Guest Posted June 7, 2012 Report Share Posted June 7, 2012 With both the deliveries for the Seattle deal and the 425 bus contract both later this year there might be around 80 by the time the project starts. Weather it goes straight to 77th or shuffled between Kedzie, NP,103rd and 77th is the question. Also it looks like 103rd has room for 50 more buses at the most even if the NABIs are cleared. The area those are stored in dont seem like a place for in service equipment. 77th always gets the first new buses! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted June 7, 2012 Report Share Posted June 7, 2012 77th always gets the first new buses! Not always. Archer with 1000s both times (circa 1972 and 2006). 4400s first to NP, 5300s and 7500s first to 103. Basically, one could say 77th for 6000s, which were soon gone for the first 6400s. The only thing that can be said with relative certainty is that 69/74 was the last to get anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artthouwill Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 77th always gets the first new buses! I would disagree. The first 7400s I think went to NP, the first 9000s went to 69th , the 9600s were NP,the 9800s went first to Beverly. Those that 77th DID get first, like the 6000 Flxs, they lost ( those went to F and K and 77th got the 5300 Flxs. 77th got the last of the 9600s from 9759 thru 9799, then swapped for some 9600s, then lost them all. The also lost the4000 Nee Flyer series altogether). Besides by South Shops being the main major repair shop neing on the premises at 77th, what bettet place to test new equipment out?.. Not far to go iif it fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dann Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 77th always gets the first new buses! 77th did get the first Novas. However, the (presumed) fact that they're getting new buses is justified in this case because they currently have the oldest buses in the CTA's fleet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam92 Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 77th did get the first Novas. However, the (presumed) fact that they're getting new buses is justified in this case because they currently have the oldest buses in the CTA's fleet. True, the first 71 artics that come in can retire 6400-6470 at 77th. I wonder if 1930-1963 will remain there or go to Chicago after that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 A couple of thoughts about the rehabs on 1000-2029... -Will the rebuilt buses have LED Lighting(either the blue colored bulbs in 1630-2029, or the brighter ones seen in 4150-4209)? -Will the rebuilt buses be all Cummins ISL powered(1000-1629 currently have Cummins ISM Engines)? -Will the rebuilt buses all have Allison Transmissions(1000-1929 currently have a ZF Transmission)? -Will the rebuilt buses have Bowling Alley Style seats seen on 1930-2029? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dann Posted June 10, 2012 Report Share Posted June 10, 2012 A couple of thoughts about the rehabs on 1000-2029... -Will the rebuilt buses have LED Lighting(either the blue colored bulbs in 1630-2029, or the brighter ones seen in 4150-4209)? -Will the rebuilt buses be all Cummins ISL powered(1000-1629 currently have Cummins ISM Engines)? -Will the rebuilt buses all have Allison Transmissions(1000-1929 currently have a ZF Transmission)? -Will the rebuilt buses have Bowling Alley Style seats seen on 1930-2029? I wouldn't be surprised if they go with the bowling alley style seating, seeing that the newest buses have that. Unless they did surveys with riders who gave it a thumbs-down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam92 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 A couple of thoughts about the rehabs on 1000-2029... -Will the rebuilt buses have LED Lighting(either the blue colored bulbs in 1630-2029, or the brighter ones seen in 4150-4209)? -Will the rebuilt buses be all Cummins ISL powered(1000-1629 currently have Cummins ISM Engines)? -Will the rebuilt buses all have Allison Transmissions(1000-1929 currently have a ZF Transmission)? -Will the rebuilt buses have Bowling Alley Style seats seen on 1930-2029? From what it looks like, any interior lights would probably be like 4150-4207 as the lights that go out get replaced with that style of lighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 A couple of thoughts about the rehabs on 1000-2029... -Will the rebuilt buses... I said a couple of weeks ago: The specs for the overhauls of 600 and 429 1000 series buses are up, so if you are interested, you could check. Personally. I'm not. Since newport told you how to do that, why don't you do your own work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 The specs for the overhauls of 600 and 429 1000 series buses are up, so if you are interested, you could check. Personally. I'm not. I didn't spot any mention of lighting changes. Note we're talking about a 300-page un-searchable PDF here, so I might have missed something. Rahm Emanuel said "only the steel frame will remain," but the RFP seems to suggest otherwise. For example, the RFP calls only for replacement of seat inserts, with no mention of a standardization of seats that was speculated earlier in this thread. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 Looks like bidding won't begin for the 450 Qty(300-450 40' models and 50-150 60' models) buses until 8/22/12 and will end on 9/10/12. So, we should know who won the bid for the order(s) by 10/31/12 at the latest I think. How long after the winning bidder should it take for CTA to announce the manufacturer info??? Procurement Info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 Looks like bidding won't begin for the 450 Qty(300-450 40' models and 50-150 60' models) buses until 8/22/12 and will end on 9/10/12. So, we should know who won the bid for the order(s) by 10/31/12 at the latest I think. How long after the winning bidder should it take for CTA to announce the manufacturer info??? Procurement Info First you will have to compare this to various ones (such as for the 1050 buses) for which there were innumerable red notices like this. Second, you have to remember that both NABI and New Flyer announced being low bidders or having contracts for contracts they didn't have. Other than that, whatever time it takes staff to verify the bid for compliance with the solicitation, and to get the recommendation to the Board for legally necessary rubber stamping. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BusHunter Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 77th always gets the first new buses! In this case they need them for the Ryan shutdown. But if you look at the history the South Side always gets buses first. Look at the fleet numbers and you will see this. I don't think Fg has ever had buses first, and North Park once (#7000's and #7100's) The way I figure this order, when all is done they could go with 4 garages of 80 40' buses each. (Fg, C, 74, 77) The LFR artics would go to (NP,K,77,103) but 77th could end up with half an LFR artic fleet (versus #4000's) depending on if they can get back the #6. It may end up most of the 103rd #4000's end up at 77th, and 103rd becomes mostly LFR's. I don't think 103rd would need more than 70-80 artics anyway. I'm wondering what there going to do for buses anyway when BRT (lite) starts. There only going to have the 100 LFR's by the time the ryan starts. They may just take 75 percent of the LFR's at 103rd and 77th gets 25 percent and all of the 103rd #4000's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.cta85 Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 What is the possibility of cta going with NABI to build the 40ft buses?, pace NABI's seem to be holding up well still. I can understand why cta wouldn't want another problem with articulated buses but making 40ft buses shouldn't be a problem. I'm only asking that question because I'm noticing besides cta Nova buses it's pretty much New Flyer running throughout our system. And I remember as a kid even as the early 2000's we had a variety of buses from the M.A.N's, Flixbles, remaining old Flyers, and New Flyers all running. I guess I missed seeing so many different type of buses in Chicago you can call it wishful thinking that maybe in the future we can see that again a different variety of good running buses for cta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetroShadow Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 What is the possibility of cta going with NABI to build the 40ft buses?, pace NABI's seem to be holding up well still. The case of the 7500's tell a different story. I can understand why cta wouldn't want another problem with articulated buses but making 40ft buses shouldn't be a problem. I'm only asking that question because I'm noticing besides cta Nova buses it's pretty much New Flyer running throughout our system. And I remember as a kid even as the early 2000's we had a variety of buses from the M.A.N's, Flixbles, remaining old Flyers, and New Flyers all running. I guess I missed seeing so many different type of buses in Chicago you can call it wishful thinking that maybe in the future we can see that again a different variety of good running buses for cta. When I was younger (I was 5 when the TMC's and Flxibles hit the road), I was fascinated by the variety that we have. Now, I'm just glad if the bus can operate correctly and if the HVAC systems actually work. I would be surprised if they went back to NABI, but the market is shrinking, so who knows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitowndude84 Posted July 20, 2012 Report Share Posted July 20, 2012 I think the CTA would go with Gillig or Eldorado before thinking of NABI EVER again !! But then again CTA board members aren't know for their common sense and logical decision making lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoNova Posted July 22, 2012 Report Share Posted July 22, 2012 I can see NF #1289 has the LED interior lighting that the NF artics 4150-4207 have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geneking7320 Posted July 22, 2012 Report Share Posted July 22, 2012 I think the CTA would go with Gillig or Eldorado before thinking of NABI EVER again !! But then again CTA board members aren't know for their common sense and logical decision making lol Considering what you said brings about this question: Can a transit agency using Federal funds for capital expenses categorically disqualify a vendor due to prior products/services from said vendor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitowndude84 Posted July 22, 2012 Report Share Posted July 22, 2012 Considering what you said brings about this question: Can a transit agency using Federal funds for capital expenses categorically disqualify a vendor due to prior products/services from said vendor? Hmmmm VERY good question !!!! .I hate to,But I would assume that the CTA would have to send a request to the FTA to exclude NABI from ANY future bus purchase bidding ??? Can I also assume that the current legal issues (CTA VS NABI) regarding the 7500's would automatically block them from bidding ?? Perhaps,More of a question for Busjack to answer. ?? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted July 22, 2012 Report Share Posted July 22, 2012 Considering what you said brings about this question: Can a transit agency using Federal funds for capital expenses categorically disqualify a vendor due to prior products/services from said vendor? As I noted, the specifications have neutral requirements such as "Details on standardizing bus with current CTA equipment," "Altoona test report," in effect, shaker test report, and most significantly "Report on structural defects experienced on Contractor's proposed vehicle [including] remedial measures taken on vehicles and to address subsequent production." There are also requirements regarding the Quality Assurance program. Also, despite what Mr. CTA 85 says, the solicitation is for a sliding amount of both 40 and 60 foot vehicles. They were not advertised separately. Finally, the federal funds aren't involved, as the Press Release says "funding coming entirely from the CTA through its sales-tax dollars." So, even though assemblers protested the spec in 1988 to the FTA, the FTA doesn't have jurisdiction this time. And for the NABI lovers out there (and certainly the Pace driver who was once here isn't), what makes you think that after 7 years of complaints (including withholding final payment) and 4 years of unresolved litigation, anyone at CTA would find them qualified. Remember, in 2004,NABI announced that it was the low bidder for 1050 buses, but that contract was rebid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetroShadow Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 There's always Nova and (if they get their acts together) Millennium Transit should Gillig, New Flyer and Eldorado not want to bid. Nova improved on their product in recent years (this after I took a trip to NYC last year). So if I read the statement correctly, just to clarify, would this RFP be open to foreign buses too (I.E. VanHools?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busjack Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 There's always Nova and (if they get their acts together) Millennium Transit should Gillig, New Flyer and Eldorado not want to bid. Nova improved on their product in recent years (this after I took a trip to NYC last year). So if I read the statement correctly, just to clarify, would this RFP be open to foreign buses too (I.E. VanHools?) In reverse order: They still have to meet Buy America Act certification (according to page 13 of the solicitation), so no.As I said in response to Mr. CTA 85, the solicitation is for a sliding number of both 40 and 60 foot buses, so Nova and NF seem to be the only qualified bidders.*Now, if this has become the "what if" board, fine, but most of this talk is fantasy. ________ *Assuming what I said in reply to Gene King, above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam92 Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 I can see NF #1289 has the LED interior lighting that the NF artics 4150-4207 have. You sure that wasn't 1283 you saw? Cause it has them in blue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwantae Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 There's always Nova and (if they get their acts together) Millennium Transit should Gillig, New Flyer and Eldorado not want to bid. Nova improved on their product in recent years (this after I took a trip to NYC last year). So if I read the statement correctly, just to clarify, would this RFP be open to foreign buses too (I.E. VanHools?) I heard that SEPTA was won the bid for 245 orders from NOVA (155 Artics and 90 40 foot (Hybrids) I guess they lost the bid on New Flyers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sw4400 Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 The order is for a Minimum of 300(Three Hundred) 40' Buses up to 450(Four Hundred Fifty) 40' Buses and 50(Fifty) 60' Buses up to 150(One Hundred Fifty) 60' Buses. The most likely combinations of 40'-60' Buses are the following: 300-150* 325-125 350-100* 375-75 400-50* *=Most likely combinations of 40' and 60' Buses Contract Info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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