More Bus Moves

[jajuan]

1800 on the 84 this evening.

[BusHunter]

On Saturday, December 31, 2016 at 1:08 AM, sw4400 said:

I did approach a Bus Operator tonight at work and asked them about reversing the bus, and the Operator told me they are not permitted to put the bus in reverse, that the vehicles must navigate around the bus. I didn't go into much more than that with the Operator, but that's what I was told. I did explain the video and how the semi-truck was trying to make a turn with the bus in the turn lane, Operator again said the semi must navigate around the bus.

They can do it but if they are not comfortable they shouldn't. According to the cdl rules of the road I believe I read that they are not supposed to back up and go right without a lookout assistant. Because they have a blind spot behind the bus. Now I dont know what happens at the garages but maybe the buses pull straight out but that could be argued on the Elston fence at the glen. 

Then we have the wye turns to think about but yet again we don't have them now and the rules may be different than in the 60s.

[Pace831]

1 hour ago, BusHunter said:

They can do it but if they are not comfortable they shouldn't. According to the cdl rules of the road I believe I read that they are not supposed to back up and go right without a lookout assistant. Because they have a blind spot behind the bus.

"No backing up", in this case, would be a matter of CTA policy rather than rules of the road. I believe it was stated a few years ago that the rule only applies when passengers are on board, which may partially answer your question of what is done at the garage.

[BusHunter]

9 hours ago, Pace831 said:

"No backing up", in this case, would be a matter of CTA policy rather than rules of the road. I believe it was stated a few years ago that the rule only applies when passengers are on board, which may partially answer your question of what is done at the garage.

CTA rules or not the state guidelines should trump that. But of course they could be assisted at the garage unofficially.

[Pace831]

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

CTA rules or not the state guidelines should trump that. But of course they could be assisted at the garage unofficially.

The guideline you cited is just that, a guideline. The use of a spotter while blind side backing is only a suggestion. CTA could certainly implement a policy that prohibits or restricts backing up, as it does not conflict with state law.

[ThirdRailVision]

A few fun facts for those who may remember:

(Copied from the chicago-l.org website:)

"In honor of the 125th anniversary of the start of "L" service this year, we present these events that occured on this date, January 30:

1989: Evanston Express trains began stopping at Belmont, Fullerton and Chicago; express surcharge collected by conductors south of Howard double regular surcharge.

1994: Madison/Wells station closed, for replacement by Washington/Wells"

[BusHunter]

I remember early on the conductors used to walk the train and collect fares with their portable fare collection equipment. Good memories. They would walk car to car collecting everyone's fare but those entering at stations in Evanston had cards or something that stated they paid in advance. Those paying on train I believed paid more. 

 

[Busjack]

19 hours ago, BusHunter said:

I remember early on the conductors used to walk the train and collect fares with their portable fare collection equipment. Good memories. They would walk car to car collecting everyone's fare but those entering at stations in Evanston had cards or something that stated they paid in advance. Those paying on train I believed paid more. 

 

There were several ways of doing it, and what I know only goes back to about 1972, or when CTA took over local Evanston bus service. In that situation, a fare checker would board at South Blvd., and you needed either a through check or a Chicago transfer.

Later on (mid 1990s), if you were on the southbound Evanston Express you needed to buy a 50 cent ID CHECK, and the conductor would check it between Howard and Belmont, or charge you. From the 1995 map:

Obviously, that ended when the conductors did.

Also, way before mag cards and Ventra, there were roaming conductors when agents weren't in the stations. Besides the operators collecting fares on the single unit trains in Evanston, I remember conductors doing it on Lake on the weekends. There were barriers on the platform to make sure that you entered the car where the conductor was, but allowed you to exit any car.

 

[sw4400]

Here's a little video of a DE60LF needing a little help to get out of the Howard Terminal in 2014.

 

[Busjack]

7 hours ago, sw4400 said:

Here's a little video of a DE60LF needing a little help to get out of the Howard Terminal in 2014.

Not quite as good as news footage of one NABI pushing another downtown, and since the problem was turning in from Rogers Ave., they should have hooked the tow truck to the front.

[andrethebusman]

23 hours ago, Busjack said:

There were several ways of doing it, and what I know only goes back to about 1972, or when CTA took over local Evanston bus service. In that situation, a fare checker would board at South Blvd., and you needed either a through check or a Chicago transfer.

Later on (mid 1990s), if you were on the southbound Evanston Express you needed to buy a 50 cent ID CHECK, and the conductor would check it between Howard and Belmont, or charge you. From the 1995 map:

Obviously, that ended when the conductors did.

Also, way before mag cards and Ventra, there were roaming conductors when agents weren't in the stations. Besides the operators collecting fares on the single unit trains in Evanston, I remember conductors doing it on Lake on the weekends. There were barriers on the platform to make sure that you entered the car where the conductor was, but allowed you to exit any car.

 

Conductors collected fares on trains all over the L. Until the 1980's, the only route they did not was the North-South. Anywhere else any time you had two car trains you had on train fare collection at most stations. Even NS had on train fare collection evenings and at night at a relatively few stations (Jarvis, Granville, Thorndale, Berwyn, Argyle, Lawrence, Sheridan, Indiana, Garfield, 61st, King, Cottage Grove, Wentworth, Harvard,Racine) after they started running 2 car trains evenings.

Lake St had a LOT of on-train collecting. WB California and Kedzie were 24-hour Pay on Train by 1970's.

[Busjack]

Tribune column that the 40th Anniversary of the Wabash-Lake wreck is coming up. At the time it proved that ATC was not foolproof, espeically with a fool at the controls.

[strictures]

2 hours ago, Busjack said:

Tribune column that the 40th Anniversary of the Wabash-Lake wreck is coming up. At the time it proved that ATC was not foolproof, especially with a fool at the controls.

Didn't the motorman of the second train test positive for pot?

[Busjack]

12 minutes ago, strictures said:

Didn't the motorman of the second train test positive for pot?

Chicago-l.org indicates to that effect, but the Tribune article says no. Chicago-l also mentions that the operator had a poor safety record and was said to have been playing lady's man at the time.

[Busjack]

Another thing mentioned in the Tribune article indicates the softheadedness of the Carter administration. Carter offered "help" even though the cab signal system on that stretch was comparatively new, and somehow that transitioned into wanting money for a Franklin subway, which never happened. Maybe the theory was that if there were a Franklin subway, the Ravenswood train wouldn't have been there to hit. Or maybe it was a simple case of "never fail to take advantage of a crisis."

But the Tribune writer is also wrong--red doesn't mean stop and keeps the train stopped, even today.

[strictures]

4 hours ago, Busjack said:

Chicago-l.org indicates to that effect, but the Tribune article says no. Chicago-l also mentions that the operator had a poor safety record and was said to have been playing lady's man at the time.

I remember that the second train was operating under "Flasher 15", which meant the motorman could go up to 15MPH, as long as he was attentive.

Obviously he wasn't.

And I've seen numerous motormen & bus drivers more concerned with a pretty woman seated just behind them than operating their trains or buses. Not much on the train lately, due to single person operation.

[BusHunter]

Yeah but how you be that blind??? Randolph/Wabash is right there!! It probably was the drugs more than anything. Wouldn't someone in that circumstance be negligible for vehicular manslaughter. They were being willfully neglectful. It's even worse than Brittany Hayward who can at least subscribe that she was overworked and maybe get some sympathy from us poor overworked souls out here. 

I hope the union didn't try to protect him but they probably did as that's there job. But what are they going to say, the pressures of the job made him smoke pot. Really!! 

 

[Busjack]

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Yeah but how you be that blind??? Randolph/Wabash is right there!!

He was going from Randolph-Wabash NB and was pushed over the edge at the turn at Randolph-Lake. At that time, the girder wasn't there, and since it was obvious to me that the girder on the Randolph-Wabash platform was all that kept the other six cars from going over the edge, I wrote CTA that a guard girder was necessary. I'm sure they listened to me

As all the accounts note, the outer loop was backed up because the Evanston trains were also there, and presumably the Ravenswood train was stopped short of State-Lake.

IIRC, there was a similar rules infraction SB on the North Main on the Oak St. Curve about 10 years ago.

2 hours ago, BusHunter said:

Wouldn't someone in that circumstance be negligible for vehicular manslaughter. They were being willfully neglectful.

It would be involuntary manslaughter instead of vehicular homicide (no motor vehicle), but both are the same crime. I'm surprised there isn't any mention of him being charged, since you are right that recklessness was demonstrated.

Finally, as I noted above, there is disagreement whether pot played a role, but certainly he wasn't looking and had a history of incidents.

[ThirdRailVision]

Well, here we go again with another "renewed effort" to build that Downtown to O'Hare express system:

https://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20170209/austin/express-rail-ohare-airport-high-speed-train-rahm-emanuel

Thoughts?

[Busjack]

1 hour ago, ThirdRailVision said:

Well, here we go again with another "renewed effort" to build that Downtown to O'Hare express system:

https://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20170209/austin/express-rail-ohare-airport-high-speed-train-rahm-emanuel

Thoughts?

As usual there is always money for consultants, although planning seems necessary to do something.

The issue back 10 years ago (consultant's report on the CTA Airport Express from Block 37 to the airports) was that it would take a private investment of about $1.5 billion based on an assumption that airport riders would pay about $10 a trip for, as Roe Conn put it, "someone not peeing on your shoes." A  Suin-Times story refers to when Mayor Daley ramped that up to high speed rail, presumably off the L. They are now talking about a $25-40 ticket, which is what it might take, because they may now need $3 billion of private investment, and some sources point out, no one in sight to provide it.

What was notable in the DNAInfo you cited was:"Emanuel's speech — delivered in the hall of the Laborers District Council on the Near West Side decorated with massive pictures of the mayor celebrating a wide variety of projects across the city..." i.e. trying to buy votes with promises but without funding, in my view.

The S-T story also points out that funding hasn't been found for the Red Line Extension, which Rahm has also promised.

You should also note that this is not a CTA project, but a Department of Aviation one.

 

[geneking7320]

Hi All;

It's time for a few questions:

Given that current Metra North Central schedules show the train taking 33 minutes from Union Station to O'Hare transfer station.

1. What is the cost of extending the Airport Transit System to the Metra station?

2. What would be the cost of enough DMU railcars to operate the service at a desirable frequency?

3. What would be the cost of additional rights needed to operate those trains?

4. If you don't like that route how about a spur off a present Metra route which comes close to O'Hare>

[Busjack]

37 minutes ago, geneking7320 said:

Hi All;

It's time for a few questions:

3. What would be the cost of additional rights needed to operate those trains?

Essentially, though, Rahm doesn't envision the Chinese (now that someone has decided to kissy up to their premier) investing in Metra or anything else about Metra, and also the CN isn't happy about Metra being on its property, as it is. CP is also making a stink about the Tollway wanting to go over its yard. In short, to have any starter, one would have to propose double decking in the current route of the NCS over the Metra/CP and CN. The consultant's report back 10 years ago suggested double decking the UP-NW and shoving I-90 to the shoulders west of Jefferson Park, if that's any guideline.

[BusHunter]

8 hours ago, geneking7320 said:

Hi All;

It's time for a few questions:

Given that current Metra North Central schedules show the train taking 33 minutes from Union Station to O'Hare transfer station.

1. What is the cost of extending the Airport Transit System to the Metra station?

2. What would be the cost of enough DMU railcars to operate the service at a desirable frequency?

3. What would be the cost of additional rights needed to operate those trains?

4. If you don't like that route how about a spur off a present Metra route which comes close to O'Hare>

Practically the airport express will go to the Metra now that its being extended to what used to be the far end of the ohare remote lots. Its just a matter of making a connection through the new car rental facility.

[Busjack]

45 minutes ago, BusHunter said:

Practically the airport express will go to the Metra now that its being extended to what used to be the far end of the ohare remote lots. Its just a matter of making a connection through the new car rental facility.

1. People aren't going to do that for a $35 ride, especially if they can call an Uber (or whatever will be the autonomous car service in 2030, which may indicate that this concept is already obsolete).
2. I also figure it can't high speed if it has to go through the junctions at Fulton before Ashland, Bloomingdale, and Franklin Park.

[BusHunter]

On Tuesday, January 31, 2017 at 0:46 PM, andrethebusman said:

Conductors collected fares on trains all over the L. Until the 1980's, the only route they did not was the North-South. Anywhere else any time you had two car trains you had on train fare collection at most stations. Even NS had on train fare collection evenings and at night at a relatively few stations (Jarvis, Granville, Thorndale, Berwyn, Argyle, Lawrence, Sheridan, Indiana, Garfield, 61st, King, Cottage Grove, Wentworth, Harvard,Racine) after they started running 2 car trains evenings.

Lake St had a LOT of on-train collecting. WB California and Kedzie were 24-hour Pay on Train by 1970's.

Yeah I remember the red line running 2 car trains early on sunday mornings around '89 if you can believe that.