible. The only way Gillig, Eldorado, and NABI can get in the game is if they can put together a great bid for its 40 ft buses and hope CTA takes separate bids for the artics. WE know NABI will never get an artic contract from CTA, but its 40 ft buses have survived with Pace (barely). Perhaps CTA won't accept a bid from them and perhaps NABI won't bother submitting one.. But this is Chicago, and stranger things have happened.

[jajuan]

I think you both forgot that the CTA is ordering 325 New Flyer D40LFR's and 100 New Flyer Articulateds(a mix of DLFR and DELFR models)(Link). Some of those 325 could be going to 74th, 77th and/or 103rd.

No one forgot anything, and the main point still is unless somebody is going to 74th, ripping out the current maintenance lifts and putting in ones that can support 60 foot buses like the other six current garages, whatever buses 74th gets from future orders won't be articulateds. That's all I'm saying.

[Busjack]

No one forgot anything, and the main point still is unless somebody is going to 74th, ripping out the current maintenance lifts and putting in ones that can support 60 foot buses like the other six current garages, whatever buses 74th gets from future orders won't be articulateds. That's all I'm saying.

But, as was noted here, they probably are doing that. Or at least maybe doing that.