More Bus Moves

[Master58]

16 hours ago, Shannoncvpi said:

Aw you don't like them at C bro 

Not really.  

[Shannoncvpi]

2 hours ago, Master58 said:

Not really.  

Dam I like em there

[Shannoncvpi]

On 11/10/2021 at 4:24 PM, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

also it is possible FG will be involved in these moves with 1051-1055, 1924, 1926,1928,1930-1933 going back to FG from 103rd and NP

Dam the those 1900's at 3 now they hope they send them back to C or P

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

1 hour ago, Shannoncvpi said:

Dam the those 1900's at 3 now they hope they send them back to C or P

no 3 doesn’t have any 1900’s they have 1051-1055 that were at FG but 103rd took back because of their artic problem FG has 1934-1936 and NP took their 1924 1926 1928 1930-1933

[Shannoncvpi]

55 minutes ago, Mr.NewFlyer1051 said:

no 3 doesn’t have any 1900’s they have 1051-1055 that were at FG but 103rd took back because of their artic problem FG has 1934-1936 and NP took their 1924 1926 1928 1930-1933

Aw I thought they was saying that the 1900's was at 3 also

[Master58]

3 hours ago, Shannoncvpi said:

Dam I like em there

I prefer artics on express routes. Chicago garage doesn't have any express routes that support artics. 

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

1574 back in service on the 77

[Shannoncvpi]

17 hours ago, Master58 said:

I prefer artics on express routes. Chicago garage doesn't have any express routes that support artics. 

Naw they don't I just like them there thats all 

[ChicagoNova]

I prefer to see artics on very busy routes, be they express or local.

[Sam92]

1 hour ago, ChicagoNova said:

I prefer to see artics on very busy routes, be they express or local.

Tbh if we had opened Fisk and made it the new Limits it could be doable. Then you could move routes like 31, 35, 24, 1, 51, 43, 120-125, 134, 143, 151 (Belmont) ,156 157  to Fisk then make room to convert routes like 2, 4, 20, 53, 66, 72, 79. What’s hurting Chicago and 77th from successfully using them right is having to chip in on downtown work and routes that a more centralized garage would better suit. Then sense the service needs are more spread out, manpower and space shouldn’t really be as much of an issue at those two garages because if 22 and 151 qualify then those others do it’s just a matter of clearing out the excess. Heck if you wanted to keep 87th and 3 in the mix make 77th exclusively artic, move south Kedzie and Pulaski somewhere else since they aren’t artic worthy then slim down the headways at 77th slightly. 

[pudgym29]

11 hours ago, ChicagoNova said:

I prefer to see artics on very busy routes, be they express or local.

I concur. I will also allow that some routes only require articulated buses at hours of peak ridership.

For example: Last Tuesday, I manage to schedule my COVID-19 booster vaccine {it had been six months since my second Moderna jab}. The venue with the allocation was Physicians Immediate Care - Park Ridge. It is Park Ridge, but it is also two blocks away from a bus stop on route #68 Northwest Hwy. So I rode CTA lines there.

I got the third shot. I needed to stop off at a transfer point and bring something back home to eat. When I went to catch a southbound #68 bus, the sign also indicated a stop for the Pace #209 bus. Swift (not the Skokie Swift) thinking deduced, "The #68 will get me to Jefferson Park. The #209 will get me to Harlem Blue Line. And it will be cheaper."

The #209 arrived one minute after the #68. I rode it the entire length of the line. We had four passengers in total.

Arriving at Harlem, I determined that instead of the Blue Line “L”, I should ride the CTA route #90 Harlem bus south to Belmont. There are multiple take-out options at Harlem | Belmont. I walked the small distance to the #90 southbound berth and boarded. The bus was already at capacity. Distancing from other passengers was impossible. 

This run needed a bigger bus. Since there is no space for lifts of 60-footers at Forest Glen, maybe some PM rush runs could get loaner 60-footers from another garage {#152 Addison school-trippers from North Park?}. All things considered, #90 Harlem is a smooth street with a clutch of traffic generators and key transfer points. [Foster, Harlem-Irving Plaza, Belmont {doh}, Grand, North Ave., Lake St.] 

[Erin Mishkin Jr.]

21 minutes ago, pudgym29 said:

I concur. I will also allow that some routes only require articulated buses at hours of peak ridership.

For example: Last Tuesday, I manage to schedule my COVID-19 booster vaccine {it had been six months since my second Moderna jab}. The venue with the allocation was Physicians Immediate Care - Park Ridge. It is Park Ridge, but it is also two blocks away from a bus stop on route #68 Northwest Hwy. So I rode CTA lines there.

I got the third shot. I needed to stop off at a transfer point and bring something back home to eat. When I went to catch a southbound #68 bus, the sign also indicated a stop for the Pace #209 bus. Swift (not the Skokie Swift) thinking deduced, "The #68 will get me to Jefferson Park. The #209 will get me to Harlem Blue Line. And it will be cheaper."

The #209 arrived one minute after the #68. I rode it the entire length of the line. We had four passengers in total.

Arriving at Harlem, I determined that instead of the Blue Line “L”, I should ride the CTA route #90 Harlem bus south to Belmont. There are multiple take-out options at Harlem | Belmont. I walked the small distance to the #90 southbound berth and boarded. The bus was already at capacity. Distancing from other passengers was impossible. 

This run needed a bigger bus. Since there is no space for lifts of 60-footers at Forest Glen, maybe some PM rush runs could get loaner 60-footers from another garage {#152 Addison school-trippers from North Park?}. All things considered, #90 Harlem is a smooth street with a clutch of traffic generators and key transfer points. [Foster, Harlem-Irving Plaza, Belmont {doh}, Grand, North Ave., Lake St.] 

Harlem isn’t an artic route due to tight turns at the green line which involve 40 foot buses only 

[artthouwill]

32 minutes ago, pudgym29 said:

I concur. I will also allow that some routes only require articulated buses at hours of peak ridership.

For example: Last Tuesday, I manage to schedule my COVID-19 booster vaccine {it had been six months since my second Moderna jab}. The venue with the allocation was Physicians Immediate Care - Park Ridge. It is Park Ridge, but it is also two blocks away from a bus stop on route #68 Northwest Hwy. So I rode CTA lines there.

I got the third shot. I needed to stop off at a transfer point and bring something back home to eat. When I went to catch a southbound #68 bus, the sign also indicated a stop for the Pace #209 bus. Swift (not the Skokie Swift) thinking deduced, "The #68 will get me to Jefferson Park. The #209 will get me to Harlem Blue Line. And it will be cheaper."

The #209 arrived one minute after the #68. I rode it the entire length of the line. We had four passengers in total.

Arriving at Harlem, I determined that instead of the Blue Line “L”, I should ride the CTA route #90 Harlem bus south to Belmont. There are multiple take-out options at Harlem | Belmont. I walked the small distance to the #90 southbound berth and boarded. The bus was already at capacity. Distancing from other passengers was impossible. 

This run needed a bigger bus. Since there is no space for lifts of 60-footers at Forest Glen, maybe some PM rush runs could get loaner 60-footers from another garage {#152 Addison school-trippers from North Park?}. All things considered, #90 Harlem is a smooth street with a clutch of traffic generators and key transfer points. [Foster, Harlem-Irving Plaza, Belmont {doh}, Grand, North Ave., Lake St.] 

The heaviest portion of the 90 is between Harlem Blue Line and Grand.   South of Grand is supplanted by the 307 and the 318 also supplements south of North Ave..  While artics would not work because of the Green Line viaduct, perhaps a 307 extension to Harlem and Irving Plaza or Norridge Commons would help. 

[pudgym29]

You're locked-in to making the route go under the underpass at Marion St. What if you had it turn left (north) on Marion St, or Forest Ave., to Lake St.? The bus would stand, and board, at the north exit of the Green Line “L” stop. There's no low-clearance underpass there.

[Policeman]

9 hours ago, artthouwill said:

The heaviest portion of the 90 is between Harlem Blue Line and Grand.   South of Grand is supplanted by the 307 and the 318 also supplements south of North Ave..  While artics would not work because of the Green Line viaduct, perhaps a 307 extension to Harlem and Irving Plaza or Norridge Commons would help. 

Maybe the 307 coming every 15-20 mins cuz i think the 90 runs every 10-25 mins

[NewFlyerMCI]

10 hours ago, artthouwill said:

The heaviest portion of the 90 is between Harlem Blue Line and Grand.   South of Grand is supplanted by the 307 and the 318 also supplements south of North Ave..  While artics would not work because of the Green Line viaduct, perhaps a 307 extension to Harlem and Irving Plaza or Norridge Commons would help. 

 

46 minutes ago, Policeman said:

Maybe the 307 coming every 15-20 mins cuz i think the 90 runs every 10-25 mins

Better to just cut the 90, replace it with the 307, increase frequency on the 307 and have the two terminals be Elmwood Village or Harlem Blue Line. The bulk of the 307's ridership comes north of Ogden anyway, and the route won't be that much longer.

[Erin Mishkin Jr.]

59 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

 

Better to just cut the 90, replace it with the 307, increase frequency on the 307 and have the two terminals be Elmwood Village or Harlem Blue Line. The bulk of the 307's ridership comes north of Ogden anyway, and the route won't be that much longer.

I think 307 is long enough it doesn’t need an extension. 90 is a key route so cutting a key route may not be a good idea. 90 is my main route most of the time I get off at grand sometimes it’s crowded after grand but then chills once we pass grand SB.

 

11 hours ago, pudgym29 said:

You're locked-in to making the route go under the underpass at Marion St. What if you had it turn left (north) on Marion St, or Forest Ave., to Lake St.? The bus would stand, and board, at the north exit of the Green Line “L” stop. There's no low-clearance underpass there.

lake street is too narrow for artics as lake is a single lane street between Harlem and forest ave and an artic would be a big problem there

[Erin Mishkin Jr.]

1 hour ago, Policeman said:

Maybe the 307 coming every 15-20 mins cuz i think the 90 runs every 10-25 mins

90 runs 20 mins on off peak hour and weekends and then more like 10-15 mins during rush hour

[ChicagoNova]

12 minutes ago, Erin Mishkin Jr. said:

I think 307 is long enough it doesn’t need an extension. 90 is a key route so cutting a key route may not be a good idea. 90 is my main route most of the time I get off at grand sometimes it’s crowded after grand but then chills once we pass grand SB.

 

lake street is too narrow for artics as lake is a single lane street between Harlem and forest ave and an artic would be a big problem there

Actually North Blvd.

[NewFlyerMCI]

15 minutes ago, Erin Mishkin Jr. said:

I think 307 is long enough it doesn’t need an extension. 90 is a key route so cutting a key route may not be a good idea. 90 is my main route most of the time I get off at grand sometimes it’s crowded after grand but then chills once we pass grand SB.

Long for a Pace route isn't the same as long for a CTA route. The 307 takes about half an hour or less to go from BTC to Harlem/Lake, aided by the fact that there are portions of the southern end of the route that don't have any stops. There aren't a lot of CTA routes that can cover a comparable distance (71st to Lake) in that same time. The biggest impediment to the schedule are the two at-grade railroad crossings, which in fairness, do close with regularity.

Reading what you said again, I think you missed my point here. What I proposed doesn't reduce service along Harlem, it just gives it all to Pace. The alignment should change so that all 307 buses serve btwn 71st & Grand and then they either go to Elmwood or Harlem-O'Hare, along with 1-2 additional buses to maintain current headways that exist now btwn the 90/307/318. Service levels stay the same, and riders get more access to points south of Lake, such as the bulk mail center, North Riverside Mall, the businesses in Bedford Park, etc.

Also, until CTA released the methodology into what they consider Key vs Support, I don't put much stock in that lol. The 3, 6 & 56 are all listed as support routes, but if there was even a hint of phasing those out, it'd be met with swift opposition and no support lol. The 90 is a "key" route, but can barely get up to 15 mins headways during peak? 

[artthouwill]

1 hour ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

Long for a Pace route isn't the same as long for a CTA route. The 307 takes about half an hour or less to go from BTC to Harlem/Lake, aided by the fact that there are portions of the southern end of the route that don't have any stops. There aren't a lot of CTA routes that can cover a comparable distance (71st to Lake) in that same time. The biggest impediment to the schedule are the two at-grade railroad crossings, which in fairness, do close with regularity.

Reading what you said again, I think you missed my point here. What I proposed doesn't reduce service along Harlem, it just gives it all to Pace. The alignment should change so that all 307 buses serve btwn 71st & Grand and then they either go to Elmwood or Harlem-O'Hare, along with 1-2 additional buses to maintain current headways that exist now btwn the 90/307/318. Service levels stay the same, and riders get more access to points south of Lake, such as the bulk mail center, North Riverside Mall, the businesses in Bedford Park, etc.

Also, until CTA released the methodology into what they consider Key vs Support, I don't put much stock in that lol. The 3, 6 & 56 are all listed as support routes, but if there was even a hint of phasing those out, it'd be met with swift opposition and no support lol. The 90 is a "key" route, but can barely get up to 15 mins headways during peak? 

I wouldn't give it all to Pace, but I do think Pace could supplement.   The 307 is the best option.  Perhaps Pace could run buses between 71st and Grand and between Ogden and Norridge or O'Hare Harlem Blue Line.

Another option could extend the 78 south to Grand/Nordica  during daytime hours. But observation shows me that the 90 starts filling up from Lawrence and is full by Irving Park,  which would make the 307 extension to Harlem/Higgins the best option.  I wouldn't mind late evening service being handled exclusively by Pace.

[NewFlyerMCI]

32 minutes ago, artthouwill said:

I wouldn't give it all to Pace, but I do think Pace could supplement.   The 307 is the best option.  Perhaps Pace could run buses between 71st and Grand and between Ogden and Norridge or O'Hare Harlem Blue Line.

Another option could extend the 78 south to Grand/Nordica  during daytime hours. But observation shows me that the 90 starts filling up from Lawrence and is full by Irving Park,  which would make the 307 extension to Harlem/Higgins the best option.  I wouldn't mind late evening service being handled exclusively by Pace.

I think that the 78 being extended would only work if people are trying to get to the train and not Oak Park.

If the 307 is going to be extended to Harlem-O'Hare, would a 386/63W (or in this case, I guess it'd be closer to 8A/108/352) set up be the best solution with the 307 making limited stops north of Lake (or Grand?) at major intersections/transfers.

[artthouwill]

51 minutes ago, NewFlyerMCI said:

I think that the 78 being extended would only work if people are trying to get to the train and not Oak Park.

If the 307 is going to be extended to Harlem-O'Hare, would a 386/63W (or in this case, I guess it'd be closer to 8A/108/352) set up be the best solution with the 307 making limited stops north of Lake (or Grand?) at major intersections/transfers.

The 2 main reasons I suggested the 78 are that it could help the 90 along the busiest portion of its route and that there's a terminal at Grand where the 74 terminates and the 90 used to terminate there.  Most people north of Grand don't travel south of North Ave.

I also gave a slight thought to extending the 423 south to Grand,  but it doesn't have the frequency necessary nor does it use 40 ft buses .

Perhaps the Blue Line is a stretch for the 307, but certainly an extension to Norridge Commons could help as it is near to Harlem and Irving Plaza.

[Shannoncvpi]

Whats up with 1551 still being at C with brand new rims & all saw it pulling out of C this morning no wrap no nothing 

[Mr.NewFlyer1051]

@YoungBusLoverdo you know when we can expect these moves between 4000’s and 1000’s to happen i suspect it’s gonna be the weekend when the winter pick starts but when is that?