Dan Ryan Track Renewal Project

[artthouwill]

I think we all agree that the Red Line shutdown is necessary and is the best way to go. I don't know if there is a perfect contingency plan to provide alternate service for those affected, for I'm sure I can find holes with every one. I've stated before that I am against shuttle buses for those Red Line stations at 79th and 69th, touting using existing North South parallel bus service along Ashland, Racine, Halsted, King Drive, and Cottage Grove to connect to Green/Red rail service. Even those between 95th and 79th can use this option along Ashland, Halsted (via an 8A extension to 63rd), King Drive and Cottage Grove.

As Mike points out, its those passengers south of 95th that are most affected and that is where his plan comes into play. However, CTA and Metra would have to come into agreement, and I really don't believe CTA has any interest in forking over any money to Metra. Metra would need to recoup extra costs with providing this extra service, plus any potential loss of fare revenue caused by some of its own inner city riders shifting to CTA fare media in the affected zones. Mike sells the ME portion just fine and that is workable. Even in the reverse commute, the Kensington Local trains to 111th can staff portable fare collection at the doors of each car at Randolph, Van Buren, and 11th St stations for those trains only. But this plan does not take into consideration those that live along the RI corridor, either along Vincennes Ave or the Beverly Branch. Perhaps designate one or two cars specifically for CTA fare media boarding inbound (the rearmost cars?) and the rest for Metra ops. However, I'm sure that won't go over well with Metra regular riders.

It is too bad that RTA, as a supposed oversight agency, can't force these agencies to work together. It may seem off topic, but it is very relevant that capital projects for construction, fleet purchases, new starts, etc. do not go through this agency. Even the Universal card should go through the RTA. But to get back on point, CTA clearly needs help, Metra is in a position to help, and seemingly that possibility won't happen.

I wonder what would happen if those in the affected areas could go to, say CTA headquarters, and purchase transit cards or passes, and also receive a Metra ticket to help total the value of the intended purchase? The largest value of a Metra ticket would be a Zone D (Blue Island Branch), but the vast majority of tickets sold would probably fall within the B and C Zones. These could be special issue tickets valid only for the 5 month period of Red Line and can be a combination of one-way, ten rides or even monthly tickets. This way, no portable fare collection is necessary. For instance, one person purchases a CTA monthly pass. He lives at 103rd/Cottage Grove and works downtown. He could receive his monthly CTA pass and get either 4 ten ride tickets, or instead just receive a Metra Monthly. I would probably opt for the CTA pass and the ten rides. This would definitely be his option if he worked in Schaumburg instead of downtown.Also these special Metra tickets would only be valid on ME and RI services only. I'm sure this idea has holes in it too, for I said I can find holes in any plan, but it is another idea to consider to help those Red Line riders navigate through the city for a five month period. Unfortunately, CTA and Metra have yet to prove that they can work together.

[Busjack]

I think we all agree that the Red Line shutdown is necessary and is the best way to go.

...

Not me. I had suggested earlier that if they have to shut something down, get south of Garfield fixed first, and then one would only have to shuttle between Wells and Prairie.

It is too bad that RTA, as a supposed oversight agency, can't force these agencies to work together. It may seem off topic, but it is very relevant that capital projects for construction, fleet purchases, new starts, etc. do not go through this agency. Even the Universal card should go through the RTA. But to get back on point, CTA clearly needs help, Metra is in a position to help, and seemingly that possibility won't happen....

Well, that's tne whole problem. I had suggested about 12 years ago that the only place to force something like the Gray Line is through the RTA, but even then Adam Kerman suggested elsewhere that it is a do nothing agency. Subsequent developments (including that PA96-35 and federal appropriations bypass it) just proved that.

I wonder what would happen if those in the affected areas could go to, say CTA headquarters, and purchase transit cards or passes, and also receive a Metra ticket to help total the value of the intended purchase?

Metra sells link up stickers and for those transferring from Pace, Pace sells the cheaper Metra-Pace Bus Plus. Since we were told above that fare integration was not the issue with regard to the Gray Line, there are alternatives, but as I said a long time ago, the only question is whether the CTA wants to use Build Illinois money to subsidize them, rather than running the 100 extra buses.

Update: To add to my last sentence: Since one of the things CTA has used to sell this to the community is that a certain number of bus drivers are going to get jobs, you know which way CTA is going. Bus drivers don't get jobs on Metra.

[CURRENTZ_09]

I promise you guys, the community meeting might give us hidden clues on what will happen. I also think, the CTA ought to create a project booklet instead of that project handout that only explains half of what they are telling people. The website (and hopefully a project booklet), may ease some of the concerns people have about this upcoming project. I know the details aren't final yet, but Claypool and Peterson really need to engage in conversation at these meetings instead of sitting up front, giving half-answered responses and having all those CTA officials standing around looking depressed and tired at these meetings while customers are expressing concern about the project and Claypool and Peterson laughing at people statements. I only hope they prepare for the 95th Community meetings, because the community meeting there is going to give CTA officials a wake up call on the non-responses there doing at these for mentioned meetings now.

[MetroShadow]

but here's just one MAJOR FLAW TO THIS COHESIVE PLAN? The CTA already made up its mind with there plan. They didnt integrate METRA & PACE IN 1996 and there not going to do it in spring 2013

And I doubt that Pace will go further north of 95th given constraints and loads on buses that serve there (never mind 353 buses already serve Kensington and to a lesser extent, Riverdale).

[CURRENTZ_09]

And I doubt that Pace will go further north of 95th given constraints and loads on buses that serve there (never mind 353 buses already serve Kensington and to a lesser extent, Riverdale).

Exactly pace are suburban feeder routes to cta period. I couldn't imagine even 1 pace bus (except the 2 that serve down via I55 and I90) serving chicago especially going through the southside to garfield and metra is just bogus period. Why not help out cta, you operate along the same corridor and cant come with alternative help to serve customers, shame RTA shame. Also will garfield serve as a fisable sub terminal for 5 months?

[Busjack]

...Why not help out cta, you operate along the same corridor and cant come with alternative help to serve customers, shame RTA shame....

That's the whole point. CTA doesn't recognize Pace's existence, because the laughing Chicago politicians don't have control of Pace. The Auditor General wrote that service overlap should have been fixed 5 years ago; CTA kept extending it into Pace territory until CTA was broke. And, as I mentioned above, the RTA is a do nothing agency. Even when the RTA director suggested that millions of dollars could be saved with coordination, both Pace and CTA essentially laughed at that.*

I've mentioned before the reason why Pace can't do anything about this: it would involve a 10 mile round trip extension and probably another hour added to its routes, for no more revenue, and for which Pace does not have the equipment.

___

*They did have an intergovernmental agreement that Pace would get onto the CTA open fare system, like Pace didn't have much choice, given that 40% of its riders transfer to and from CTA, and then said "see, we cooperate."

[Mike Payne]

I think we all agree that the Red Line shutdown is necessary and is the best way to go. I don't know if there is a perfect contingency plan to provide alternate service for those affected, for I'm sure I can find holes with every one. I've stated before that I am against shuttle buses for those Red Line stations at 79th and 69th, touting using existing North South parallel bus service along Ashland, Racine, Halsted, King Drive, and Cottage Grove to connect to Green/Red rail service. Even those between 95th and 79th can use this option along Ashland, Halsted (via an 8A extension to 63rd), King Drive and Cottage Grove.

As Mike points out, its those passengers south of 95th that are most affected and that is where his plan comes into play. However, CTA and Metra would have to come into agreement, and I really don't believe CTA has any interest in forking over any money to Metra. Metra would need to recoup extra costs with providing this extra service, plus any potential loss of fare revenue caused by some of its own inner city riders shifting to CTA fare media in the affected zones. Mike sells the ME portion just fine and that is workable. Even in the reverse commute, the Kensington Local trains to 111th can staff portable fare collection at the doors of each car at Randolph, Van Buren, and 11th St stations for those trains only. But this plan does not take into consideration those that live along the RI corridor, either along Vincennes Ave or the Beverly Branch. Perhaps designate one or two cars specifically for CTA fare media boarding inbound (the rearmost cars?) and the rest for Metra ops. However, I'm sure that won't go over well with Metra regular riders.

It is too bad that RTA, as a supposed oversight agency, can't force these agencies to work together. It may seem off topic, but it is very relevant that capital projects for construction, fleet purchases, new starts, etc. do not go through this agency. Even the Universal card should go through the RTA. But to get back on point, CTA clearly needs help, Metra is in a position to help, and seemingly that possibility won't happen.

I wonder what would happen if those in the affected areas could go to, say CTA headquarters, and purchase transit cards or passes, and also receive a Metra ticket to help total the value of the intended purchase? The largest value of a Metra ticket would be a Zone D (Blue Island Branch), but the vast majority of tickets sold would probably fall within the B and C Zones. These could be special issue tickets valid only for the 5 month period of Red Line and can be a combination of one-way, ten rides or even monthly tickets. This way, no portable fare collection is necessary. For instance, one person purchases a CTA monthly pass. He lives at 103rd/Cottage Grove and works downtown. He could receive his monthly CTA pass and get either 4 ten ride tickets, or instead just receive a Metra Monthly. I would probably opt for the CTA pass and the ten rides. This would definitely be his option if he worked in Schaumburg instead of downtown.Also these special Metra tickets would only be valid on ME and RI services only. I'm sure this idea has holes in it too, for I said I can find holes in any plan, but it is another idea to consider to help those Red Line riders navigate through the city for a five month period. Unfortunately, CTA and Metra have yet to prove that they can work together.

Remember All - there is still a year before ANY of this starts to happen, there is PLENTY of time to consider what type of service can be provided by whom. For that I must give CTA credit - because everybody is still acting pretty much like construction starts next week!

[CURRENTZ_09]

Remember All - there is still a year before ANY of this starts to happen, there is PLENTY of time to consider what type of service can be provided by whom. For that I must give CTA credit - because everybody is still acting pretty much like construction starts next week!

We must think like this because CTA might pull a fast one and then what if this proposed plan goes in to effect and its a HUGE BUST, then what, youll spend the entire 5 months trying to fix somethingg that was a bust and spending more money in the process

[Busjack]

We must think like this because CTA might pull a fast one and then what if this proposed plan goes in to effect and its a HUGE BUST, then what, youll spend the entire 5 months trying to fix somethingg that was a bust and spending more money in the process

Also, one also has to remember that the CTA Tatter reported that CTA closed down all the streets around Morse without any warning.

Chicago politicians have a history of this (like when Daley told Kruesi to rip up Meigs field overnight--about the only thing he was competent to do).

[Mike Payne]

Will anyone be attending the Metra Strategic Plan meeting Downtown tomorrow? (in reference to Metra assisting in the Red Line shutdown - and interagency cooperation in general): http://gridchicago.com/2012/metra-seeks-public-input-to-develop-first-strategic-plan-in-decades/

And the CTA Red Line Shutdown meeting next Saturday (I will be at both): http://www.transitchicago.com/redsouth/

[CURRENTZ_09]

Will anyone be attending the Metra Strategic Plan meeting Downtown tomorrow? (in reference to Metra assisting in the Red Line shutdown - and interagency cooperation in general): http://gridchicago.com/2012/metra-seeks-public-input-to-develop-first-strategic-plan-in-decades/

And the CTA Red Line Shutdown meeting next Saturday (I will be at both): http://www.transitchicago.com/redsouth/

I will be at the red line south

[CURRENTZ_09]

53 Minutes and the meeting was over

Cermak Meeting Saturday July 14th 2012

That's right in 53 minutes, the press got their photoshops, people answered the CORRECT questions and the audience was attended by a good 35-40. Terry and Claypool layed out the details stated that the 24 and 29 will have enhanced services in the planning stages, still in talks with Metra about services beyond 95th south and Cermak-Chinatown-Roosevelt 24 hour Shuttle. Also increased security around the project area, Green Line/Red Line and Southsides bus routes. All questions were answered and the CTA's Cermak meeting was over in 53 mins. Stay tuned for future meeting dates and thanks Mr. Harrison (You know who you are) for a fantastic voyage of CTA's Past, Present and Future.

[Sam92]

53 Minutes and the meeting was over

Cermak Meeting Saturday July 14th 2012

That's right in 53 minutes, the press got their photoshops, people answered the CORRECT questions and the audience was attended by a good 35-40. Terry and Claypool layed out the details stated that the 24 and 29 will have enhanced services in the planning stages, still in talks with Metra about services beyond 95th south and Cermak-Chinatown-Roosevelt 24 hour Shuttle. Also increased security around the project area, Green Line/Red Line and Southsides bus routes. All questions were answered and the CTA's Cermak meeting was over in 53 mins. Stay tuned for future meeting dates and thanks Mr. Harrison (You know who you are) for a fantastic voyage of CTA's Past, Present and Future.

Any mention of the 26? I know its also getting beefed up but will it become bidirectional and perhaps run outside of the rush?

[CURRENTZ_09]

Any mention of the 26? I know its also getting beefed up but will it become bidirectional and perhaps run outside of the rush?

Nope, just the 24 and 29, about the security and the Cermak-Chinatown Shuttle to Roosevelt that they were most concerned about. The 50 cent discount is staying and they have a private meeting with the contractors on July 18th on 95th at Chicago State University.

[Busjack]

...and they have a private meeting with the contractors on July 18th on 95th at Chicago State University.

So, I suppose the results of that will be posted here about 7:30 p.m. on Wednesday, but not by you.

I'm still waiting for a public meeting around there. I'll bet it lasts more than 53 minutes.

[CURRENTZ_09]

So, I suppose the results of that will be posted here about 7:30 p.m. on Wednesday, but not by you.

I'm still waiting for a public meeting around there. I'll bet it lasts more than 53 minutes.

The meeting at July 18th will be from 10am to 12pm and this is a private affair

[Busjack]

... and they have a private meeting with the contractors on July 18th on 95th at Chicago State University.

The meeting at July 18th will be from 10am to 12pm and the results will be posted by..............ME!!!!!!!!!

So, if it is a private meeting, how do you get in? Or did you mispost above?

A further public meeting hasn't been posted on the Red Line South page on transitchicago.com yet.

[CURRENTZ_09]

So, if it is a private meeting, how do you get in? Or did you mispost above?

A further public meeting hasn't been posted on the Red Line South page on transitchicago.com yet.

It was announced at the meeting, the next community meetings could be announced anyday now.

[chicagopcclcar]

So, if it is a private meeting, how do you get in? Or did you mispost above?

A further public meeting hasn't been posted on the Red Line South page on transitchicago.com yet.

The meeting is not really "private." That is a misunderstanding. The meeting is for DBE and is part of a scheduled series of meetings separate from the public information meetings. Here is the page from the CTA website:

DBE Meet-and-Greet Sessions

The following DBE Meet-and-Greet sessions are scheduled:

Monday, July 9, 2012

Chicago Urban League

4510 South Michigan Avenue

Chicago, IL

Friday, July 13, 2012

Malcolm X College

Cultural Center

1900 W. Van Buren St

Chicago, IL

Wednesday, July 18, 2012

Chicago State University

Library, Fourth Floor Auditorium

9501 S. King Drive

Chicago, IL

This is the page on the CTA website for jobs and contractors interested in participating:

http://www.transitch...dsouthjobs.aspx

Glad to have been of help.

DH

[CURRENTZ_09]

So, if it is a private meeting, how do you get in? Or did you mispost above?

A further public meeting hasn't been posted on the Red Line South page on transitchicago.com yet.

Thank you @ PCC

[Busjack]

Thank you @ PCC

You haven't still answered how you qualify to attend the meeting.

[CURRENTZ_09]

You haven't still answered how you qualify to attend the meeting.

PCC ANSWERED THAT FOR U

[chicagopcclcar]

You haven't still answered how you qualify to attend the meeting.

I answered it. Post 219. OK?

D.H.

[Busjack]

PCC ANSWERED THAT FOR U

No he diddn't.

This is supposedly a meeting for DBE candidates, not for the public to vent. So, how are you a DBE canddiate?

Am I clear now?

[CURRENTZ_09]

No he diddn't.

This is supposedly a meeting for DBE candidates, not for the public to vent. So, how are you a DBE canddiate?

Am I clear now?

I am not PCC answered yourquestion, he was at the meeting with me. Like i stated before i do meet and greets with other transit observers.